I would bet that Sadie and her team don't know the repercussions of this decision and might end up pulling back.
Sadie and her team are pretty savvy. She's been a super star since 8th grade. This isn't new to her. Sadie and her team are also aware of what Lex and Leo did last year. I highly doubt they are unware of the CIF rules.
Well if Engelhardt isn’t eligible for XC during Fall 2024, it will take away Ventura’s chances of making NXN.
If she is on the team, Ventura will have the best team they ever will have
NXN is not organized by CIF and isn't subject to their rules. They don't even recognize school affiliation. You can run as a club but you don't represent your school district, aren't supposed to wear the official school uniform (remember, NP had a school-issued uniform and a different-looking club uni), and the district's insurance doesn't cover any aspect of participation in Nike's event.
The only X-factor is if NXN doesn't offer a regional qualifier but uses CIF results instead. Then, this is a complete show stopper.
NXN has at large bids for 4 teams that don't auto qualify. So it's possible for Sadie to NOT run xc with her school, and then have her school do pretty well at the state meet, but not quite good enough to auto qualify.
Then NXN could extend an invitation to Ventura as long as Sadie agrees to be part of the team.
Some people would lose their minds if that happened, and complain that another team was unfairly over looked. But Rich Gonzalez is friends with Sadie and he might make an exception for her.
NXN rules say that you must be eligible to compete for your HS.
It's a private event. NXN can do whatever it wants to. They can change or bend their rules.
Last year Foot Locker's rules said Sadie had to finish top 10 in a Foot Locker regional race in order to qualify for nationals. Sadie didn't run a Foot Locker regional race. Foot Locker told her that she could run at the national meet anyway. (She ended up backing out last minute because NXN wore her out.)
When you're that good, exceptions are sometimes made.
I'm not a big fan of Engelhardt. I don't think she's a great talent (obviously a good talent), but rather someone who matured far earlier than most girls. A good indicator is that she does not appear to be anorexic, so hopefully she stays healthy. I don't have an opinion about running with the pro's; whatever. Bigger picture: She'll level off within a few years. Her mile time in the 9th grade means zero as for being a future indicator. Mary Decker was far more talented at the same age, and you could see more upside than with Engelhardt.
I'm not a big fan of Engelhardt. I don't think she's a great talent (obviously a good talent),
but rather someone who matured far earlier than most girls. A good indicator is that she does not appear to be anorexic, so hopefully she stays healthy. I don't have an opinion about running with the pro's; whatever. Bigger picture: She'll level off within a few years. Her mile time in the 9th grade means zero as for being a future indicator.
Mary Decker was far more talented at the same age, and you could see more upside than with Engelhardt.
So you think that every girl who isn't Mary Decker isn't a great talent? Give me a break. That's overly harsh. Engelhardt is already one of the fastest 1600/3200 high school girls in history, and she's still got a year and a half to go.
I'm not a big fan of Engelhardt. I don't think she's a great talent (obviously a good talent), but rather someone who matured far earlier than most girls. A good indicator is that she does not appear to be anorexic, so hopefully she stays healthy. I don't have an opinion about running with the pro's; whatever. Bigger picture: She'll level off within a few years. Her mile time in the 9th grade means zero as for being a future indicator. Mary Decker was far more talented at the same age, and you could see more upside than with Engelhardt.
Well, I think the opposite. I take as a good thing that she has been running well with her matured woman's body, as so many female runner phenoms (but not all) go backwards once they mature. Hate on me all you want, but seeing her run so well past that stage is a good indicator, not a bad one.
I am not a coach or a lawyer, but I just read through the CIF 600 series bylaws and noticed a few interesting things:
1. Competing as an unattached athlete in track and field is allowed according to Bylaw 600.G.2
"Unattached competition is permissible for a student in other than school contests during the season of sport provided the student enters in the individual sports of badminton (singles and doubles), beach volleyball (pairs), cross country, golf, gymnastics, skiing, swimming and diving (including unattached entry on relays), tennis (singles and doubles), track and field (including unattached entry on relays) and wrestling."
2. Bylaw 215 specifically prohibits athletes from participating in intercollegiate meets "Q: What is defined as a collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition? A: A collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition is one in which collegiate athletes are competing for or representing their school."
