WaPo story on slow marathoning....yikes

This is a big part of the problem. I have a friend, she's a great person, very kind and caring, I respect her as a very good friend.

She has completed 4 marathons, only one under 6 hours. She says of her 15:00 per mile pace- I guess that's not too bad, I got though it.

And our other friends on social media tell her what a rock star and beast she is.

That's simply not the same as my other friend who runs in the 2:30's.

WaPo , like LA times, NY times, is deceitful dishonest agenda driven crap

Nah. They just all think they've stumbled upon some heart-warming "Rudy"-esque underdog tale.

My pop’s is 66. He ran 5 hours for a marathon. He certainly could have run faster had he trained smarter… but there’s no question he RAN a marathon.

That's 11 something per mile. Mist people here were talking about getting into the 15:00 per mile range which is not running.

Yes, at 11:30ish you're not walking.

But, I guess you also hit on one of the points- "... could have run faster had he trained smarter ..."

But, he DID run. He didn't walk and jog every once in a while and brag about it.

I can walk 16:00 per mile with no effort. If I insert some jogging in each mile, I'm at 15:00.

Am I supposed to just ignore the fact that it says the post was edited by rojo

Like is this a revelation of a rojo alt, or is it just another case of rojo having god-mode controls jankily implemented

Good bless these people, I suppose, for finding their joy. It's not for me to say what should bring someone else happiness.

That said, from where I do sit, I struggle to understand the motivation behind essentially "walking a marathon." A lot of these people don't seem to have obtained any particular level of improved fitness from their "training." From a "goal setting" standpoint, I'd be much more impressed by, say, a sub-30-minute "couch-to-5K" than a 7- or 8- or 9-hour "marathon." (Not that they are trying to impress me, a rando on the Internet, but I suspect a lot of them are hoping to impress somebody.) But then, I guess, the Washington Post won't write about what a warrior you are who has it way tougher than the people running 70-80 miles a week, sometimes before the crack of dawn.

