So, I actually didn't think this was that bad? Just rewatched the race and I thought Goucher did a solid job with the color commentary.
1. In the first lap she sets up the dynamic between the racing styles of Nuguse and Hocker well.
2. Lap 2, quickly calls out that Hocker is giving Nuguse too much space already. Also gives us a good 8 seconds of context on Wightman.
3. Lap 3, solid context on the Frenchman Habz, who is probably an unknown for most viewers. Let's us know he's the real deal.
Yeah, they got tunnel visioned on Nuguse and missed the move by Laros. But like Gault's article said, that should have been called out by the spotter so Diffey could go to it as things got tight. I don't love this commentary team, but at least they get excited and are competent.
Diffey in particular is just not to my taste. I thought Paul Swangard did a really good job on the Millrose call this year, I wish he got the high profile outdoor stuff.
you're right, but you'll never win on this site. Needless to say, men who hate women rarely admit that they hate women. Trump is a great example. Cue all the idiots who are now going to say that Kara -- a multi-time Olympian and world championship medalist by the way -- lied about Alberto because she is an attention-seeker or...sh-t, I don't even know what ridiculous things they say were her supposed motivations
Nobody is talking crap about Kara. She is not a very good broadcaster. It is OK. She is probably good at many other things. Just because I am not a fan of hearing her broadcast a track meet doesn’t make me a woman hater. I don’t like Trump but does that mean I hate all mankind?
So, I actually didn't think this was that bad? Just rewatched the race and I thought Goucher did a solid job with the color commentary.
1. In the first lap she sets up the dynamic between the racing styles of Nuguse and Hocker well.
2. Lap 2, quickly calls out that Hocker is giving Nuguse too much space already. Also gives us a good 8 seconds of context on Wightman.
3. Lap 3, solid context on the Frenchman Habz, who is probably an unknown for most viewers. Let's us know he's the real deal.
Yeah, they got tunnel visioned on Nuguse and missed the move by Laros. But like Gault's article said, that should have been called out by the spotter so Diffey could go to it as things got tight. I don't love this commentary team, but at least they get excited and are competent.
Diffey in particular is just not to my taste. I thought Paul Swangard did a really good job on the Millrose call this year, I wish he got the high profile outdoor stuff.
you're right, but you'll never win on this site. Needless to say, men who hate women rarely admit that they hate women. Trump is a great example. Cue all the idiots who are now going to say that Kara -- a multi-time Olympian and world championship medalist by the way -- lied about Alberto because she is an attention-seeker or...sh-t, I don't even know what ridiculous things they say were her supposed motivations
See my handle. Why is it that you people respond to any legitimate criticism by accusing the critic of hating a class of people? It makes you look like an idiot.
I don't think this is a Kara problem. It's an industry/NBC problem. They trained her & have a playbook they want her to run with. Plus we don't know what streams/camera angles they were watching in real time. All sports commentating seems to be focused on being as boring as possible/not allowing yourself to get excited or take sides.
I don't think this is a Kara problem. It's an industry/NBC problem. They trained her & have a playbook they want her to run with. Plus we don't know what streams/camera angles they were watching in real time. All sports commentating seems to be focused on being as boring as possible/not allowing yourself to get excited or take sides.
Kara is clearly part of the problem, but you are correct that the problem goes way beyond her. If they replaced Kara with someone better, the broadcast is better but still not great.
Why do we always have to go to, "it's because she's a woman, or "it's because of the color of his skin?" If you read this thread, you know that many people think Goucher is not good and Hannah England is great. This has nothing to do with misongyny. It's about wanting to hear a quality broadcast. They get them in Britain, why can't get them here?
Hannah England has really been outstanding as a presenter. What amazes me is that these middle distance-oriented people do an equally great job with the field events too.
I'm by no means a massive fan of the NBC crew, but we can all at least agree that they are an improvement over Dwight Stones, right? He is truly unbearable to listen to.
Why do we always have to go to, "it's because she's a woman, or "it's because of the color of his skin?" If you read this thread, you know that many people think Goucher is not good and Hannah England is great. This has nothing to do with misongyny. It's about wanting to hear a quality broadcast. They get them in Britain, why can't get them here?
Hannah England has really been outstanding as a presenter. What amazes me is that these middle distance-oriented people do an equally great job with the field events too.
England is not good. Not good at all. Goucher has been solid.
I have been a track and field athlete, coach, and now announcer. It is not as easy as some might think. I listen to all the broadcasts from small meets to Diamond League events and learn from them. To me, the best broadcasts are ones that convey simply knowledge and do so with interest and excitement. In the U.S. I believe that Ato Bolden for sprints, Dwight Stones for jumps, Tre Hardee for throws, and Paul Swangard for general commentary are competent. While I don't mind Carrie Tollefson I agree that she is too "my sh&^%t doesn't stink" oriented. Other than those individuals the best track and field announcers in the U.S. are ones that do collegiate meets. Just as example, Mike Jay is a world-class announcer who takes his professional seriously. There are others. But compared to Hannah England, Tim Hutchings, Chris Dennis, Phil Winchell, Steve Cram everyone in the US is second-rate. What the hell don't the announcers in the US learn from the European announcers? I listen intently to all the broadcast of the British/European announcers and learn from them. I know that when announcing a meet I prepare at least 30 hours of research for it. The British folks do as well. There is no way that most of the US NBC-type announcers to that. Hell, as has been said before they have no idea of who is actually running in a race. The bottom line is that NBC/CBS/ESPN do not care about track and field.
