I'm very curious to see what she thinks she deserves vs what she's actually worth. Somehow I think she believes she's worth near 6 figures per year, while she's probably not even $10,000.
Her quote sounds a bit smug. It wasn't just her - she was part of a talented recruiting class that did well within the conference:
“As a former student-athlete who has single-handedly helped to uplift the Penn program, I am extremely disappointed,” Whittaker, a 2024 College graduate, said in a written statement to the DP. “Ivy League schools are under the impression that they can take, use, and reuse their athletes and give them nothing in return.”
I agree your stance, but the Department of Education statement relates to payments directly from the school. So the $20mm in revenue share, they say, should be split. I don’t think they can force a private company to pay both genders equally.
Biden’s DOE claimed that even 3rd party nil falls under title IX.
What we are trying to tell you is that the 4:00-4:10 kids do their research on their options and make their school choice. Most try to get an athletic scholarship at a non Ivy, others are drawn to the lower cost of State schools.
In the case of Graham Blanks and Maja Ramsden, Harvard lucked into fast kids with families eager to pay full tuition, so their kids could get an excellent Harvard education. Running smoothed the path to their admission and Harvard now has 2 ncaa champs and Olympians.
They don't get many of this type of runner, however, as most of the fastest kids either can't qualify academically even with a boost, or are unwilling to pay more to attend Harvard than their other options.
I get what you and several others are trying to tell me and for all I know you're all correct. But what you all are trying to tell me more or less contradicts what I was told by someone I know to have been an actual coach who occasionally recruited against Harvard. I certainly think he could have been wrong, that I could have misunderstood him, that the discussion was so long ago that I don't remember it correctly, or maybe some combination of all that.
But I actually knew who this guy was and that when he said he occasionally wanted the same kid as Harvard did he couldn't match Harvard's financial package it was something that actually happened. I don't know who anyone on this thread is, what they know, and how they know it. So I asked the guy who says he was a coach at an Ivy school if there was ever a time when he wanted a kid who wanted to go to his school but didn't because his family couldn't afford to. It's a simple question but the only answer to it I've seen so far is from someone who seems to have had a kid who could have gone to an Ivy but went somewhere else because he got a scholarship. I appreciate the response but the guy posting it didn't say they couldn't afford to go to the Ivy but that it made more sense to them for the kid to go where there was a scholarship. I think that's something that makes perfect sense, by the way.
The Ivy League schools share a tradition of academic excellence and broad-based, successful NCAA Division I athletics. The Ivy League annually finishes among the
What we are trying to tell you is that the 4:00-4:10 kids do their research on their options and make their school choice. Most try to get an athletic scholarship at a non Ivy, others are drawn to the lower cost of State schools.
In the case of Graham Blanks and Maja Ramsden, Harvard lucked into fast kids with families eager to pay full tuition, so their kids could get an excellent Harvard education. Running smoothed the path to their admission and Harvard now has 2 ncaa champs and Olympians.
They don't get many of this type of runner, however, as most of the fastest kids either can't qualify academically even with a boost, or are unwilling to pay more to attend Harvard than their other options.
I get what you and several others are trying to tell me and for all I know you're all correct. But what you all are trying to tell me more or less contradicts what I was told by someone I know to have been an actual coach who occasionally recruited against Harvard. I certainly think he could have been wrong, that I could have misunderstood him, that the discussion was so long ago that I don't remember it correctly, or maybe some combination of all that.
But I actually knew who this guy was and that when he said he occasionally wanted the same kid as Harvard did he couldn't match Harvard's financial package it was something that actually happened. I don't know who anyone on this thread is, what they know, and how they know it. So I asked the guy who says he was a coach at an Ivy school if there was ever a time when he wanted a kid who wanted to go to his school but didn't because his family couldn't afford to. It's a simple question but the only answer to it I've seen so far is from someone who seems to have had a kid who could have gone to an Ivy but went somewhere else because he got a scholarship. I appreciate the response but the guy posting it didn't say they couldn't afford to go to the Ivy but that it made more sense to them for the kid to go where there was a scholarship. I think that's something that makes perfect sense, by the way.
