A long time ago someone explained to me there are different types of state records.
- In track, one type of state record has to be set at the state meet.
- there are state “resident” state records. Fastest by a Californian anywhere (including outside the state), for example. Colorado resident records are probably often set at low elevation.
- there are “soil” records. Fastest by anyone on the soil in that state.
I’m not sure if there is also a set of records defined as soil + you have to live in the state too. Maybe?
201 speed rating for Jackson. German would’ve been sub 13:55.
Speed ratings should absolutely not be used to compare across eras. It is a massively flawed system. If this is a 201, there’s no chance we’ll ever see anything 207+ ever again. Unless people genuinely believe cross country runners peaked 20-30 years ago and no one will ever come close to that level again this system must be discredited.
The highest performance in recent memory is Nico Young’s 205 at NXN. He took down a stacked field. The guy who beat Virgins record (which LV and Chris Derrick failed to do) lost by 14 seconds, and it’s not like he had a bad day like some top guys have recently (L+L, Powell, etc.), Nico was just that much better.
There are probably 60 guys who have got a 205+ rating from 1990-2012, and since then it’s become borderline impossible. I don’t know about you, but I don’t think Nico Young’s run at NXN is outside the top 50 hsxc performances ever.
Spencer takes 8 seconds off a record that only all time greats have even come within 5 seconds of, and he barely cracks 200?
This is an interesting critique for certain. The caliber of very high speed ratings has certainly fallen drastically really since Futsum/Cheserek over 10 years ago.
All-time CR is 14:14.57 by Diego Estrada/32 from 2022's Miguel Reyes Elite/Fun Run/Walk held that August. 2nd place was Kasey Knevelbard/25 in 14:20.73. 3rd was CJ Albertson in 14:29.67.
Thought German's 14:24.0 might last another 15 - 20 years given it survived the onslaught of fast times from the Newbury Park boys. Especially so since many of the CA State Meet winners hold back a bit to save something for the following week's NXN or FL West meets. Unlike German, who went all-out at the 2007 CA State Meet and collapsed at the end.
This past weekend's Clovis Invite benefited from a perfect storm of circumstances: excellent weather for distance running -- unusually cool for Fresno early October -- coupled with the best boy in the nation coming in from out-of-state.
In 2024 we saw Mitch Kingery's 51-year-old Crystal Springs CR broken -- by a little.
Now, we have German Fernandez's 17-year-old Woodward Park CR broken -- by a lot.
Given these circumstances, together with the 14:16.9 being only 2.5 seconds off the all-time CR set by a seasoned professional, believe Jackson's Spencer's record will last until mid-century if not longer.
Note: on the female side, Ceci Hopp/Stanford ran 16:03 for the all-time CR back in 1982. Sadie Englehardt ran 16:24.2 at last year's Clovis Invite for the HS record. Certainly could envision Englehardt's record taken down under 16:20 sometime within the next 10 years or so, especially if another Melody Fairchild, Katelyn Tuohy or Jane Hedengren come along and run Clovis or the CA State Meet.
All-time CR is 14:14.57 by Diego Estrada/32 from 2022's Miguel Reyes Elite/Fun Run/Walk held that August. 2nd place was Kasey Knevelbard/25 in 14:20.73. 3rd was CJ Albertson in 14:29.67.
Thought German's 14:24.0 might last another 15 - 20 years given it survived the onslaught of fast times from the Newbury Park boys. Especially so since many of the CA State Meet winners hold back a bit to save something for the following week's NXN or FL West meets. Unlike German, who went all-out at the 2007 CA State Meet and collapsed at the end.
This past weekend's Clovis Invite benefited from a perfect storm of circumstances: excellent weather for distance running -- unusually cool for Fresno early October -- coupled with the best boy in the nation coming in from out-of-state.
In 2024 we saw Mitch Kingery's 51-year-old Crystal Springs CR broken -- by a little.
Now, we have German Fernandez's 17-year-old Woodward Park CR broken -- by a lot.
Given these circumstances, together with the 14:16.9 being only 2.5 seconds off the all-time CR set by a seasoned professional, believe Jackson's Spencer's record will last until mid-century if not longer.
Note: on the female side, Ceci Hopp/Stanford ran 16:03 for the all-time CR back in 1982. Sadie Englehardt ran 16:24.2 at last year's Clovis Invite for the HS record. Certainly could envision Englehardt's record taken down under 16:20 sometime within the next 10 years or so, especially if another Melody Fairchild, Katelyn Tuohy or Jane Hedengren come along and run Clovis or the CA State Meet.
All-time CR is 14:14.57 by Diego Estrada/32 from 2022's Miguel Reyes Elite/Fun Run/Walk held that August. 2nd place was Kasey Knevelbard/25 in 14:20.73. 3rd was CJ Albertson in 14:29.67.
Thought German's 14:24.0 might last another 15 - 20 years given it survived the onslaught of fast times from the Newbury Park boys. Especially so since many of the CA State Meet winners hold back a bit to save something for the following week's NXN or FL West meets. Unlike German, who went all-out at the 2007 CA State Meet and collapsed at the end.
This past weekend's Clovis Invite benefited from a perfect storm of circumstances: excellent weather for distance running -- unusually cool for Fresno early October -- coupled with the best boy in the nation coming in from out-of-state.
In 2024 we saw Mitch Kingery's 51-year-old Crystal Springs CR broken -- by a little.
Now, we have German Fernandez's 17-year-old Woodward Park CR broken -- by a lot.
Given these circumstances, together with the 14:16.9 being only 2.5 seconds off the all-time CR set by a seasoned professional, believe Jackson's Spencer's record will last until mid-century if not longer.
