missBS wrote:
Again, you fail to even consider anything that I outlined. As someone else said, not sure if you’re being intentionally obtuse or if you simply don’t know what you’re talking about.
Perhaps one day you will realize what I’m talking about, but I doubt it.
No one knows what you are talking about because it's the single dumbest take ever. I just can't imagine what the rest of your life is like if you are capable of coming up with such cockamamie ideas.
Hocker ran the same number of races this year as the medalists combined did. Hocker's performance is insane when considering everything that did this year. He would have been in the hunt if his legs were as fresh as the medalists. Expect him t run 3:28 as soon as he turns pro.
My my, what an angry elf you are. Life is pretty good rn, was a runner in college, living and working in NC, have two small babies and a wife at home.
Not that you asked LOL.
missBS wrote:
My my, what an angry elf you are. Life is pretty good rn, was a runner in college, living and working in NC, have two small babies and a wife at home.
Not that you asked LOL.
Not angry at all, just simply pointing out why no one gets your point. Because it's from A Beautiful Mind.
te5n1k wrote:
Ernest wrote:
Some here were predicting sub 3:30 for Hocker - clearly wishful thinking.
Back to back PBs ands 3:31.4 show a lot of promise.
But…
Centro’s PB is a full second better than Hocker.
He was a top-tier for over a half decade.
While 2016 was a weird race, a win’s a win. Oly Gold trumps 6th every time.
NUTS to be crowning Hocker as America’s 1500 GOAT
hes not the 1500 goat now obviously, but he is the present and future of the 1500 in america (and that was obvious before the trials). he has a ways to go, but off to an unrivaled start (as far as US men go).
Sigh.
Ryun.
After watching the race, I am impressed with Hocker's time, but not with his race. Cole was never a factor in that race, and his kick wasn't going to save the day when hanging back that far with a fast final lap from the leaders. His final finish puts a flattering gloss on a bad tactical race.
This isn't meant be be negative, It was Cole's first final in among the big boys, and I suspect he will learn from it. At the same age and with a lot more high-level experience, Jakob gets his tactics wrong from time to time. Cole should have two or three more Olympics chances and several WC changes before he is done.
SeattleSilver wrote:
After watching the race, I am impressed with Hocker's time, but not with his race. Cole was never a factor in that race, and his kick wasn't going to save the day when hanging back that far with a fast final lap from the leaders. His final finish puts a flattering gloss on a bad tactical race.
This isn't meant be be negative, It was Cole's first final in among the big boys, and I suspect he will learn from it. At the same age and with a lot more high-level experience, Jakob gets his tactics wrong from time to time. Cole should have two or three more Olympics chances and several WC changes before he is done.
Cole is not ready to run 3:29. If he had pushed harder to stay within range of the medalists, he would have ended up at 3:32 or slower.
Nick Symmonds will always be best known for being part of that incredible London 800m final. Yes, I am well aware of WC and other meets but, when you mention his name, that race is the first people think of. 5th place in the race of the decade got a lot of street cred and marketing points
SeattleSilver wrote:
After watching the race, I am impressed with Hocker's time, but not with his race. Cole was never a factor in that race, and his kick wasn't going to save the day when hanging back that far with a fast final lap from the leaders. His final finish puts a flattering gloss on a bad tactical race.
This isn't meant be be negative, It was Cole's first final in among the big boys, and I suspect he will learn from it. At the same age and with a lot more high-level experience, Jakob gets his tactics wrong from time to time. Cole should have two or three more Olympics chances and several WC changes before he is done.
Actually, Hocker lived up to Know Thyself. He ran close to a perfect race. 400 m 57,4 no 12 400-800 56.4 no 11 800-1200 56,5 no 9 and then 1200-1500 41.1.
fujimaster wrote:
the macdaddy og wrote:
Man, I love hocker, but this is a very dumb post.
Why? Faster time, faster competition. Better performances all around. Is rai Benjamin's silver not more impressive than any previous gold?
The objective is to win the race.
It’s a race.
“Impressive”? What does that have to do with anything?
Gymnastics, diving, skateboarding, figure skating, even boxing. Those sports are judged by style. Which is fine. Buy That’s not how it works in track.
