Predictably, a lot of you aren't really engaging with what Melly actually wrote and are just complaining about SJWs instead, which is fine but kinda boring. Still, I don't find his argument very convincing.
As we all know, America is the only country that cares about the mile, and American distance running in general is dominated by white people, even as the best distance runners in the world are African. So the issue comes down to why there aren't more African-American distance runners, and Melly would probably argue that it's about systemic racism and a lack of opportunities for black kids. There's probably some truth to that, but I think that it's more of a cultural thing, distance running just isn't cool or high status. Of course that's also the case for white kids, but in general white parents are probably more likely to steer their kids towards such endeavors. Then there's also the whole East African vs West African genetics thing, but that's another can of worms.
Anyway, I wish we paid more attention to African distance runners because they're incredible, but track is sadly a niche sport, and a sub 3:30 1500 or sub 13 5k just isn't relatable or marketable to the average American. It's fair to say that racism is always a factor on some level, but Americans are generally okay with celebrating black people in sports that we care about. Melly is a smart guy and I like a lot of his takes, but this one seems to have been written mostly for clicks, which I guess worked pretty well.
I certainly think the LR community pays attention to African distance runners plenty. Lots of coverage about Kipchoge through and through. Tough all around for distance runners to stay healthy and there are lots of flashes in the pan. BroJos do a good job in previews and reviews of races in pointing runners PRs and history.
Where are you getting your facts about white parents steering their kids towards 'such endeavors'? And when you say 'Americans' it is coming across as meaning white people.
It really comes down to economics. Financially speaking, mid distance runners are probably the least paid athletes in the sport compared to Marathon runners and sprinters if you're talking about opportunities for black kids. Anyone can go run and see how fast they are. How much did Usain Bolt pull in during his prime?? I think he was earning $33mil per year. Name a mid D guying earning that. 'Fastest Man in the World' carries some cache and I love watching those races, but it takes a lot of talent to get there. If you're running 10.3 in the 100 you probably won't get there, but if you can catch a pass, you can make a good living in the NFL. And if you're anywhere else in the world, Soccer is the game.
Citius Mag putting out just an absolutely atrocious take:
”The 4-minute mile is a white man’s achievement. Our sub-four heroes, from Roger Bannister to Jim Ryun to Hobbs Kessler, tend to be white and are always male. As in all aspects of American culture, our historical marginalization of women and people of color, combined with our implicit biases about which athletes we choose to lionize, means that the achievements of white men receive a disproportionate amount of praise and attention. The best middle-distance runners in the world are African, but they don’t run the mile: they primarily run the 1500m. And as a result, Hicham El Guerrouj is not nearly the household name that he might otherwise be.”
By this thinking then isn't the 100 racist? Seems only blacks get the attention and are household names. Everyone knows Bolt, Lewis, Richardson but who remembers Allen Wells?
This is the final straw for me. Used to be a big supporter of Citius, but I have unsubscribed/unfollowed. Not looking for my world to be an echo chamber, but I'm also not going to read this utter rubbish. Best of luck to Chris and Kyle, I hope they turn the ship around.
Predictably, a lot of you aren't really engaging with what Melly actually wrote and are just complaining about SJWs instead, which is fine but kinda boring. Still, I don't find his argument very convincing.
As we all know, America is the only country that cares about the mile, and American distance running in general is dominated by white people, even as the best distance runners in the world are African. So the issue comes down to why there aren't more African-American distance runners, and Melly would probably argue that it's about systemic racism and a lack of opportunities for black kids. There's probably some truth to that, but I think that it's more of a cultural thing, distance running just isn't cool or high status. Of course that's also the case for white kids, but in general white parents are probably more likely to steer their kids towards such endeavors. Then there's also the whole East African vs West African genetics thing, but that's another can of worms.
Anyway, I wish we paid more attention to African distance runners because they're incredible, but track is sadly a niche sport, and a sub 3:30 1500 or sub 13 5k just isn't relatable or marketable to the average American. It's fair to say that racism is always a factor on some level, but Americans are generally okay with celebrating black people in sports that we care about. Melly is a smart guy and I like a lot of his takes, but this one seems to have been written mostly for clicks, which I guess worked pretty well.
I certainly think the LR community pays attention to African distance runners plenty. Lots of coverage about Kipchoge through and through. Tough all around for distance runners to stay healthy and there are lots of flashes in the pan. BroJos do a good job in previews and reviews of races in pointing runners PRs and history.
Where are you getting your facts about white parents steering their kids towards 'such endeavors'? And when you say 'Americans' it is coming across as meaning white people.
It really comes down to economics. Financially speaking, mid distance runners are probably the least paid athletes in the sport compared to Marathon runners and sprinters if you're talking about opportunities for black kids. Anyone can go run and see how fast they are. How much did Usain Bolt pull in during his prime?? I think he was earning $33mil per year. Name a mid D guying earning that. 'Fastest Man in the World' carries some cache and I love watching those races, but it takes a lot of talent to get there. If you're running 10.3 in the 100 you probably won't get there, but if you can catch a pass, you can make a good living in the NFL. And if you're anywhere else in the world, Soccer is the game.
Letsrun is one thing, I think the Brojos do a great job covering the whole sport and not just Americans. I'm talking more about the general sports watching public.