Note: on the female side, Ceci Hopp/Stanford ran 16:03 for the all-time CR back in 1982. Sadie Englehardt ran 16:24.2 at last year's Clovis Invite for the HS record. Certainly could envision Englehardt's record taken down under 16:20 sometime within the next 10 years or so, especially if another Melody Fairchild, Katelyn Tuohy or Jane Hedengren come along and run Clovis or the CA State Meet.
Knevelbard would end up running 3:34/13:15 that spring. Should be interesting to see what Spencer ends up doing.
He is going to BYU per his Instagram and Strava. Took down Fernandez's course record, not state record since he's from Utah. Very impressive! Can he have a historic season and win nxn too?
He is going to BYU per his Instagram and Strava. Took down Fernandez's course record, not state record since he's from Utah. Very impressive! Can he have a historic season and win nxn too?
If he wins nxn, he would be the first ever individual nxn champion for Doug Soles
Also want to note Jackson's race was recorded for youtube with a vehicle right in front on him almost the entire time. They had this vehicle very close to him up front. I suspect that gave Jackson some pacing help and maybe even drafting. Neither of which German had.
Also want to note Jackson's race was recorded for youtube with a vehicle right in front on him almost the entire time. They had this vehicle very close to him up front. I suspect that gave Jackson some pacing help and maybe even drafting. Neither of which German had.
Also want to note Jackson's race was recorded for youtube with a vehicle right in front on him almost the entire time. They had this vehicle very close to him up front. I suspect that gave Jackson some pacing help and maybe even drafting. Neither of which German had.
I consider pacing help like this cheating (for records purposes).
If you watch other videos you will see the cycle is 12-15 feet or more in front of him the whole time, the camera is just locked in on the leaders. This is no different than the golf carts used in most meets for filming and leading the way. No advantage given there unless every college race now needs to be thrown out as well. The best advantage Jackson had was Maximo Z pushing him would be my guess. Maximo is a monsta
Man that 2022 a graveyard of talent.. anyone who says girls fall of the face of the earth after high school just needs to follow boys high school running.. guess jury is still out on some of these guys -
1 Aaron SAHLMAN 12 NEWBURY PARK 14:44.5 204.17 204 Injured for 2 years
2 Daniel SIMMONS 11 AMERICAN FORK 14:51.7 201.77 202 Back from mission soon
4 Kole MATHISON 12 MIDWEST-5 14:55.5 200.50 201 14:13 5k and 41st at Big 12s
5 Jackson HEIDESCH 12 HEARTLAND-3 14:55.5 200.50 201 Haven't seen any results @Duke
6 Simeon BIRNBAUM 12 HEARTLAND-1 14:55.5 200.50 201 Has run 3:52 @Oregon
7 Noah BREKER 12 HEARTLAND-2 14:55.9 200.37 200 3rd at U20s, 14:19 and 29:41
8 Weston BROWN 12 NORTHWEST-2 14:56.4 200.20 200 4:07 mile and 202nd at NCAAs
9 Benne ANDERSON 12 MIDWEST-2 14:57.2 199.93 200 3:54 and 91st at NCAAs
10 Hunter JONES 12 MIDWEST-4 14:57.6 199.80 200 51st at ACCs
11 Leo YOUNG 12 NEWBURY PARK 14:58.2 199.60 200 92nd at NCAAs and 3:35
12 Byron GREVIOUS 11 NORTHEAST-3 15:00.9 198.70 199 127th at Gans Creek in 2025
13 Matthew DONIS 12 CALIFORNIA-2 15:04.3 197.57 198 7th at U20s in 2023. No races since 2024 track
14 Tayson ECHOHAWK 12 SOUTHWEST-2 15:05.7 197.10 197 210th at NCAAs and 3:58
15 Devan KIPYEGO 12 NORTHEAST-4 15:11.2 195.27 195 93rd at NCAAs and 3:54
Not great, not terrible. Keep in mind these are just off Athletic.net and I might be missing some races. Quite a few injuries in this group and the juniors haven't had any time to really get rolling in college
More specifically, the purpose of combating dust caused by the golfcart/motorcycle broadcast -- although I would assume packing a soft surface into a harder one would help improve times as a side effect.
It seems like every broadcast now needs this type of live-feed to keep up the viewer expectations. For grass courses its no problem, but for dusty courses, the lead vehicle can kick up dust right into 1st place's face. See the NxR SE regional 2024 vs 2023 where there was no lead-vehicle feed.
I expect watering the course to become the norm on dirt courses to address dust issues while still keeping the lead-vehicle broadcast. If more dirt courses are watered this year we may start to get enough samples to tease out the effect of watering on runner's time savings -- or someone can run a controlled experiment to test this.
My guess is time-savings are certainly under 2 seconds per mile even on the dustiest dirt courses. Props to Spencer for being a beast.
At Clovis, the liquid was some kind of glue concoction that didn't evaporate. And it gave me good traction as that surface was sticky. You could smell the chemical in that concoction. Very little dust unless I go off the surface then dusts start flying.
I consider pacing help like this cheating (for records purposes).
Bro - you can't pace off my bike cam. Why not?
1. I maintain a consistent gap so that if you slow down, I slow down, if you speed up, I speed up.
2. I move to the left side or right side to get different angles of shots.
3. At 4 different points on the course I take off (35 mph) to get a 100m lead so that I can jump the curb. This will ruin your ability to pace me.
4. That ebike does not have a speedometer so I have no idea what the pace was.
5. Runners learn quickly to run their pace and not pace off the ebike because of points 1-3. That ebike is capable of 45 mph on flat and 25 mph up Reservoir Hills so no way they can catch me.
BTW - the amazing thing was Jackson doesn't wear a Garmin watch so his pace was all internal.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
Reason provided:
forgot a point.