She missed two Olympics. Her prime years. No consequences?
That’s beside the point. The point being she should just let it go and do something else. Life isn’t just all about elite sport. What does she want to prove?
Past a certain level, life is about elite sports. Should Mahomes have become a dentist instead of playing in the NFL?
Disagree, an athlete caught doping should be banned for life and stripped of all titles and medals. At this point I don’t even know why an elite athlete, particularly if they’re on the bubble for making teams/ medaling, wouldn’t cheat. You probably won’t ever get caught, and even if you do, you still keep all the money you made and can just get a real job after a minor punishment and some hate on Instagram. Honestly, you can just skip tests and make up a ridiculous excuse for why and never face any consequences.
She missed two Olympics. Her prime years. No consequences?
Those are not consequences. It is the same outcome if she had not doped. If she competed as a clean athlete, she would not have made either of those Olympic teams.
I am also free to not support or respect her as an athlete going forward
It's just a weird thing to focus your energy on. I'd say you're not really free with these thoughts, rather trapped in a sad emotional state caring about what someone else chooses to do with their career. Now, if she was wasting her time complaining about you- I'd say something similar to her. however... as the ice queen once said- Let it goo
It’s pretty simple, I don’t respect unethical athletes.
She was found to be an intentional doper and instead of admitting it she continued to lie. She also tried to keep training with her training group, putting her old teammates at risk of getting in trouble and some leaving the group.
She tried to look for every loophole in the sport to stay relevant like running the beer mile and going on running podcasts with hosts who were happy to just have a relevant athlete and she used that to try and continue her lie.
She's still a fraud. Hope she gets booed like Gatlin.
ya, but her not so secret sauce, could not have been nearly as strong as documented in the free using full meal deal PED users from Africa of her and this era.
that said because her geographic had testing enough to mitigate full on PED use, and had to sneak around, while the African geographic area, testing was in many cases semi non existent.
so its not a racial argument, it is the strength of the juice.
with the light bone structure of a woman, and ramped up strength with lean anabolics, and enhancement of aerobic with EPO, you can manufacture an athlete equivalent to a semi decent male.
An athlete caught doping should be banned for life and stripped of all titles and medals.
Really? I think that all sports have this same problem. So why is it that only running is unable to accept that (most) people who get banned will eventually come back?
I fully accept that people like Lance Armstrong who lied 500 times, sued the people who told the truth, and ruined people's lives should be banned for life. I get that. But what about the young guy whose manager or coach pressures him to "try it" after an injury, gets popped, admits it, does his time and moves on?
Are all doping cases the same to you? I think there is a reason we have "degrees" of punishment for crimes. Crimes are not all the same - 1st degree murder is worse than manslaughter.
Isn't it the same with doping?
I don't disagree with this, however where does SH really fall on this spectrum? Of course it's not Lance Armstrong level - but it's also not a Martin Fagan situation (where he basically was like "yep I did it and here's why and I hate myself for it").
She's done her time and it was long suspension - and it was long because let's be honest, the burrito story was comically bad and so easy to pragmatically pull to pieces. But I think the thing that still bothers me with her is that she maintains her innocence. She never had her moment of just saying "you know what I did it and ......" and because of that I have to be honest, I don't know what puts me in a position to say unequivocally she wouldn't do it again.
I know that WADA/AIU etc can't force this and say "if you don't your ban is a life one" so it falls into an interesting grey area. One thing I would say is that titles, records and bonuses from performance should absolutely be something forfeited - and this would be a full career duration thing. Why? Maybe that's a big enough of an incentive to guide a few more athletes in the right direction when making the moral decision to do things or not.
Disagree, an athlete caught doping should be banned for life and stripped of all titles and medals. At this point I don’t even know why an elite athlete, particularly if they’re on the bubble for making teams/ medaling, wouldn’t cheat. You probably won’t ever get caught, and even if you do, you still keep all the money you made and can just get a real job after a minor punishment and some hate on Instagram. Honestly, you can just skip tests and make up a ridiculous excuse for why and never face any consequences.
Are you related to Greg Pizza?
No, just a huge fan of the pizza they use to serve at the Reggie Lewis center circa 2016 (AKs pizza in Boston, still available for all runners as it is less than 5 minutes from the track)
The problem is that that apparently our whole nation is full of frauds and liars.