3. I believe The TEN is considered a "joint sanctioned event" as collegiate athletes will be competing while representing their respective colleges. Joint sanctioned meets are allowed if and only if the athlete participates solely in races exclusively for high school athletes. Open races at joint sanctioned events are prohibited.
4. Bylaw 600 lists the penalty for the first infraction as being required to sit out for the next two CIF sanctioned meets the athlete's school team participates in.
5. The second infraction results in immediate ineligibility for the next 365 days in ALL sports
6. Road races are specifically allowed for multiple reasons, simplest being that "road racing" is not a CIF sanctioned sport
I am not a coach or a lawyer, but I just read through the CIF 600 series bylaws and noticed a few interesting things:
1. Competing as an unattached athlete in track and field is allowed according to Bylaw 600.G.2
"Unattached competition is permissible for a student in other than school contests during the season of sport provided the student enters in the individual sports of badminton (singles and doubles), beach volleyball (pairs), cross country, golf, gymnastics, skiing, swimming and diving (including unattached entry on relays), tennis (singles and doubles), track and field (including unattached entry on relays) and wrestling."
2. Bylaw 215 specifically prohibits athletes from participating in intercollegiate meets "Q: What is defined as a collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition? A: A collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition is one in which collegiate athletes are competing for or representing their school."
3. I believe The TEN is considered a "joint sanctioned event" as collegiate athletes will be competing while representing their respective colleges. Joint sanctioned meets are allowed if and only if the athlete participates solely in races exclusively for high school athletes. Open races at joint sanctioned events are prohibited.
4. Bylaw 600 lists the penalty for the first infraction as being required to sit out for the next two CIF sanctioned meets the athlete's school team participates in.
5. The second infraction results in immediate ineligibility for the next 365 days in ALL sports
6. Road races are specifically allowed for multiple reasons, simplest being that "road racing" is not a CIF sanctioned sport
I am not a coach or a lawyer, but I just read through the CIF 600 series bylaws and noticed a few interesting things:
1. Competing as an unattached athlete in track and field is allowed according to Bylaw 600.G.2
"Unattached competition is permissible for a student in other than school contests during the season of sport provided the student enters in the individual sports of badminton (singles and doubles), beach volleyball (pairs), cross country, golf, gymnastics, skiing, swimming and diving (including unattached entry on relays), tennis (singles and doubles), track and field (including unattached entry on relays) and wrestling."
2. Bylaw 215 specifically prohibits athletes from participating in intercollegiate meets "Q: What is defined as a collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition? A: A collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition is one in which collegiate athletes are competing for or representing their school."
3. I believe The TEN is considered a "joint sanctioned event" as collegiate athletes will be competing while representing their respective colleges. Joint sanctioned meets are allowed if and only if the athlete participates solely in races exclusively for high school athletes. Open races at joint sanctioned events are prohibited.
4. Bylaw 600 lists the penalty for the first infraction as being required to sit out for the next two CIF sanctioned meets the athlete's school team participates in.
5. The second infraction results in immediate ineligibility for the next 365 days in ALL sports
6. Road races are specifically allowed for multiple reasons, simplest being that "road racing" is not a CIF sanctioned sport
This is what I’ve been saying. They sent out clarifications of the rules and Sound Running is NOT allowed if Sadie wants to run any CIF races this season and maybe beyond . Sadie would need to enter the HS race at Sound Running.
Sadie Englehardt gives up High School eligibility and will run in race with Pros and college athletes
Another top California prep gives up their remaining HS eligibility to run with pros. Same thing happen with Lex and Leo Young last year
Good for her
Was she ever coached by Ventura HS coaches or did she always have a private? Anyone know if she's getting picked up by a club? I'm not the biggest of this move. The more I read about the Mary Cain / Salazar lawsuit...no blame seems to be put on Mary Cain's parents and if she stayed in high school....she could still be running and parents today could reference that. Sadie has zero chance of making the Olympic Team this year so why now? Is he making millions and millions of $?
she has the option of running fast time or win a bunch of races with little competition. colleges look at times not wins (lex, leo being perfect examples of that). if she wants to get a good scholarship or possibly go pro she has to run races where she can get paced. it’s ridiculous she is not allowed to do that
When will sponsor money, sponsor financed clubs, high school NIL, etc. destroy both collegiate and high school sports? 2030? 2035? Sooner?
When athletes have the freedom to earn money and get better coaching without being shackled by bureaucracy, old hierarchies start dying.
