Bottom line it does seem they have adjusted the pace, presumably to what the top runners requested
But is there anything concrete in the idea (suggested or implied earlier on this or another thread) that it was solely Valby’s team that is setting the pace? I think it would be neat to know how the race directors arrive at these decisions (not just for this race.)
Why do you think the pace was relaxed from what was stated earlier?
It was changed from the originally stated 15:12, to 15:15-15:18.
Idk but my point is that if Valby's team wanted to pace for 15 flat or the record, they would do that. They had a faster pace set for Tuohy and Orton the last two years.
15:15-15:18 is still pretty fast for this field. Last year only 4 women ran under 15:20 all year including outdoors, and three of those times came from this meet (Tuohy, Olemomoi, Chelangat). The 4th was Mazza Downie who ran 15:18 on an OT.
It was changed from the originally stated 15:12, to 15:15-15:18.
Idk but my point is that if Valby's team wanted to pace for 15 flat or the record, they would do that. They had a faster pace set for Tuohy and Orton the last two years.
The bolded part is where we have a bit of disagreement. The race director has to take multiple things into account, in setting a pace. Obviously, if there are no pacesetters available that can set a very hot requested pace (up to 3000m), then the race director can’t/won’t publish that as the set pace.
Idk but my point is that if Valby's team wanted to pace for 15 flat or the record, they would do that. They had a faster pace set for Tuohy and Orton the last two years.
The bolded part is where we have a bit of disagreement. The race director has to take multiple things into account, in setting a pace. Obviously, if there are no pacesetters available that can set a very hot requested pace (up to 3000m), then the race director can’t/won’t publish that as the set pace.
And as I said earlier (which you can downvote all you want), in order to run a sub-15, they need a pacesetter to absolutely go through 3600m in 10:45. They did not have that last year with Coburn (she went through in 10:56).
Idk but my point is that if Valby's team wanted to pace for 15 flat or the record, they would do that. They had a faster pace set for Tuohy and Orton the last two years.
The bolded part is where we have a bit of disagreement. The race director has to take multiple things into account, in setting a pace. Obviously, if there are no pacesetters available that can set a very hot requested pace (up to 3000m), then the race director can’t/won’t publish that as the set pace.
Based on what? You can hear the announcers talk about it on the broadcasts. I think this is, respectfully, wishful thinking if you believe Valby's coach has no say in the pace.
The bolded part is where we have a bit of disagreement. The race director has to take multiple things into account, in setting a pace. Obviously, if there are no pacesetters available that can set a very hot requested pace (up to 3000m), then the race director can’t/won’t publish that as the set pace.
Based on what? You can hear the announcers talk about it on the broadcasts. I think this is, respectfully, wishful thinking if you believe Valby's coach has no say in the pace.
You still don’t get it. If there was is no pacesetter available to actually be able to set a requested pace, then the pace will be set to something slower than requested.
Based on what? You can hear the announcers talk about it on the broadcasts. I think this is, respectfully, wishful thinking if you believe Valby's coach has no say in the pace.
You still don’t get it. If there was is no pacesetter available to actually be able to set a requested pace, then the pace will be set to something slower than requested.
I’m not saying in this particular case that the race director had trouble finding someone to set 15:12, so they therefore relaxed it to 15:15.
But I do think finding a pacesetter to realistically set a 15min pace would have not only been a tall order, but also, because there are over 20 (mostly collegiate) athletes on the track, runners would start getting lapped with 4 laps remaining, making the race a bit haphazard, and diminishing possibility of hitting 15min regardless.
You still don’t get it. If there was is no pacesetter available to actually be able to set a requested pace, then the pace will be set to something slower than requested.
Interesting. Is your theory that the pace is slower because they could not find a pace setter?
some wondered if that was truly a 5k. If so she took a big step back in her time in the U.S. (and the state of Alabama).
Cross Country is different than a drag race Road 5K. She also was second best in most races to Valby only right? I think you can downplay Valbys fitness if you want by saying Lemngole is way worse than 14:40 but thats making assumptions to ignore Valbys dominance and assuming its a weaker NCAA crop of runners.
lol well "coach of high guys" seems to think she will go to the lead at 200. I think that unlikely for several reasons, one of which you state.
Yeah she is not doing any of that. Now this is a good opportunity for a big negative split however. Same for Rodenfels.
Hopefully they all come into the race healthy, and remain so.
So in one potential scenario, with 10 laps remaining after the last pace-setter steps off the track, do any of the pros share workload with Valby to try and run a fast time? Or do they sit on her hoping to kick her down in the last couple of laps?
some wondered if that was truly a 5k. If so she took a big step back in her time in the U.S. (and the state of Alabama).
Cross Country is different than a drag race Road 5K. She also was second best in most races to Valby only right? I think you can downplay Valbys fitness if you want by saying Lemngole is way worse than 14:40 but thats making assumptions to ignore Valbys dominance and assuming its a weaker NCAA crop of runners.
Actually, forgetting about Valby, there were 8 ladies I think within 25 seconds of Doris at Nationals at 6k and I have a hard time believing they are all 15:00-15:10 5000 m runners. But I guess maybe they are. We'll see 2 of them in BU 5000 and 5 I think in the 3000.
Actually, forgetting about Valby, there were 8 ladies I think within 25 seconds of Doris at Nationals at 6k and I have a hard time believing they are all 15:00-15:10 5000 m runners. But I guess maybe they are. We'll see 2 of them in BU 5000 and 5 I think in the 3000.
Lemngole did put 6-12 seconds on most of them (Markezich 3 and Tuohy 5) in the last K so it is worth questioning if a conservative race plan affected the margin. But even if we call it pretty all-out, let's say she's 20-25 seconds ahead of that group. If she's in a pretty conservative 14:55 shape that is allowing for a decent step back (and not a lightning-fast road race), we're presuming 15:10-15:18 fitness (I am shrinking the margin for the shorter race) for the likes of Maatoug, Ramsden, Jepkirui. Doesn't seem crazy at all to me. And Valby has a gap to Lemngole that was pretty big at NCAAs despite a side-stitch that might've cost her a few seconds.
I think the NCAA top women have underachieved at 5,000 as far as time. That's probably going to continue with the pacing being set like this. Tuohy was unfortunately under the weather last year, and then she ran her fast times at the mile and 3K.
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