Anecdotally, I'm a white guy who would've quit cross country after my second practice if my dad didn't make me stick with it. I admit that I don't have any actual data here, but I have a pretty strong hunch that higher-income parents (so generally white) are more likely to take an active role in managing their kids' extracurriculars, especially as it relates to getting into college.
Agreed about the economics aspect, though there isn't that much money in any track discipline relatively speaking. Bolt is one of one, but other top sprinters aren't making that much more than the best mid d guys. Every kid in the inner city dreams of making it in the NBA or NFL, and a lot of the ones who can't start for their high school teams end up sprinting instead. Just how it is.
I was once on my way to my first taste of sub-4:00 goodness, hitting the bell in 3:29 and change. As I moved into the lead on the backstraight, I looked up at the video screen, only to see a string of pasty faces behind my own. Not even a bit of Latinx swarthiness to break the monotonous blockade of white privilege. Instantly my stomach sank, my legs wobbled, and I sank to the infield in a heap, eyes bawling out their grief for the centuries of oppression that led to this dismal and ignominious result. If the mile was going to be racist, at least I was not going to be the enabler. I ripped off my bib and stalked off to the concession for a double tall almond milk frappucinno in which to at least find solace in something brown, warm and reassuring.
(1) Is a very weak strawman argument, followed by several even weaker strawman arguments.
I think it shows how easily they are riled by insinuations of racism..
The article is probably just poorly written and thought out. We do know that the mile is an event more highly regarded in the USA with its stubborn adherence to an archaic imperial system and we do know that it still is only recognised because of the original 4 min barrier.
The equivalent in the universally accepted metric 1,500m Olympic distance is about 3:43. Yet even outside USA, go to your next party of athletics ignoramusus and exclaim, "I have run 3:40 for the 1,500"...or would you rather pull out your 3:59 mile?
Citius Mag putting out just an absolutely atrocious take:
”The 4-minute mile is a white man’s achievement. Our sub-four heroes, from Roger Bannister to Jim Ryun to Hobbs Kessler, tend to be white and are always male. As in all aspects of American culture, our historical marginalization of women and people of color, combined with our implicit biases about which athletes we choose to lionize, means that the achievements of white men receive a disproportionate amount of praise and attention. The best middle-distance runners in the world are African, but they don’t run the mile: they primarily run the 1500m. And as a result, Hicham El Guerrouj is not nearly the household name that he might otherwise be.”
The quote comes from a piece from David Melly (I added the link to the first post as there was no attribution)- whom I coached at Cornell for a year. I used to really enjoy talking to him at practice as he was into politcs and ideas. The fact that he had very different conclusions than me wasn't really an issue. After he graduated, I bought him a book explaining how it was imperative that liberals turn away from identity politics.
The Once and Future Liberal: After Identity Politics
From one of the country’s most admired political thinkers, an urgent wake-up call to American liberals to turn from the divisive politics of identity and develop a vision of our future that can persuade all citizens that they share a common destiny.
Is this column confirmation that he never read it? I should text him and find out.
If he did, I guess he didn't learn from it. It blows my mind that the average liberal doesn't realize their constant virtue signaling and ridiculous takes like this are what led to Trump.
I hope he reads the book or just listens to 10 seconds from Morgan Freeman.
Melly is an absolute clown as is this piece. I’ve watched this guy for the past year spout this and that about “equality” while he constantly tears down the achievements and performances of other runners (who are clearly more talented than him).
Ironically enough, all his supporters are those with pronouns as headlines who don’t realize their hero is a keyboard bully compensating for something that is clearly missing in his life: ATTENTION.
I know people who specifically will not buy Tracksmith gear because they’re associated with this bully. Only he could turn breaking the 4-minute mile into racist act. Disgusting.
(1) Is a very weak strawman argument, followed by several even weaker strawman arguments. Citius did not say running sub-4 was racist, nor did they say that black athletes have not achieved fame/$ in the sport.
Of course we all know they didn't say that. But those who Citius have triggered need to find something to disagree with because otherwise (God forbid) they might have to engage with what Citius actually said.
(2) Is full of people desperate to disagree, but in doing so providing great evidence for Citius' point. The best/funniest of these is "So fast milers are white? What about the fastest 800m, 5000m".
Does JackHammer actually think there's some magic in 3.5-4min races where white people do better, that doesn't apply in ~2min or ~7min races?! Probably not, he probably know that the best milers in the world run the 1500m. Either way, his reply is the best possible evidence for Citius' point that white milers receive a disproportionate amount of praise and attention (note: this entire debate is obviously U.S. focused).
You are defending the article. Whether the reactions and responses to the article involved strawman and exaggerations or not, you are defending this really silly article that reeks of woke attention getting.
Erm, I think sub-4 is sub-4 & doesn't have to be tied to race but why is Rojo going at Melly the way he's going at Melly. I mean, take a look at the spaces you've created. It's fine, you don't see race & never will. Even if people think his take went too far it doesn't discredit the obvious treatment white (male) runners get on here & in other spaces.
Best I can tell, Jakob Ingebrigtsen's world record in the indoor 1500m today was the first time a man born outside of Africa set a distance world record (800m and up, not counting ultras) since Brazil's Ronaldo da Costa broke the marathon WR in 1998.
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