I have been a track and field athlete, coach, and now announcer. It is not as easy as some might think. I listen to all the broadcasts from small meets to Diamond League events and learn from them. To me, the best broadcasts are ones that convey simply knowledge and do so with interest and excitement. In the U.S. I believe that Ato Bolden for sprints, Dwight Stones for jumps, Tre Hardee for throws, and Paul Swangard for general commentary are competent. While I don't mind Carrie Tollefson I agree that she is too "my sh&^%t doesn't stink" oriented. Other than those individuals the best track and field announcers in the U.S. are ones that do collegiate meets. Just as example, Mike Jay is a world-class announcer who takes his professional seriously. There are others. But compared to Hannah England, Tim Hutchings, Chris Dennis, Phil Winchell, Steve Cram everyone in the US is second-rate. What the hell don't the announcers in the US learn from the European announcers? I listen intently to all the broadcast of the British/European announcers and learn from them. I know that when announcing a meet I prepare at least 30 hours of research for it. The British folks do as well. There is no way that most of the US NBC-type announcers to that. Hell, as has been said before they have no idea of who is actually running in a race. The bottom line is that NBC/CBS/ESPN do not care about track and field.
30 hours??? Are you Cris Collinsworth calling a 3 hour NFL game? He has to know 22 positions, of which 5-6 are active per play. That deserves 30 hours of prep work. Are you the main commentator? If so, aren't you looking to hand-off a set of events to the designated "expert" for each event? For example; Kara covers 800, 1500/Mile, 3000 steeple, 3000/5000, and 10,000m for both men and women. Maybe there will be 3-5 athletes worth talking about during a race at most. She should a have a cheat sheet with basic information for each athlete which includes club affiliation, coach, college affiliation, hometown, and outstanding accolades. This stuff is literally "fluff" information that requires no talent to read off. IMO, the quality of "How" the information is conveyed and presented to the viewing audience is what differentiates a great broadcaster from a bad one. Having elite experience in the event(s) is a HUGE requirement, and it must be integrated into the race commentary like telling a story. Kara's issue is that she's not a "story teller", she simply regurgitates what happening in the race, and gets WAY TOO emotional when things get hot.
I agree that the British broadcasting is top notch. Commentators with experience and knowledge, including a personality that allows for a great presentation.
I recall Merber and Tolleffson doing the NCAA XC championships and it seemed to me they knew all of the runners of all of the top teams. Not all 31 teams by any means but certainly the top 5 or so.
I don't think this is a Kara problem. It's an industry/NBC problem. They trained her & have a playbook they want her to run with. Plus we don't know what streams/camera angles they were watching in real time. All sports commentating seems to be focused on being as boring as possible/not allowing yourself to get excited or take sides.
Kara is fine. It's indeed an industry problem on American television where they don't want color commentators stepping over the play by play guy, even when obvious mistakes are being made.
Kara Goucher knows all about Niels Laros. She sees him coming. But she didn't feel confident enough to interrupt Leigh Diffey and interject that Laros might steal it from the rail. It was very similar to Dwight Stones totally screwing up the NCAA women's 4 x 100 final with Dan O'Brien etc. keeping quiet as Stones insisted South Carolina was leading instead of USC.
I don't buy the spotter excuse. These guys aren't like thoroughbred race callers using binoculars to pick out specific silks while calling their 12th race of the day. In that situation you might miss a horse flying through on the rail. It has happened numerous times.
But the track races feature distinct body types and running tendencies. The commentators have the live view and access to monitors smack in front of them. If you do even a minimum amount of preparation you'll know who everybody is and when they are likely to move. Leigh Diffey may know that in auto racing but he's totally overwhelmed and unconcerned regarding track races. In each race he shows up knowing the top one to three favorites. As long as they go round and round together he's fine.
Anything else he's stumped, unless he happens to remember names from years gone by. For example, he began at NBC in 2021. Nakaayi was world 800 champion from Doha 2019. He prepared to use that name and doesn't really care that Nakaayi hasn't been a huge factor since 2019. If Leigh Diffey is calling a women's 800 race, you'll get plenty of Halimah Nakaayi references regardless of how she is faring.
in this day and age of the 2 second attention span, moral degeneration, need for cheap thrills, heartless social media, i am very surprised that a live track and field was sold out and rocking.
also, the most popular things on the internet are 2 hour discussions on podcasts.
which kind of blows the attention span theory out of the water, though it's very generally true..
also, the young athletes, are very impressive in speech and performance.
these things are better than my former generation. we over rate ourselves, it was the three generations before now that was near the peak, of invention, economic sensibility, average physique, etc.
thats what i think of,
this snapshot of the younger generation demonstrates some superior qualities that imply the human race might survive, that said, the average masses are truly in bad shape, too far gone.
in this day and age of the 2 second attention span, moral degeneration, need for cheap thrills, heartless social media, i am very surprised that a live track and field was sold out and rocking.
also, the most popular things on the internet are 2 hour discussions on podcasts.
which kind of blows the attention span theory out of the water, though it's very generally true..
also, the young athletes, are very impressive in speech and performance.
these things are better than my former generation. we over rate ourselves, it was the three generations before now that was near the peak, of invention, economic sensibility, average physique, etc.
thats what i think of,
this snapshot of the younger generation demonstrates some superior qualities that imply the human race might survive, that said, the average masses are truly in bad shape, too far gone.
Drinking again? I am not sure you addressed the broadcast at all. Kara Goucher and Lee Diffey might be better off handing the baton to someone who actually might be engaging and/or possess a modicum of competence.