I know that it's commonly held that Hocker might be a bit better than Teare, but the results do not support it. Teare is 5-1 against Hocker in the 1500/mile. Hocker's only victory over Teare at those distances is when he got 5th and Teare got 6th in the 2022 Prefontaine Classic. At various distances
800: 1-0 Hocker
1500/Mile: 5-1 Teare
3000: 3-1 Teare
5000: 2-2 Tie
Overall: 10-5 Teare
Can't chalk that record up to Hocker being off form every loss.
Hocker has actual credentials including multiple NCAA championship titles, US champ titles and he made it through the prelims, semis, and finished 6th in the Olympics which Teare didn't even make it to. Teare is really good but has only beaten Hocker at meets with little importance ... including a couple of staged time trial meets run during Covid just for PRs among themselves.
Teare did not run the 1500 at the Olympic Trials, therefore I am not shocked that he did not make the Olympic final.
Teare is the reigning US outdoor 1500m champ. So he does have accolades.
Ultimately, Hocker almost definitely has a higher ceiling but I was pushing back against the idea that Teare has lost to Hocker every time they raced when Hocker was healthy. In fact, Hocker has hardly ever beat Teare at all.
..what you have just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
I maintain his 2021 Olympic 6th is more impressive (all things considered) than Centro's gold from 2016.
OK when one focuses on what you placed on parentheses, i.e. all things considered, I get your point. In other words one of the guys (Hocker) got 6th place and the other guy (Centro) won the Gold medal, so there the advantage would go to Hocker of course. The fact that Centro led the entire race to get Gold and Hocker had to come from behind for his 6th place, advantage Hocker. The fact that no American had won Gold in the men’s 1500m for about a Century, whereas we have probably had a few 6th place finishes since then, advantage Hocker. So I do see that in context the advantage is with Hocker but people were confused because you didn’t really spell it out for them.
334 is a good time but 55 isn't a good last lap. 55 needs to be his average pace not his kicking pace imo
Exactly. An American ran like an American. Really earth shattering news.
We've even got happy adjusters implying the 55 is actually worth more than 55 due to all the runners he had to go around.
More earth shattering news, and the plight of every American runner who runs like an American, somehow envisioning he'll pick off the entire field like they are middle schoolers.
It's a wonderful style for advancing through heats. That should be the USATF motto
I maintain his 2021 Olympic 6th is more impressive (all things considered) than Centro's gold from 2016.
OK when one focuses on what you placed on parentheses, i.e. all things considered, I get your point. In other words one of the guys (Hocker) got 6th place and the other guy (Centro) won the Gold medal, so there the advantage would go to Hocker of course. The fact that Centro led the entire race to get Gold and Hocker had to come from behind for his 6th place, advantage Hocker. The fact that no American had won Gold in the men’s 1500m for about a Century, whereas we have probably had a few 6th place finishes since then, advantage Hocker. So I do see that in context the advantage is with Hocker but people were confused because you didn’t really spell it out for them.
All the ppl shouting at me for saying this really don't get my argument. I stated this in a thread back in 2021 when Hocker won 6th place.
The link is below, please read the thread you want to see why it was generally accepted back then by most that Hocker's race was better:
Hear me out……hocker runs 3:31, bests the former OR, PRs by 2 seconds after PRing by 2 seconds in the semifinal, and gets 6th in a loaded field in his FIRST world final event. This, to me, is more impressive than the cr*p-shoo...
OK when one focuses on what you placed on parentheses, i.e. all things considered, I get your point. In other words one of the guys (Hocker) got 6th place and the other guy (Centro) won the Gold medal, so there the advantage would go to Hocker of course. The fact that Centro led the entire race to get Gold and Hocker had to come from behind for his 6th place, advantage Hocker. The fact that no American had won Gold in the men’s 1500m for about a Century, whereas we have probably had a few 6th place finishes since then, advantage Hocker. So I do see that in context the advantage is with Hocker but people were confused because you didn’t really spell it out for them.
All the ppl shouting at me for saying this really don't get my argument. I stated this in a thread back in 2021 when Hocker won 6th place.
The link is below, please read the thread you want to see why it was generally accepted back then by most that Hocker's race was better:
His time was better. Him being younger was more impressive. It being his first international meet was better. Him being in a far superior field was better.
If Centro, even peak Centro, had run in 2021, he would have gone straight out the back and stayed there for the entire race. Not been a top 10 finisher.
His time was better. Him being younger was more impressive. It being his first international meet was better. Him being in a far superior field was better.
If Centro, even peak Centro, had run in 2021, he would have gone straight out the back and stayed there for the entire race. Not been a top 10 finisher.
His time was not better. His time was irrelevant. Times count in time trial races, places count in championship races.
His first international experience is also irrelevant when you’re comparing it to the Olympic Champion. Now, if you want to compare it to Centro’s first international meet, he finished 3rd, or Centro’s first Olympics, he finished 4th.
Peak Centro was in 3:28 shape and may have won the 2021 Olympics.
His time was better. Him being younger was more impressive. It being his first international meet was better. Him being in a far superior field was better.
If Centro, even peak Centro, had run in 2021, he would have gone straight out the back and stayed there for the entire race. Not been a top 10 finisher.