At age 38, Latoya Shauntay Snell of Brooklyn has finished 27 marathons. Her secret? She completes them at a very, very slow pace.
Snell, a content creator and motivational speaker, considers herself “super back of the pack” and takes pride in the challenges slow marathon runners face. Back-of-the-packers are not only moving for hours longer than their faster counterparts, but they also often endure more difficult race conditions. They don’t have the same cheering crowds to buoy them, and sometimes hydration and aid stations close before the slow runners get there. Back-of-the-packers are followed closely by “sweeper” vehicles who insist on driving them to the finish line if their pace slows.
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Snell completed the Chicago Marathon this year in 9 hours 19 minutes and 5 seconds by alternating running and walking, finishing well after the 6 hour 30 minute cutoff for the race. For much of the race, she ran without course markers or aid stations, Snell said. (A friend rode a bike along the course and provided snacks.) By the time she got to the finish line, it was too late to receive an official finish time, but Snell was greeted by race volunteers with a finisher’s medal.
“I’m competing against my own body to see how it can perform, see the amazing things that I can do, and I try to celebrate it in real time,” she said.
Snell calls herself a “super back of the pack” runner. “I’m competing against my own body to see how it can perform, see the amazing things that I can do, and I try to celebrate it in real time,” she says. (W. Eric Snell Sr./E. Snell Design)
Why marathons are getting slower
Runners like Snell are increasingly common at marathons and other large races, and the result is that marathons are getting slower. Last year, the average time at New York City Marathon was 4:50:26, nearly 23 minutes slower than the 4:27:45 average in 2000. When Carey Pinkowski, the executive race director of the Chicago Marathon, started in his role in 1990, just 6 out 6,168 runners — about 0.1 percent — crossed the finish line in over six hours. Earlier this year, about 7 percent of the 48,000 finishers of the Chicago Marathon finished in 6 hours or more.
Race directors cite a number of potential reasons for the slower pace. More races have introduced charity fundraising programs, which often attract someone who wants to participate and raise funds, but is less concerned about finish time. The average age of marathon runners has increased, and the sport has also attracted more women, who, on average, run slower than men. At the New York City Marathon, women now account for 44 percent of the runners, up from 28 percent in 2000.
“The stigma of being a back-of-the-pack runner is slowly going away,” New York City Marathon race director Ted Metellus said.
Why marathons set time limits
For race directors, slow runners present challenges. Hosting a marathon requires permits, street closings, volunteers and a finish line kept open for hours after the first runner crosses. The Marine Corps Marathon in D.C., to be held this Sunday, starts at 7:55 a.m. and runners must reach the 21-mile mark, near the 14th Street Bridge, by 1:15 p.m. to allow the bridge to reopen to traffic soon after.
“To beat the bridge, your slowest sustained pace is 14 minutes per mile,” which is about a 6-hour marathon pace, said Marine Corps Marathon race director Alex Hetherington. Runners who can’t keep up will be picked up by a sweeper bus that drops them off at the finisher festival in Rosslyn, he said.
At the New York City Marathon on Nov. 5, the buses will follow the last wave of runners, who start at 11:30 a.m., at a 6 hour 30 minute or about 15-minutes per mile pace, Metellus said.
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After the sweep buses pass, streets reopen to traffic and medical assistance and aid stations aren’t available. Runners still on the course must move to sidewalks. The finish line in Central Park stays open until 11:30 p.m.
The challenges of running slow
Slow runners are on the course longer than faster runners, exposing the body to more stress, said Laura Richardson, a registered clinical exercise physiologist at the University of Michigan. “It’s longer time of impact on your feet, which can lead to blisters,” she said.
Being on the course for six hours “is a feat in itself,” said Martinus Evans, the founder of Slow AF Run Club, an online running community. “It takes so much mental fortitude to do that.”
Martinus Evans is the founder of the Slow AF Run Club. (Drew Reynolds)
Tips for running in the back of the pack
If you’re planning to run a fall marathon at the back of the pack, here’s advice from runners and race directors.
Know the course and rules. Plan ahead to learn time cutoffs and the pace at which you need to run before aid stations and traffic control ends. Evans, a 37-year-old Brooklyn resident, recommends bringing a digital or printed map of the course. Evans said some organizers have taken down directional signs while he’s still out on the course. “As a person who’s in the back of the pack, the race is now a scavenger hunt to the finish line,” he said.
Walter Afable ran the Chicago Marathon this year in 6:26:50. (Walter Afable)
Bring your own nutrition and water. Don’t assume aid stations will be open or stocked by the time you get there. Walter Afable, a 46-year-old living in Santa Ana, Calif., finished the Chicago Marathon in 6:26:50. He wore shorts with pockets to carry energy snacks and stayed hydrated with drinks provided by family members. Some runners use hydration backpacks, but some larger road races have banned them for security reasons.
Deb Levy is typically a mid-pack runner but finished this year's Chicago Marathon in 6:19:37 because of an injury and illness. (MarathonFoto)
Bring your own cheering section. One of the biggest differences in the back of the pack is the crowd, runners say. Deb Levy, a 57-year-old Rockville, Md., resident, is typically a middle-of-the-pack runner — her personal best is 4:39:32. But at the Chicago Marathon this year, an injury and illness sapped her energy, and she had to walk, crossing the finish line at 6:19:37. Levy noticed that the crowd had “thinned out significantly” during the second-half of the race. She recommends joining Facebook groups for back-of-the-pack runners and meeting up with people at the race expo.
Know the sweeper rules. Every runner should know whether the race has a sweeper bus to pick up slow and injured runners. At the Big Sur International Marathon, Snell was “swept” at one of the cutoff points, but said race organizers were respectful in asking her to join the bus. When Snell boarded, the other participants applauded her.
Enjoy the view from the back of the pack. The back of the pack can feel like a celebration — even before the race starts. There are runners in costumes, runners with disabilities, people of all ages and body types, and first-time marathoners filled with nervous excitement. “We are the party in the back,” Evans said.

this is quasi-fascist garbage. she's bad for being chonk. she's bad for trying not to be chonk. there is no winning with you.

what resources? volunteers? as the article said half the time they are getting rid of 20 other race aspects and they just leave the timer going IN A PARK. with presumably a handful of skeleton staff. who is this hurting?

you're writing this nonsense after the WR? "being redefined" as slow? really? every other post on here is about the super shoes. ie the opposite end of this spectrum.

right, because we didn't plaster the WR all over the news, and the OP didn't have to dig this up from the back pages of Wapo from whence no one had heard of it.