You don't have to take the word of the many posters on this thread, the ivy league schools are quite transparent about how paying for the schools work. Here's Harvard's website (
100% need-based aid. We base aid awards on need, not on merit. This means that financial aid supports the students who will benefit from it the most. Furthermore, we meet 100 percent of our students' demonstrated financial need.
No. I am one of those people with a modest income who never spent any money but saved instead. I don't have a pension. I have parents who I started taking care of. My savings won't carry me through until my death. I have 15 year old cars. I have a small house worth $200K. I can't spare money for college but the Ivies told me that I can pay full fare because I have savings.
Robert said that is how it works when he was at Cornell. Honestly you're better off at Ivies not saving in terms of getting more financial aid.
Not very accurate really.
A family earning $200k/year with 3 million in a 401k, 2 mil in home equity, and 200k in taxable savings will be expected to pay $27,500 per year at Princeton. Only 5% of additional nonretirement savings would be considered available for college (so every extra 100k saved would add only 5-6k per year in costs.
So I don’t know what Ivy man considers modest income, or how much was saved on that modest salary, or if he even has any experience with Ivy recruiting, but most people are not better off avoiding saving because the financial aid is pretty good either way.
You picked a school that doesn't consider home equity. I just entered some quick info in Yale's NPC. $200K salary. $100K in savings. $500K in investments. $750K in home equity.
Yale price = $79,000.
Even you example is silly. Anyone who has that much saved in theor 401k, will have savings, stocks, mutual funds, etc in addition to their home and retirement savings. If they have $1M saved outside of retirement, that adds $50K yearly to the cost at Princeton.
I get what you and several others are trying to tell me and for all I know you're all correct. But what you all are trying to tell me more or less contradicts what I was told by someone I know to have been an actual coach who occasionally recruited against Harvard. I certainly think he could have been wrong, that I could have misunderstood him, that the discussion was so long ago that I don't remember it correctly, or maybe some combination of all that.
But I actually knew who this guy was and that when he said he occasionally wanted the same kid as Harvard did he couldn't match Harvard's financial package it was something that actually happened. I don't know who anyone on this thread is, what they know, and how they know it. So I asked the guy who says he was a coach at an Ivy school if there was ever a time when he wanted a kid who wanted to go to his school but didn't because his family couldn't afford to. It's a simple question but the only answer to it I've seen so far is from someone who seems to have had a kid who could have gone to an Ivy but went somewhere else because he got a scholarship. I appreciate the response but the guy posting it didn't say they couldn't afford to go to the Ivy but that it made more sense to them for the kid to go where there was a scholarship. I think that's something that makes perfect sense, by the way.
You don't have to take the word of the many posters on this thread, the ivy league schools are quite transparent about how paying for the schools work. Here's Harvard's website (), which notably says:
100% need-based aid. We base aid awards on need, not on merit. This means that financial aid supports the students who will benefit from it the most. Furthermore, we meet 100 percent of our students' demonstrated financial need.
Thank you. I'm done. I still think that there can be some wiggle room when a school talks about "demonstrated" financial need but you'd have be in on the process as it unfolds.
You don't have to take the word of the many posters on this thread, the ivy league schools are quite transparent about how paying for the schools work. Here's Harvard's website (), which notably says:
100% need-based aid. We base aid awards on need, not on merit. This means that financial aid supports the students who will benefit from it the most. Furthermore, we meet 100 percent of our students' demonstrated financial need.
Thank you. I'm done. I still think that there can be some wiggle room when a school talks about "demonstrated" financial need but you'd have be in on the process as it unfolds.
Appreciate that you're done but I can't help myself from replying one more time - there is no wiggle room. The schools use a formula for financial aid that gets applied to all students the same - it doesn't matter if you've run sub 4 in the mile, cured a disease, or are the kid of a Senator. All those things matter for whether or not the schools admit you, but have no bearing on how much your tuition is.
