'Woman' with stubble wins first stage of female cycling race

So all sports should be just men, right? So these trans athletes will have no girls to battle now will they? Let a trans athlete battle men, cool.

The best humans at a sport will win yes. We do this in all areas of life. Actually its sexism to have it any other way. You dont think people with low iq should have their own university courses?

I always figured "virtue signalling" meant making a stand about something for personal social gain (or internet points). I thought it meant grandstanding about something so that others who believe in what you're saying will like you better... sort of like reverse trolling. That is, the grandstanding and how others view you after you've sent out your virtue signal is more important to you that the cause you're promoting.

A guy I know went on a rant recently about how he would be happy for women to never win another sports event if it meant trans women got to take part freely and... I mean, it appealed to exactly the type of people he wanted to impress: non-sportspeople who don't understand or care about athletics of any sort, but who are heavily invested in social media gender politics. These left-leaning folks all mashed "like" on a post about women quite literally losing to make others happy. Signal successfully sent.

1st out of 19? How many other cycling races happened over the weekend? A lot more than that?! Well I don't care. I think it's pretty clear women's sports are broken and need men to step in & fix things. Out of everything wrong with women's sports, this is the best use of my time/energy. This affects all of our lives in a fundamental way. I'm going to vote for president based on how much candidates speak out about things like this.

Huh? Distinctions based on intelligence and intellectual ability are made throughout the educational system, at every grade level.

There are plenty of schools, programs and classes for students who are intellectually "gifted" and academically advanced - accelerated learning, AP courses, "gifted and talented programs," highly selective colleges and unis like the Ivies, MIT, Stanford.

Conversely, at all levels of education from pre-school through college/uni and graduate work, there are schools, programs, classes and individualized classroom and course-work accommodations for students with special education needs (SEN), including intellectual deficits and a wide range of learning disabilties and learning differences.

Even at colleges/unis that base admissions on highly or fairly selective academic criteria to insure that most of the student body will be highly or reasonably intelligent, there are usually courses geared towards students who aren't as bright or inclined to academic rigor as others. Such as "rocks for jocks."

Some pretty selective colleges/unis in the USA not only have individual courses especially for "people with low IQs" relative to the rest of the student body, they have entire academic programs as well as special dorms, dining plans, support services, social life options and rules of discipline for "people with low [or lower] IQ." Provided, that is, those people are males who are really, really good at a sport that said schools value highly and make a great deal of money from. Principally American football and men's basketball - but sometimes some other sports too.

But all that said, special college/uni courses for "people with low IQ" are not the apt analogy here. Because sports categories are based on physical abilities, not intellectual ones.

In one US cycling race last weekend, the female riders who came in second and third behind a trans-identified male in the women's division in their age bracket refused to take their places on the podium alongside the fella who won. Nearly all the other racers and the spectators "bailed on the podiums" too.

Still, the male winner in the women's 40-49 group - Lesley J. Mumford - proudly stood on the podium alone and posed for pictures in a self-celebratory and congratulatory stance:

In a written statement posted on social media, Mumford boasted that he placed 6th in the women's race overall, and crowed that "I am beyond pleased with my effort." However, Mumford did add this coda:

Lastly, I have no idea why so many people bailed before the podiums, but they did. I swear I wasn't the only one in my age group [competing in the women's division].

What Mumford doesn't mention is whether he was the only one who's male racing in the women's division in his age group or overall. Given how many males are now competing and cleaning up in women's cycling, chances are that Mumford wasn't the only fella in the women's event.

You mean, like all those rightwing cultural warriors who had zero interest in women's sports until there was a trans athlete? And then they call for women to voluntarily give up their opportunities to compete (mass boycott) or more men to invade into women's competition just to "make a point" so that more women would be denied their opportunities to win.

And as soon as trans athletes are excluded, they instantly lose all their interest in women's sports, as we saw in this year's NCAA Swimming. One guy even compared women to vacuum cleaners.

Yeah, that's classical virtue signaling.

Can anybody elaborate. Do you need any documentation to identify as a women or to prove in some fashion that you as a competitor is a woman to enter a women's event? Or do you just turn up on the day and say, 'sure, I'm a woman, let's go.'

Sorry, 'are a woman'.

Who cares? I don't. I've said this multiple times before, I am sick and tired of trying to take the side of women on this topic - no matter what evidence, facts or pleas for common sense are presented I invariably get shot down (as I suspect many do) and labelled as some intolerant, trans-phobic, right wing "trumpster" (I'm none of those). So you know what, good. I embrace this now. Let them compete how they feel - but let's just be a) consistent and b) respectful of people's feelings and not, for example, decide who is in our opinions "genuine" or not about their chosen identities.

No skin off my back man - I can't wait until I see the womens 100m at the Olympics won in 10.3 - bring it on, good for the sport and all about progress right? Right?

Each competition has its own rule, unless it is sanctioned by the governing body of the sport. For example, I think BAA was the only race organizer ever asked the proof of my age. So if a trans woman shows up at a local hobby jogger race, I think she will be allowed to compete as a woman.

I don't know how many of those cycling races are sanctioned by UCI or its national affiliation. If it is a sanctioned race, you cannot simply declare you are a woman.

Well that raises an interesting point right because it seems like the "freedom" to do this isn't exactly equal and equitable. Case in point the Canadian powerlifter who chose to identify as a woman, enter contest and destroy the existing contest record by like 150lbs or something of that extent. We then started having people questioning the validity or genuineness of their "choice" or their "feeling", which to me doesn't make sense because a person's choice or feeling is theirs and theirs only irrespective of what anyone may think.

So the simple answer is, if we want to go down this path in no world does anyone have the right to question or ask for any sort of proof of choice, feeling, agenda or motive. It can't work both ways.

(I had a great joke to insert after my last sentence but I'll keep it "professional")

World Athletics changed the rule to make sure this will not happen.

But why should we let fact get in the way of a good narrative?

Did they? Really? Seriously? Thanks for that insight mate - I think the "womens 100m in 10.3" was more metaphorically speaking if you understand that concept - but I guess that went right over you huh.

Thank you.

Not about the best humans it's about the best girls vs girls and men vs men.

There will never be a male Dallas Cowboy Cheerleader,,,,,,,why is that? Try all that trans silliness in other countries that don't play this foolishness,

No man has any business on a girls softball team.

Haven't a lot of studies been done with trans cyclists? The studies may be flawed, but they are peer reviewed. Male physiology is hard to reverse with estrogen therapy as early exposure to testosterone influences overall development. It seems that in many sports, men have a 10-12% advantage and hormone therapy seems to diminish male to female performance by about 5-6%.

One very readable article is published by the NIH and references track results.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Transwoman Elite Athletes: Their Extra Percentage Relative to Female Physiology

There is increasing debate as to whether transwoman athletes should be included in the elite female competition. Most elite sports are divided into male and female divisions because of the greater athletic performance display...

Open link

It’s easy to see on this thread that men are asked to run an ideological gauntlet before they are “allowed” to advocate for men’s and women’s sports remaining separate. One male poster simply suggested that men and women are biologically different men have a physical advantage, and they should compete separately. For this, he was immediately given the third degree, female poster, wanting to know if he thought of the kitchen, etc.

Hey, if this is the sort of nonsense that men will have to endure from women for being in favor of the survival of women’s sports, forget it. I’m not prepared to fight the transgender activists on one hand, and the actual women I’m trying to help on the other.

Make up your mind ladies. Do you want to protect women’s sports, or do you want to make sure every one of your allies meets your ideological checklist? I doubt you can have both.