Does Alan Culpepper ever run to win?

wayward lassie wrote:

Stewed Prune wrote:

Or does he always run with a good finishing time in mind?

A.C. is an extremely competitive runner and is much faster than you'll ever be.

Try to stay on topic here...nobody ever said or implied they were faster than AC.

There are many stupid human beings and you are one of them.

When running from A to B, the fastest way to do it is to run an even pace. If you start at a faster pace then you can mantain your total time will be slower. It doesn`t matter what the other runners are doing. To start the race too fast to keep up the other idiots, will not help you reach the finishline faster. Ok? To run the race at an even pace is knowing your own capacity. It is also a brave way to run the race. Most runners lack the CONFIDENCE to do this. Most runners think they will need a head start on their own goal-pace, a lack of confidence in own abilities.

I guess you admire Bekele as much as the next man. How does he win? Almost every time he breaks the other runners in the second part of the race. He also runs even splits or even negative splits when running record times.

Alan Culpepper is a formidable runner but will never be the best. (he might win Boston but it hardly makes him the best..) What place would Brian Sell have gotten if he had followed the pack in Helsinki last year. Not among the top 20.

Yes the best runner on the planet can apply almost any tactic he pleases to win a race. And he breaks them basically because he is capable of running a pace that really noone else in the world can.

Culpepper probably cant apply those tactics in Boston. But neither can anyone else in the field. But I just wonder if he tried to hang in there with the leader a little longer (and maybe he cant). Threw in a couple of his own surges. Even if hes hurting (which they all are). Started to dictate the race instead of having it dictated to him. Could he break these guys. Could he win?

And basically my question is does he have the mindset. And I guess its really more than a mindset at mile 20 of a marathon. But does he have the ingrained attitude that it takes to win a major race.?

Its perfectly fine for him to go in wanting to run a smart race and have a respectable finish. But that is not by definition running with the intent of winning the race.

It seems like you have never run a marathon.

Let's say, just for the sake of example, that Culpepper feels he's in 2:08 shape (a significant PR, by the way).

The best way to get that 2:08 is to run 1:04 for each half. (Obviously the Boston course makes even splits an odd concept, but this is an example).

If someone else in the field takes off and runs 1:03 it is not in Culpepper's best interests to follow that pace. It may look like he is running to win, but he won't. Sure, 2:06 pace will feel easy at mile 13, probably at mile 18, maybe even at mile 20 ... but going faster than your abilities always comes back to bite you in the marathon, and almost always in a more gruesome way than going out a little too fast in a 10k.

Having a realistic assessment of your abilities versus your competitions (which Culpepper seems to have) is actually likely to lead to, get this, better placing than following the leaders.

Culpepper is a tremendously talented runner, but it looks like he knows that he is not going to run 2:06, 26:40 and 12:55, and following that pace in a race will not help him get the 13:15, 27:20 and 2:08:xx that he probably can run at the best of his abilities.

BOSTON BILLY just posted last page, and some of you are still vainly arguing amongst yourselves, no one even acknowledged it.

Please Bill, tell us what you think about racing within your own perceived limitations vs running to win. We would all greatly benefit from your experiences.

Then you answered my question in your explanation. That you in fact think that Alan doesnt think he can hang with some of the guys in this race and so he will run to the best of his abilities but not to try and win per se.

Theres nothing wrong with that strategy at all. But. It it not running to win the race.

Is Boston Billy Bill Rodgers?

If it is I've read quotes by him saying if you want to win a marathon you have to get a little crazy. Or something along those lines.

Bump.

Dear Bill, we REALLY are interested in your experience, as we all experience this dilemma in our races.

Thanks

For real.

And yet 10% of letsrunners thing that A.C. will WIN Boston.

HAHAHAHAHA!

Stewed Prune wrote:

Then you answered my question in your explanation. That you in fact think that Alan doesnt think he can hang with some of the guys in this race and so he will run to the best of his abilities but not to try and win per se.

Theres nothing wrong with that strategy at all. But. It it not running to win the race.

It will if you finish with a time faster than your opposition at the end of a race. Theoretically, doesn't matter what tactics the other use, if they can't run the time he does they don't beat him. It's about running to your strengths.

I understand what youre saying completely.

And if you can run a couple of minutes faster than everyone else in the field and you know it. Then it is a great strategy and is running to win.

But what if 10 or 15 guys are pretty evenly matched? Doesnt it come down to more than pacing yourself properly?

I'm probably the only one on this board who thinks so, but whenever you enter a debate and call someone with an opposing viewpoint a cocksucke*--you completly lose my respect. You may have a ligitimate point but I can't see it through the stench of your unprovoked vulgarity. If we were sitting together and watching the race, would you call me a cocksucke* if I disagreed with you point of view? Maybe so, and that's sad.