That is correct. But he doesn't believe you or me or coach Robert Johnson or even the entire Ivy League itself because he had one person tell him something a long time ago.
Try again. $175K income. $1M in SEP IRA. $200K home equity. $1.2M in mutual funds. $125K in savings. I am worth less than 1/2 of what you are and I earn less but have to pay 3 times as much.
You picked a school that doesn't consider home equity. I just entered some quick info in Yale's NPC. $200K salary. $100K in savings. $500K in investments. $750K in home equity.
Yale price = $79,000.
Even you example is silly. Anyone who has that much saved in theor 401k, will have savings, stocks, mutual funds, etc in addition to their home and retirement savings. If they have $1M saved outside of retirement, that adds $50K yearly to the cost at Princeton.
Ivy schools match. So an athlete recruited at Princeton would get the same package at Yale or Cornell or…
As for the savings profile, not sure you’re correct. That level of salary while maxing retirement contributions over the years (401k+roth) wouldn’t have left much more for taxable savings (which would be suboptimal anyway). If it did, then a megabackdoor Roth should be considered.
Try again. $175K income. $1M in SEP IRA. $200K home equity. $1.2M in mutual funds. $125K in savings. I am worth less than 1/2 of what you are and I earn less but have to pay 3 times as much.
But that’s an issue of your having saved in the wrong places, not “saved too much”. You would have benefited from sheltering more of your income and assets in retirement accounts. The SEP would be ignored but you’d have been better off with the mutual funds in a retirement account or home equity. The other $125k savings is below the threshold where it would even count as available.
Yes. It happens all the time. So much so that we bring it up on the first call, direct families to online calculators, and circle back to see if the numbers are something they want to continue ahead with. I got a message from a very good runner last week saying they were moving on to focus on non Ivy options because the financial aid was not a fit for their college goals.
Many, many of the recruits who I reach out to fall to the wayside early on due to either grades or cost. Inversely, a lot who email or DM us directly already know their grades are solid enough and they are willing to potentially pay the price. Then we just have to see if a P5 doesn’t come along and offer enough to entice them away from us. Or worse, if they pick a different Ivy.
Ivy should eliminate all college teams and go private. We needed college sports in the 1600s when settlers arrived illiterate with no underwear. Now 40% of the US population has a college degree. They should allow coaches to form for-profit teams, and rent university facilities to get started.
Yes. It happens all the time. So much so that we bring it up on the first call, direct families to online calculators, and circle back to see if the numbers are something they want to continue ahead with. I got a message from a very good runner last week saying they were moving on to focus on non Ivy options because the financial aid was not a fit for their college goals.
Many, many of the recruits who I reach out to fall to the wayside early on due to either grades or cost. Inversely, a lot who email or DM us directly already know their grades are solid enough and they are willing to potentially pay the price. Then we just have to see if a P5 doesn’t come along and offer enough to entice them away from us. Or worse, if they pick a different Ivy.
Ivy should eliminate all college teams and go private. We needed college sports in the 1600s when settlers arrived illiterate with no underwear. Now 40% of the US population has a college degree. They should allow coaches to form for-profit teams, and rent university facilities to get started.
The Ivy's (and the service Academies) are the epitome of what the student athlete and college experience should be at the purest level. True four year programs that retain 96% of their incoming Freshman through graduation, no redshirts, no 23 year old Freshman, no pressure to produce revenue to survive, and athletes who actually get no academic favoritism in the classroom. And their programs are not affected by the current events playing out in NCAA D1 programs right now. They still have high level athletes who go to the Olympic (and medal), and they are well educated and they end up as successful leaders in business, law, and politics. And the competition, meets, games and matches between the schools within the league is fierce and very well attended by rabid alumni fan support. Those alumni also help endow the 10s of Billions in endowment that help fund the athletic programs free from revenue generating pressure and the current NIL grab affecting P4s and other D1s. Again, the Ivy's are the epitome of what it should be.
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