His time was not better. His time was irrelevant. Times count in time trial races, places count in championship races.
His first international experience is also irrelevant when you’re comparing it to the Olympic Champion. Now, if you want to compare it to Centro’s first international meet, he finished 3rd, or Centro’s first Olympics, he finished 4th.
Peak Centro was in 3:28 shape and may have won the 2021 Olympics.
Are you trolling or serious?
If peak Centro was in 3:28 shape he would have run 3:28. His lifetime PR is 1.00 seconds better than what Hocker ran at the 2021 Olympics, and he only ran faster than Hocker's 3:31.40 TWICE IN HIS ENTIRE CAREER, both of which were time trials in Monaco. There is absolutely no way he would have run 3:27-28 in the Olympics. To argue that is pure head-in-the-clouds BS.
And yes, Hocker's time was better. First you state his time was not better, then you say it was irrelevant. You can only have one here, because Hocker's 3:31.40 was mathematically (much, much) better than Centro's 3:50.00.
Also, I am not comparing Centro's career to Hocker's. I'm saying that Hocker's 2021 Olympic 1,500m final is better than Centro's 2016 Olympic final. What Centro did at worlds in 2011 or Olympics in 2012 is irrelevant.
And by the way, Centro got 10th and 9th in those Monaco races when he ran 3:30.4 and 3:31.8. He was never a time trial guy and got incredibly lucky in 2016. He would have gotten smoked in 2021.
His time was not better. His time was irrelevant. Times count in time trial races, places count in championship races.
His first international experience is also irrelevant when you’re comparing it to the Olympic Champion. Now, if you want to compare it to Centro’s first international meet, he finished 3rd, or Centro’s first Olympics, he finished 4th.
Peak Centro was in 3:28 shape and may have won the 2021 Olympics.
Are you trolling or serious?
If peak Centro was in 3:28 shape he would have run 3:28. His lifetime PR is 1.00 seconds better than what Hocker ran at the 2021 Olympics, and he only ran faster than Hocker's 3:31.40 TWICE IN HIS ENTIRE CAREER, both of which were time trials in Monaco. There is absolutely no way he would have run 3:27-28 in the Olympics. To argue that is pure head-in-the-clouds BS.
And yes, Hocker's time was better. First you state his time was not better, then you say it was irrelevant. You can only have one here, because Hocker's 3:31.40 was mathematically (much, much) better than Centro's 3:50.00.
Also, I am not comparing Centro's career to Hocker's. I'm saying that Hocker's 2021 Olympic 1,500m final is better than Centro's 2016 Olympic final. What Centro did at worlds in 2011 or Olympics in 2012 is irrelevant.
IQ level 82 post. I’m done responding to non sense. Anyone who truly thinks an also-ran’s race is better than an Olympic Champion is truly a short bus brain.
So no one wants to debate anymore. Guess everyone agrees with my points then.....so glad to hear it.
Well of course nobody wants to debate with you. You are pointing out the obvious. Like when Mo Farah won the 2012 Olympics 5000m in 13:41, yeah he won Olympic Gold BUT in the Tokyo Olympics 5000m Grant Fisher got 9th in 13:08. So anyone in their right mind would know that you would rather have that 9th place finish because it is like 33 seconds faster. Duh! So Grant Fisher’s 9th is superior to Mo Farah’s Olympic Gold. Duh!
I believe that this is the first lyrics video to this song on youtube so enjoy...i own nothing all credit goes to spin doctors and appropriate labels and com...
Cole Hocker would do well to get one championship medal in his lifetime. I'd but the O/U at 1.5. Matt Centrowitz has 4, and two of them are gold. If you want, we'll count the indoor gold as a half, so 3.5.
The Rushmore of U.S. 1500 & mile runners is Bernard Lagat, Matt Centrowitz, Jim Ryun, and Steve Scott. Hocker has a long way to go to pass Scott, let's focus on that before we start comparing him to the other three.
His time was not better. His time was irrelevant. Times count in time trial races, places count in championship races.
His first international experience is also irrelevant when you’re comparing it to the Olympic Champion. Now, if you want to compare it to Centro’s first international meet, he finished 3rd, or Centro’s first Olympics, he finished 4th.
Peak Centro was in 3:28 shape and may have won the 2021 Olympics.
Are you trolling or serious?
If peak Centro was in 3:28 shape he would have run 3:28. His lifetime PR is 1.00 seconds better than what Hocker ran at the 2021 Olympics, and he only ran faster than Hocker's 3:31.40 TWICE IN HIS ENTIRE CAREER, both of which were time trials in Monaco. There is absolutely no way he would have run 3:27-28 in the Olympics. To argue that is pure head-in-the-clouds BS.
And yes, Hocker's time was better. First you state his time was not better, then you say it was irrelevant. You can only have one here, because Hocker's 3:31.40 was mathematically (much, much) better than Centro's 3:50.00.
Also, I am not comparing Centro's career to Hocker's. I'm saying that Hocker's 2021 Olympic 1,500m final is better than Centro's 2016 Olympic final. What Centro did at worlds in 2011 or Olympics in 2012 is irrelevant.
Who beat more world/oly champions and medalists in their respective races?
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