I'll buy an EV when it takes the same amount to charge one as it takes to fill a gas tank. If I want to get into my car and drive from Maine to California I don't want to have to worry about finding fuel. I don't have to with gas but do with electric. I also want to pull in, fill up in 5 minutes, and go another 400 mikes. Not sit for an hour to get enough to get back on the road.
I have no philosophical opposition to them but I want fueling to be as convenient and as quick as gas with no additional effort or time commitment from me
This.
You're asking people to install a charger at the home ($) then remember to plug in overnight and pay ($) a higher electric bill....
...or...
Just go down the street and fill up in less than 5min.
Hybrids have a future. Full plug in EVs do not.
Alan
I know a dozen people with EVs. Cannot recall one ever saying they forgot to charge when they got home. Electricity is pretty cheap.
For the folks that fear not being able to charge/range problems...here is what I propose. The US government should start a campaign that makes an offer to all businesses with large parking lots (I'm looking at you supermarkets, Home Depot, Walmart, etc.) to fund building solar array canopies over the entire lot. The businesses can take these funds to build the arrays on the condition that they allow the public to charge under the canopy for free. This is a win-win. Keep your car out of the direct sun under the canopy. Make use of worthless parking lots. Free charging everywhere. Good for climate. Drives business to these stores (i.e. shop while you charge).
If you like this idea, please talk it up!
Solar panels do not provide the demand (kW) that is required to recharge an EV. Solar panels produce energy (kWh) but charging an EV with a solar panel would be slower than the slowest slow trickle chargers.
People who run out of gas on the highway call AAA for gas or a tow. EV owners without a charge would just call them for a charge if there were enough to make it worthwhile.
Still havent read a single argument why an electric car would be better. Alls the arguments like. its fine for commuting etc also apply to gas powered cars.
I bought a plug in hybrid a couple of years ago, and when I make local trips I get around 80 mpg. I won't consider a full EV until they address range anxiety. I'd want to get in the 800-1000 mile range both to make the regional trips (about 4 or 5 per year) and if the grid goes down like it did here for a week. And, I don't need to be lectured by the EVangelicals that an 800 mile range is unreasonable.
1,000 mile range? So you want to drive 16 hrs without stopping for food or a rest? I get those who want a 500-600 mile range (los angeles to san fransisco plus a 200 mile buffer, or NYC to washington DC and back with a big buffer as well). But 1,000, you'd fill up at least 4-5 times at the gas station on that trip. I mean 1,000 miles that is NYC to Orlando, or Los Angeles to Seatle. I think 99.9% of the population will be happy with 500 mile ranges, but we aren't there yet for a reasonable price.
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Saying you won't buy an EV because of the lack of charging facilities is short-sighted. As demand for EV's has grown, the charging facilities have grown. As it continues to grow, those facilities will continue to grow. Montana, Wyoming, and ND had no public charging ports in 2012, but 200 in 2018 and about 550 now. There are over 37,000 in California. Alabama has 622. Texas has 5,546. Kansas has 949. Utah has 1,989. The lack of charging points is no longer a reason not to get one.
Nor is service. Service costs are extremely low because they have very few moving parts. That's an economic risk, putting car parts suppliers and auto repair shops out of business due to EV's not needing them. Battery replacement can be an issue, but some of them can be done very cheaply and you have plenty of things that can become expensive quickly and add up to more in internal combustion engines. Business Insider says ev's are 31% cheaper to maintain.
Ford, GM, Toyota, Nissan, Volvo, Mercedes, BMW, even Porsche all make EVs. Volvo plans on phasing out new ICEs before the end of the decade.
They aren't doing this because they are a flash in the pan; they are doing this because EVs are an evolutionary step forward.
EVs have better acceleration (and towing) potential because of the tremendous torque they produce. They handle better despite being heavier because they have a lower center of gravity since the heavy parts - the batteries - are in the floor. They require less maintenance because they have fewer moving parts. Many of them already offer similar range to my ICE car.
There are still some shortcomings - charging obviously takes a lot longer than filling a gas tank (although for many people, they will rarely need to actually deal with that); cost is higher; etc. - but that's simply part of the transition process. Gas powered vehicles went through the same process.
And to those who lament government tax incentives and declare that the market should decide if EVs are feasible I would tell you that you are ignoring a long history of government intervention into the conventional automobile market and even more intervention into the oil markets. I'd also point out that the conventional automobile market demonstrates aspects of market failure (go learn what an externality is in economics and then consider whether the conventional automobile market has been forced to internalize those externalities; consider barriers to entry; etc.).
The technology is here, it is good enough, and it is going to continue to get markedly better.
Ford, GM, Toyota, Nissan, Volvo, Mercedes, BMW, even Porsche all make EVs. Volvo plans on phasing out new ICEs before the end of the decade.
They aren't doing this because they are a flash in the pan; they are doing this because EVs are an evolutionary step forward.
EVs have better acceleration (and towing) potential because of the tremendous torque they produce. They handle better despite being heavier because they have a lower center of gravity since the heavy parts - the batteries - are in the floor. They require less maintenance because they have fewer moving parts. Many of them already offer similar range to my ICE car.
