Isn't it time they burned the hs rulebook and started over?

Irv Fan Club wrote:

I'm not from CT, but I am deeply impressed by what I'm hearing about Irv. I don't think some of you appreciate how hard it must be to run a meet while simultaneously scanning every athlete for offending eyebrow rings and hats, engaging in shouting matches with athletes and coaches, and defending your turf from interlopers. All while fending off sunshine! He must be some kind of superman.

Plus, the guy's got radar that can detect frisbees at least 200 yards away from the track facility... at which point he stops the meet, sends a flunkie off on a mission to confiscate said frisbee and then report back that all is well at Trinity again. The process only stops the meet for about 5-10 minutes. It is certainly a sight to behold. He is one of a kind, no doubt.

Thom Jacobs,

Now you've made me feel a little sheepish about jeering at somebody I've never met. I know that's almost always a questionable move at best.

However, I've been to about a million meets and have crossed paths with my share of bozos, and have had my share of conflicts, but I have NEVER seen the need to yell at a fellow professional or berate an opposing team's athletes. I take a backseat to nobody vis-a-vis passion, but I have a real hard time excusing bullying behavior on the grounds of passion. In my experience, bullying behavior is about exercising power, not about passion.

I got no problem with telling a kid his eyebrow ring is not allowed on race day. I have a lot of problems with shouting at / berating a kid for what he or she is wearing. Oh, and opera-loving got nothing to do with nothing, except another example of him lecturing people.

Anyway, sorry if I'm misunderstanding the guy, but somehow I don't think I am. Still, maybe I should change to "The Street Fan Club." I feel like I do know HIM...

Thom it is nice to see you switch to your real name. Now we are making some progress in controlling those emotions. For you and "street" to blow the Irv comment out of proportion is an indication that the two of you as well as "Irving" all have volatile personalities that are better left somewhere else.

Why don't you sack up and tell us who you are?

I can't. I don't have a spine.

Another CT coaches love fest. That is why they are the bastion for track and field prominence here in New England.

You guys are an embarassment to the profession.

Hey! I resemble that remark!

oops...I meant "resent".

You CT coaches better make damn sure your kids are following the uniform rule to the letter. I can just see a uniform-violation war brewing...

What's the record for most DQs in a state meet?

I am not from Conn and don't know any of the characters involved, though we probably all are stereotypes one way or another.

I have seen the uniform rule employed at dual meets when the 6th 400 girl wore tights in sub-40 degrees. I have watched kids switch uniforms (shorts) because the school district did not have enough in the budget to clothe all the kids. I have seen the LiveStrong yellow band get a kid a dq when they forgot to remove it. I have seen pierced kids in college and pro-meets, so am not really convinced of the safety concern. I have also seen the pole vault held during a hard rain, at a state meet, when safety was not the concern, but the yellow wristband was.

I have no answers for what should be done, but the sport suffers from the absence of passion among young kids and the general public (Would the US show the excitement for a meet like we saw with the Commonwealth Games?). We need to examine when our stuffed shirt attitude alienates potential competitors and future stars. I know there's a right way to do things, but a kid who pierce's his eye is long past that value.

Boston26,

As we've seen in this thread, there are three kinds of responses to the types of petty uniform violations you list (livestrong bands, tights):

1. Some coaches / officials turn a blind eye to these things. They don't believe wearing a bracelet changes anything and they want to keep meets athlete-centered whenever possible.

2. Some coaches / officials reluctantly enforce the letter of the law in these cases, usually when their hand is forced by a protest.

3. Some coaches / officials seem to love pouncing on these violations, even the tiniest ones, and take obvious glee in teaching the violators a lesson.

Category number 3 needs to go the way of the dinosaur. I think their motivation has little to do with track and field and a lot to do with hating youth style and culture. I thought this kind of battle went out with Archie Bunker. My coaches probably didn't like my long hair in high school, but I turned out to be okay. I may not like eyebrow piercings or tattoos, but I bet the kids who have them are going to turn out okay, too.

Remove the bit about 'taking obvious glee' from #3 and I'd be more likely to agree with you.

Okay. Maybe I exaggerated. Maybe "glee" is not the most common response, but I have seen it. And after reading "The Street's" diatribes, I don't think it's unheard of in Connecticut.

You guys got an Irv Black employee pissed. You're all screwed come state time. Ray, I didn't think you were still coaching, but if you are, I wouldn't even have my team show up if I were you.

this whole debate is f***ing incredible to me.

Any talk about uniforms (other than with regard to safety issues) is about conformity and control and not about sport. i believe sport should be about fair play and winning, not about how one dresses or whether one looks like a fine upstanding member of society.

I am not even sure why we need any rules about uniforms, other than ones for safety. Track is an individual sport. why does a 3000m man need to wear the same outfit as the shot putter. There are public indecency laws to cover nakedness, there are laws to cover offensive statements on uniforms - what else do we need? Why not run in tie dye, why not run in track pants and a sombrero - who the hell cares?

Getting off the anme calling and back to another point...is it even against the rules to wear a hat?

old and grouchy and ignorant wrote:

this whole debate is f***ing incredible to me.

Any talk about uniforms (other than with regard to safety issues) is about conformity and control and not about sport. i believe sport should be about fair play and winning, not about how one dresses or whether one looks like a fine upstanding member of society.

I am not even sure why we need any rules about uniforms, other than ones for safety. Track is an individual sport. why does a 3000m man need to wear the same outfit as the shot putter. There are public indecency laws to cover nakedness, there are laws to cover offensive statements on uniforms - what else do we need? Why not run in tie dye, why not run in track pants and a sombrero - who the hell cares?

You don't know what you are talking about. There is no rule that the 3000m man must wear the same outfit as the shot putter. There are rules about relay runners wearing the same uniform. Surely you would agree that makes sense.

My point is the same - what is the difference? The team still runs the same distance in the same lane with the same rules on hand off. Who cares if they wear the same thing.

you have never tried to sort out 8 teams of mixed gear in a 4X400.