Of course he is. He had a ridiculous NCAA schedule this year. He ran as many races as the 3 medalists combined ran this year. Imagine what Hocker would have run had he run a similar schedule. Or imagine what those three would have run if they had raced 3 times as many races this year. Hocker will run 3:29 as soon as he turns pro.
missBS wrote:
Hear me out……hocker runs 3:31, bests the former OR, PRs by 2 seconds after PRing by 2 seconds in the semifinal, and gets 6th in a loaded field in his FIRST world final event.
This, to me, is more impressive than the cr*p-shoot that was the 2016 final that went out in like 2:18, setting up a free for all, where the best tactician, not the best runner, won.
In 2020, the best runner won, and the best runners in the world placed where they should have, that being at the front of the pack.
This race is more impressive than Centros gold, and certainly better than the 3:49 Centro ran a couple weeks ago.
Sorry, man. You make a reasoned argument but every single runner in history would swap all of their good performances and even World Records for an Olympic gold, no matter how they won it. I'm willing to bet Paula Radcliffe would happily have finished her career with a 2:25 PB if she had the gold as well
Paul Cheerio wrote:
Of course he is. He had a ridiculous NCAA schedule this year. He ran as many races as the 3 medalists combined ran this year. Imagine what Hocker would have run had he run a similar schedule. Or imagine what those three would have run if they had raced 3 times as many races this year. Hocker will run 3:29 as soon as he turns pro.
Maybe he should have run a smarter schedule then and raced less in college.
Why? He dominated in the NCAA. You obviously were not an NCAA champ so you don't understand the significance of being a national champ. He wasn't focused on the Olympics until after the NCAA season ended.
Kobbs Hessler wrote:
"Olympic Champion" ends all debate. That said, Hocker ran amazingly well and showed us that his potential is unlimited. Extremely happy for him.
Matt ran a better smarter race, but his gold is not as good as Jakob's gold.
Also, one race does not define a runner's career.
To me, the most impressive US men's 1500s/miles in the past 40 years:
1. Centro Gold
2. Lagat, various
3. Hocker yesterday
4. Webb HS mile record at Pre
5. Kessler HS 1500 record
Arete wrote:
Gold in 3:50 cries out very, very lucky.
The race is not always to the swiftest, but I do love it when we get to see a race where all the athletes run their best: London 2012 800; Tokyo 2020 400 hurdles
Any single race may be more influenced by random variables than actual talent: illness, weather, accidents (a trip, a missed SC hurdle, etc.). Centro's gold falls into this category for me; Coburn's gold (with Kenyan's missed hurdle); Blake's gold (Bolt's false start in 2011).
That said, Centro has more to his resume than the 3:50 gold. And I'm very impressed by Hocker!
"iT waS LuCK" yet all the medalists that year were former medalists, with the silver medalist being a former Olympic champ. The only anomaly being Kiprops crappy place, but he's known for crappy tactics due to
his height (it's hard to make moves in a tight race when you're that tall).
KaareV wrote:
SeattleSilver wrote:
After watching the race, I am impressed with Hocker's time, but not with his race. Cole was never a factor in that race, and his kick wasn't going to save the day when hanging back that far with a fast final lap from the leaders. His final finish puts a flattering gloss on a bad tactical race.
This isn't meant be be negative, It was Cole's first final in among the big boys, and I suspect he will learn from it. At the same age and with a lot more high-level experience, Jakob gets his tactics wrong from time to time. Cole should have two or three more Olympics chances and several WC changes before he is done.
Actually, Hocker lived up to Know Thyself. He ran close to a perfect race. 400 m 57,4 no 12 400-800 56.4 no 11 800-1200 56,5 no 9 and then 1200-1500 41.1.
But the result is less 'perfect' than the men ahead of him. It may well have been the best race Hocker could run,. But to the point of the thread, that doesn't make Hocker's race more impressive than Centro running the race he needed to run to achieve the goal of the day: The gold medal.
SeattleSilver wrote:
KaareV wrote:
Actually, Hocker lived up to Know Thyself. He ran close to a perfect race. 400 m 57,4 no 12 400-800 56.4 no 11 800-1200 56,5 no 9 and then 1200-1500 41.1.
But the result is less 'perfect' than the men ahead of him. It may well have been the best race Hocker could run,. But to the point of the thread, that doesn't make Hocker's race more impressive than Centro running the race he needed to run to achieve the goal of the day: The gold medal.
Yeah, Centro winning a Gold Medal is a better performance but some of you are overlooking what matters the most. Centro was almost 27 years old when he won in Rio while Hocker is only 20.
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