Please feel free to disparage my sexuality for daring write these comments. I'm sure you could kick my ass. You da' man. Cullpepper sucks. Adios.

Ha! I try to keep the ***** ing to people who *** at me or call me names only fair

Stewed Prune wrote:

But what if 10 or 15 guys are pretty evenly matched? Doesnt it come down to more than pacing yourself properly?

Could well do, especially with others around you sharing the work but if you run faster than then opposition regardless, you win. Depends on your strengths and weaknesses too and who you're actually racing. With some Africans in there, is he likely to win? If not, by running with them would be suicide and kills his chances of winning some minor prizemoney.

A lot of what I'm seeing here marks what is wrong with American distance running...

Get out there and go for it, and don't be so vain as to worry about your marks are going to end up. Run the damn race because you love to run, and because it's fun... and fun is winning.

Run the race to win. If you don't have an innate desire to win every time you step to the line, then join everybody else in the jogging lane.

That's my two-cents...

I like that attitude.

Friday night I went to an event at Niketown Boston with Alan Culpepper, Joan Benoit, Meb Keflezighi and Yelena Prokopcuka. It was just a nice little session where they answered a few softball questions and all the running geeks like me got to see the running stars.

Too late, I realized I wanted to ask the whole panel a question about how they raced marathons. Specifically I wanted to know how much of their marathon racing was against the opponent and how much was against the clock. Unfortunately, I didn't get a chance before the Q&A was over. But afterwards, I was standing not far from Culpepper and decided to ask him.

I did not ask him this question in regards to this thread. I wanted to hear the answers of all 4. But it does seem relevant given the topic, doesn't it?

Culpepper said it was all about the opponents. I pressed him a bit, mentioning other races and and he said yes, it depends on the race. He said a nice flat race like Chicago was different -- you quite often just race for time there. You could be far behind the winner and still have a great time. But at a race like Boston, he said, he was "out there to beat the field, not the clock"

I doubt this will change the mind of anyone here but there you have it straight from the horse's mouth.

sp:

Nice thread. You've done a good job of delivering needed beat-downs in a sentence or two to skinny idiots who curse you out, then returning to the topic at hand and keeping on message.

I was at the OT marathon, rollerbladed from spot to spot, watched the lead pack blow into town at 10 miles, watched Sell take off soon after, watched Sell run an incredibly gutsy race, and watched Culp and Meb reel him in. I was also at the finish line when Culp crossed first.

Sell has exactly the intangible that you've identified Culpepper as not having. On any given day, Sell standing at the starting line is a guy willing to say, "F- it. I'm feeling great. I'm going for it. Let them come at me." Or at least is the sense I got. He's willing to be fearless.

Culp is a different athlete, based on what I saw there--at of course based on the Olympics and Boston last year. He's a craftsman. He knows what he has in him; he seems determined to extract his best possible time on any given day, and he's disciplined enough NOT to get carried away, or "inspired" (foolishly), or be pulled off the plan. He runs cerebrally.

Sell was an exciting runner at the OT. He put a thrill in the crowd--because there was NO WAY he could steal the race. But he seemed determined to. He was the kind of guy whose going to wheel the buggy out into the middle of the salt flats and put pedal to the metal and hang on until he's running on fumes, or until the thing blows apart. In his case, it sorta blew apart. He finished what in the OT? Eighth? Tenth? He certainly didn't end up delivering his best time on that day. But he ran an inspired race, regardless.

The question you're really asking is whether Culp is capable of running an inspired race--whether he's willing to run "foolishly," veering off the plan for the sake of maybe doing something he's never done before, or something people didn't quite think he could do.

Sell clearly IS capable of doing that. He's the small horse with the huge heart, if you will.

No disrespect whatever to Culpepper. He's a craftsman. There's a place for him in this sport. He deserves every bit of success he's enjoyed.

In fact, a betting man would be making a good bet by putting money on him to be ready for Boston. He may have a shrewder plan this time around than we think.

But Sell is more likely--much more likely--to surprise us. To exceed expectations. To deliver the blow out race people secretly believe he has in him. He has the quality--it's called bravery--that you've been asking about.

Would you rather have the will to prepare to win or the will to win?

Well, the answer is, there are several varieties of each. Apples and oranges.

Sell is in the Pre camp. Culp is in the Viren camp.

No thats some awesome info.

So now we know without a doubt. Alan is going into Boston with the mindset of winning. It would be huge if he did.

Thanks Joe