There are still some shortcomings - charging obviously takes a lot longer than filling a gas tank (although for many people, they will rarely need to actually deal with that); cost is higher; etc. - but that's simply part of the transition process. Gas powered vehicles went through the same process.
And to those who lament government tax incentives and declare that the market should decide if EVs are feasible I would tell you that you are ignoring a long history of government intervention into the conventional automobile market and even more intervention into the oil markets. I'd also point out that the conventional automobile market demonstrates aspects of market failure (go learn what an externality is in economics and then consider whether the conventional automobile market has been forced to internalize those externalities; consider barriers to entry; etc.).
The technology is here, it is good enough, and it is going to continue to get markedly better.
yes the technology was already here a 100 years ago. It is just pushed now by government regulation and thats why it has success.
A plug in hybrid makes more sense if you are only going to have one vehicle. Trying to make long trips in an EV seems like a nightmare. Since many people can only afford one car, it makes sense that a large percentage of the population wouldn’t consider an EV. Couple that with a large percentage of people living in apartments or renting where charging isn’t much of an option, and I am surprised the percentage of people isn’t higher.
A plug in hybrid makes more sense if you are only going to have one vehicle. Trying to make long trips in an EV seems like a nightmare. Since many people can only afford one car, it makes sense that a large percentage of the population wouldn’t consider an EV. Couple that with a large percentage of people living in apartments or renting where charging isn’t much of an option, and I am surprised the percentage of people isn’t higher.
I agree. This may have changed recently, but a year or so ago Norway had the highest per capita ownership of electric cars. But 90% of those electric car owners also owned a conventional car because if they wanted to do something like put the car on a ferry and drive to Spain they didn't want to deal with having to charge the EV. And in the neighborhoods I was in when I lived in Boston would have made an EV essentially useless. There was no way you could charge overnight because you only had street parking.
That’s good because there aren’t enough EVs available for everyone to buy one.
But note, they said lack of education about EVs, how they work and charging options, etc. was a main factor in those that said they wouldn’t consider buying one.
Education means reading more than the headline of an article.
Yes, you should take your own advice. I work for the big 3. Do you know how long it takes to charge one car and the long lines that will come with that? Do you realize the time it will take to install one charging unit? Yes, keep reading those headlines as they are fooling "you" to the next level.
People who run out of gas on the highway call AAA for gas or a tow. EV owners without a charge would just call them for a charge if there were enough to make it worthwhile.
You of course glossed over the facts. When highways shut down and people are trapped, getting gas or having it in your vehicle is way more easier than getting a charge from AAA. There are so many scenarios that I could explain that prove the major issues that will arise from electric cars that I truly don't think you have the mind to understand.
I bought a plug in hybrid a couple of years ago, and when I make local trips I get around 80 mpg. I won't consider a full EV until they address range anxiety. I'd want to get in the 800-1000 mile range both to make the regional trips (about 4 or 5 per year) and if the grid goes down like it did here for a week. And, I don't need to be lectured by the EVangelicals that an 800 mile range is unreasonable.
1,000 mile range? So you want to drive 16 hrs without stopping for food or a rest? I get those who want a 500-600 mile range (los angeles to san fransisco plus a 200 mile buffer, or NYC to washington DC and back with a big buffer as well). But 1,000, you'd fill up at least 4-5 times at the gas station on that trip. I mean 1,000 miles that is NYC to Orlando, or Los Angeles to Seatle. I think 99.9% of the population will be happy with 500 mile ranges, but we aren't there yet for a reasonable price.
I have a 15 gallon tank, 14.9 to be specific. At 35 mpg on the highway (which I get with my Equinox), a full tank of gas from the start of the trip, I would have to stop 2 times at most to fill up before hitting 1000 miles and I'd still have a ton of gas left over after the 2nd fill up.
so since 2015 close to no cost reduction? If you would graph the efficiency increases of gas engines you would also see increases. gas engines are much much better now than even 20 years ago. but taxes on gas and gasoline cars have been steadly increased while electricity less so and evs are even subsidized. thats the main reason. after they have killed of gas cars through taxes and bans they will put the same taxes on evs though and driving a car will just be much much more expensive than before.
If your EV runs out of power on the road and you have to walk to the charging station, what do you carry instead of a gas can?
When's the last time you had to walk to a gas station with a can to carry gas back to your car? Just wondering what kind of person gets themselves into that kind of situation.
I have been driving for 42 years and I have never once had to do that.
I did coast into a gas station one time when I was 18 or 19. Since then I am a firm believer in not getting below a 1/4 tank!
The average Joe will buy an EV when it is the only game in town, or it's way cheaper and more appealing to buy, and/or if there are additional incentives to do so. The public charging infrastructure will have to become utterly ubiquitous, as in everywhere, and drivers will need to be able to add substantial mileage in 5 minutes or less.
Like it or not, after multiple generations of drivers in a country obsessed with ICE cars, the EV will be compared to the best aspects of ICE cars by most drivers. EVs will have to be WAY obviously appealing before non-early-adapters buy in.
Still havent read a single argument why an electric car would be better. Alls the arguments like. its fine for commuting etc also apply to gas powered cars.
Essentially no maintenance, never having to stop for gas, significantly better performance per dollar, 4x cheaper fuel... who would want that?
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