What percentage of HS athletes will get sponsored, NIL, or go this route. This won't ruin HS sports.
Bullis is giving out NIL money to some of their runners. Do you think they are not using this as a recruiting tool? That's why Bullis, IMG, Monteverde all need to be considered club teams and not be allowed to compete as a HS team or have any of their relay times be eligible for HS records.
How long before the club HS team parents start complaining about this post.
More overregulation by the woke state of California.
Woke? this type of regulation was in effect in almost every state decades ago. Some still have it some don't.
It's not woke and overregulation (as in telling women what they can do with their bodies and telling people what gender they have to be) is definitely the belief of the anti-woke.
This is just antiquated rules being enforced. When I was in high school that was the rule in NY. We ran a few races using different names.
I am not a coach or a lawyer, but I just read through the CIF 600 series bylaws and noticed a few interesting things:
1. Competing as an unattached athlete in track and field is allowed according to Bylaw 600.G.2
"Unattached competition is permissible for a student in other than school contests during the season of sport provided the student enters in the individual sports of badminton (singles and doubles), beach volleyball (pairs), cross country, golf, gymnastics, skiing, swimming and diving (including unattached entry on relays), tennis (singles and doubles), track and field (including unattached entry on relays) and wrestling."
2. Bylaw 215 specifically prohibits athletes from participating in intercollegiate meets "Q: What is defined as a collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition? A: A collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition is one in which collegiate athletes are competing for or representing their school."
3. I believe The TEN is considered a "joint sanctioned event" as collegiate athletes will be competing while representing their respective colleges. Joint sanctioned meets are allowed if and only if the athlete participates solely in races exclusively for high school athletes. Open races at joint sanctioned events are prohibited.
4. Bylaw 600 lists the penalty for the first infraction as being required to sit out for the next two CIF sanctioned meets the athlete's school team participates in.
5. The second infraction results in immediate ineligibility for the next 365 days in ALL sports
6. Road races are specifically allowed for multiple reasons, simplest being that "road racing" is not a CIF sanctioned sport
This is what I’ve been saying. They sent out clarifications of the rules and Sound Running is NOT allowed if Sadie wants to run any CIF races this season and maybe beyond . Sadie would need to enter the HS race at Sound Running.
That's not what you've been saying. You're asserting a ban on "any CIF races this season and beyond," and the quoted rule says "next two CIF sanctioned meets" (assuming this is first offense). Those aren't remotely the same thing.
I am not a coach or a lawyer, but I just read through the CIF 600 series bylaws and noticed a few interesting things:
1. Competing as an unattached athlete in track and field is allowed according to Bylaw 600.G.2
"Unattached competition is permissible for a student in other than school contests during the season of sport provided the student enters in the individual sports of badminton (singles and doubles), beach volleyball (pairs), cross country, golf, gymnastics, skiing, swimming and diving (including unattached entry on relays), tennis (singles and doubles), track and field (including unattached entry on relays) and wrestling."
2. Bylaw 215 specifically prohibits athletes from participating in intercollegiate meets "Q: What is defined as a collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition? A: A collegiate track meet and/or intercollegiate competition is one in which collegiate athletes are competing for or representing their school."
3. I believe The TEN is considered a "joint sanctioned event" as collegiate athletes will be competing while representing their respective colleges. Joint sanctioned meets are allowed if and only if the athlete participates solely in races exclusively for high school athletes. Open races at joint sanctioned events are prohibited.
4. Bylaw 600 lists the penalty for the first infraction as being required to sit out for the next two CIF sanctioned meets the athlete's school team participates in.
5. The second infraction results in immediate ineligibility for the next 365 days in ALL sports
6. Road races are specifically allowed for multiple reasons, simplest being that "road racing" is not a CIF sanctioned sport
This is what I’ve been saying. They sent out clarifications of the rules and Sound Running is NOT allowed if Sadie wants to run any CIF races this season and maybe beyond . Sadie would need to enter the HS race at Sound Running.
Did they send something out that specifically named this event? This is not a college meet. NO COLLEGE ATHLETES COMPETED LAST YEAR. Do we have some kind of proof that she will be in a race with college athletes?
Help us build the best running shoe review site for a chance to win a LetsRun t-shirt.Help us build the best running shoe review site for a chance to win one of 10 LetsRun t-shirts.