i do not get this convo. i live in a big city where running competition is intense, particularly at school level. i never thought that making a HS podium in a time that would compete in college was lessened by the fact that among the competition was not just a bunch of other fast folks but also some isolated chunky guy who runs the 300 hurdles in 60 seconds and has to stop each hurdle. i mean people are trying to push this nonsense about prestige marathons with fast times won by elite athletes in tense competition where if we ever finished anywhere near the front we'd never stop annoying people with it. but somehow ruined for people because at the back end of tens of thousands of finishers they kept the line open for someone to finish in 7 hours or whatever.

oh how horrible that they ruined it for you pfffft

Interesting, average NYC finish times are 30 mins slower than they were in 2000. My guess: social media. The big marathons have turned into marketing fests, giving everybody a finisher medal regardless of performance because why only have 3 people per age group pose with a medal when you can have 50,000 people with medals all posting it on IG, people stopping multiple times mid race to take Instagram stories with friends who made signs, etc. The game has changed. I'm not mad at it, but idk about celebrating super back of the pack obesity and all that. That's a little weird and irresponsible for WaPo to platform that.

I was chatting with a client recently, who knows that I've run marathons. I had previously told him that I was registered for a fall marathon, but during this conversation I revealed that I wasn't running it because I wasn't able to make the time to get into shape.

His answer was something like: "You can't finish?"

He thought it was a little nuts that I cared about my finish time. He said: "You know that nobody cares, right?"

And he was right. On Instragram and Facebook - if you're out there to obtain Instagram and Facebook adulation - there's no difference between running a 2:30 marathon or running a 7-hour marathon.

When I ran my first marathon in 2001, I know my friend and I didn't expect to run it very fast, but I also think we had at least some notion to not just spend a nice fall afternoon sight-seeing in Chicago, either. Like you said, "the game has changed."

sorry, buzz, one does not go run 26 miles just to be an influencer and get on social media. a mile race or 5k perhaps. 26 miles is long enough you're seeking some sort of physical test or fitness improvement in your life. you're just beefing that we should give out Fs on the test, and ignore the social incentive to get healthier. this to me is the wannabe ubermensch side of running saying the sport is NOT about getting healthier as a society or individual, or the test of finishing a race length alive that in myth killed the namesake. it's a conference championship for the fast ones and they just forgot to write it in the brochure.

the easy answer on this is a qualifying time but we're not running every race by that ethos. among other things every race cannot require a qualifying time because some race has to be the open entry one where you get the time to qualify for the other one. common sense. setting aside not every marathon has to be berlin, NY, or boston. some can have an ethos more like your local fun run. does this disgust you or something?

Hobby: you're over-essentializing. why can't it be both a speed test for the fit ones and a finishing test for the hobby joggers? like you're acting like if this guy says just finishing is the goal, that's now what everyone thinks. i doubt it. the race results would likely suggest otherwise. plenty of folks take it seriously. you likely finish with them. others less so. can the two thoughts coexist?

i did some short road race in NYRRC a couple decades back and was up with the lead pack halfway and top 20 at the end. it struck me weird there were people still finishing as i got my warmups back on and grabbed a bagel and whatnot, but then it hit me that's self centered. most people don't run these things at 4-5 minute clips.

To clarify -- They'd keep the 5k timing open until the 6-hour-pace runners come through ... roughly 45 minutes after the gun (at least that's how I'd do it if I were the timing director).

An evenly paced 9-hour marathoner would arrive at 5k 20 minutes after that, and the timing apparatus would be gone.

i think part of the reason people can perpetrate these attitudes is these are mass, somewhat anonymized races, that they think they will meet the limit for, and they don't know the slowpokes personally or seemingly feel humanity or empathy for them. i think this mentality is different if it's your friend joe from cross country days. we all know joe is slow but of course keep the line open for him. joe's a good guy trying hard.

some folks to me the race is about them, perhaps some key rivals, who cares about the pack, it's a glorified personal time trial or match race. it means less if we let joe finish late even though joe really had nothing to do with their glory in this, which comes from putting up a time or besting some rival. why does that also require a cutoff time? exclusivity? this isn't HS state or college conference anymore. and to be blunt often enough your times aren't THAT level anymore either. rejoin the real world.....

I completely understand what you're saying here.

Maybe I just think it's kind of weird that the marathon has attained this level of cultural cachet. It's a "bucket list" item, like visiting all 50 states or something along those lines.