So why does this board get off on going after Shelby in a million threads when literally every politician, celebrity, or athlete is a flawed or terrible person?
Why do people here hate her so much more than all the other people you've accused of doping? There is no relation to the offense and the amount of hate she gets.
It is out of proportion.
100% this. The U.S. just elected a felon and fraud as president and most people here supported him, so all the Shelby haters need to stop with the holier than thou sanctimonious nonsense. If Donald Trump can be president again, then Shelby can race again.
Disagree, an athlete caught doping should be banned for life and stripped of all titles and medals. At this point I don’t even know why an elite athlete, particularly if they’re on the bubble for making teams/ medaling, wouldn’t cheat. You probably won’t ever get caught, and even if you do, you still keep all the money you made and can just get a real job after a minor punishment and some hate on Instagram. Honestly, you can just skip tests and make up a ridiculous excuse for why and never face any consequences.
Yes, but this is a complaint against the doping rules themselves, not Shelby. By the rules themselves, she did her time.
Regardless of her protestations of innocence, Houlihan did her time and served her penalty and forfeited two Olympic shots. Whatever career she was going to have is off the table, forever — the cost was total — and she's welcome to attempt a comeback. Hope she's ready for the potential crowd reactions at Hayward every time she steps out there.
If she ever admits guilt, she will be liable for fraud, because she fundraised off those protestations of innocence. The fundraising was probably dumb, because if she just said, "Yeah, we all pushed the limits with our supplements, and I got sloppy with the timing, lesson learned," she would have earned back some goodwill. If she tries that now, she gets sued, or worse.
I have more of an issue with the way she played in the grey margins during her suspension, what with coincidentally being "in the neighborhood" right around the same time as certain BTC workouts. Remember the athlete(s) who quit over that and made their concerns public.
I honestly don’t know why someone from an underdeveloped country wouldn’t dope, absolutely no reason to not give it a chance.
Except she got caught this time.
It's all very well saying people from Africa or America "have nothing to lose" but in reality if they get caught there is a lot to lose, as this woman is finding out.
Oh man. Not with the childish "hater" thing again.
"out of proportion"? These threads only keep growing because some trolls have to keep lying for this drug cheat, and call the anti-doping posters "haters".
If you doper lovers would do the same for say, Kiprop over and over and over again, the Kiprop threads would get just as long.
I agree with you that she doped. I base my opinions on the evidence we have and that evidence says she is a doper.
The difference is that I don't "hate" her with the vitriol and anger that so many people here seem to have. I am sure Kiprop was way worse, but nobody "hates" Kiprop.
That is what seems out of proportion to me. She doped, she did her time, she's always going to have to live with that.
For people who think she might have been "tainted" by accident, that is possible, but we have no evidence of that so we have to let that go. As it stands now, she doped & did her time, and we have to just move on.
Oh man. Not with the childish "hater" thing again.
"out of proportion"? These threads only keep growing because some trolls have to keep lying for this drug cheat, and call the anti-doping posters "haters".
If you doper lovers would do the same for say, Kiprop over and over and over again, the Kiprop threads would get just as long.
I agree with you that she doped. I base my opinions on the evidence we have and that evidence says she is a doper.
The difference is that I don't "hate" her with the vitriol and anger that so many people here seem to have. I am sure Kiprop was way worse, but nobody "hates" Kiprop.
That is what seems out of proportion to me. She doped, she did her time, she's always going to have to live with that.
For people who think she might have been "tainted" by accident, that is possible, but we have no evidence of that so we have to let that go. As it stands now, she doped & did her time, and we have to just move on.
#1- Taking toxic drugs has never been proven to improve anyone's performance compared to completely natural training;
#2- Simple logic is that the claim that drugs are a magic potion is a fairy tale;
#3- Houlihan was never proven to have taken any drugs anyway, but simply was unable to "prove" that she didn't, which no one ever would be able to prove.
The idiotic standard of having to prove one's innocence should be done away with.
You either have to prove that someone is guilty, or else they remain innocent. Period.
Therefore, Houlihan is innocent because she has never been proven to be guilty.
By your logic, testing for PEDs should be discontinued.
Exactly, because all the bogus tests and convictions are simply propaganda for the chemical cartels, and often bigoted prejudiced attacks on people from other countries and ethnicities.
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