Sally is assuming people will happily pay taxes even if they can use all the growing number of loopholes (she doesn’t declare her rubles & is happy to let us pick up her slack).
Ghost doesn’t invest in democracies, too unstable.
Sally is assuming people will happily pay taxes even if they can use all the growing number of loopholes (she doesn’t declare her rubles & is happy to let us pick up her slack).
Ghost doesn’t invest in democracies, too unstable.
agip wrote:
The R line will be 'ok what Trump did is not appropriate but since the ukrainians got their money without doing the investigation this is not impeachable'
Rs would also believe: You can't go to prison for a bank robbery if you didn't shoot you gun, and they recovered all the money. You win a "Get out of jail free card."
Oh and trump saying he's going to read out the transcript of the call on tv is such a big fat lie... he has no limits. He and GOP minions are going to work in unison to bury that call and anything related to it.
Trollminator wrote:
Trollminator wrote:
Were they operating with a similar bullish environment (aka ballooning the deficit is not needed at all)??? Tell me what trump's deficit will look like in 2024 at this pace. You are nuts.
Btw that is an old article and its biased. Look at trump's 2018 deficit and his 2019 projected. He's outpacing Obama. Bush had the Afghanistan and Iraq war, Obama had the 2nd largest recession in history to deal with and a mini one later. They had legit reasons to increase the debt ceiling. Rs are supposed to be fiscal hawks and there is absolutely no good reason for trump to be outspending either of them with this kind of economy. It is totally irresponsible and amounts to borrowing from the next generations so he can boost his chances. You still want to argue?
How is it an old article? It was updated in July of this year. You need to respect the facts. You can't just make up stuff because you want Trump's deficits to be the biggest. Facts matter here. For some of us at least. Trump HAS NOT had the largest deficits. Please stick of facts.
Trollminator wrote:
agip wrote:
I think the Rs are in big trouble tho - when trump is out of office they won't have a national leader either. The personality cult has taken over the entire party so when he's gone...what is left? A bunch of minor leaguers not able to capture the hearts of the grass roots trumpers. So all they have left is a shambles of a party, headless. With no real policy other than trump reverence and anti-immigration.
And immigration is pretty popular in the US so that's not a great plan.
1. They are not thinking that far ahead b/c trump is successfully reassuring them he's going to win and so they will worry about that later
2. Are you sure trump would just disappear after 2024? Would you put it past him and party to more permanently keep him in control... do not underestimate this country's stupidity and gullibility.. for all we know one of the son's would run. Look at how far we've come, anything is possible.
What we are missing on the left is a hard hitter loud mouth and ultra dirty tactics. Dems playing way too nice with the public. Where is their disinformation campaign to rile up the base and get them really angry? Trump has fired up the left on his own, but voters might end up being very complacent.
agree completely on this. We don't have a big white ethnic guy who bellows out defense of unions and the middle class. We need that. Not sure about the lies and dirty tactics, but we need a loud guy.
One of deblasio's opening statements at a debate was pretty good and in that direction. I don't have time to go find it though.
Failed Holdup wrote:
agip wrote:
The R line will be 'ok what Trump did is not appropriate but since the ukrainians got their money without doing the investigation this is not impeachable'
Rs would also believe: You can't go to prison for a bank robbery if you didn't shoot you gun, and they recovered all the money. You win a "Get out of jail free card."
Where our logic fails is even thinking that there is reasoning behind it. There is no reasoning, they won't question anything he does, period. Remember the setting he provided... anything he does is bs b/c the deep state.
Trollminator wrote:
Oh and trump saying he's going to read out the transcript of the call on tv is such a big fat lie... he has no limits. He and GOP minions are going to work in unison to bury that call and anything related to it.
Were you equally as harsh on Adam Schiff - who had the transcript of the phone call - but instead made up bold and crazy lies? Are you nuts?
Trollminator wrote:
Sally Vix wrote:
These are the 5 biggest deficits (Obama and Bush had the largest):
https://www.thoughtco.com/historic-budget-deficits-by-president-3368289Were they operating with a similar bullish environment (aka ballooning the deficit is not needed at all)??? Tell me what trump's deficit will look like in 2024 at this pace. You are nuts.
You need to quit lying. The US budget deficit in 2018 was $779 billion. Admit that Trump has always had lower deficits than Obama and Bush had in many of their years. Admit that or you are not serious about facts. You are okay just making up Sh%t.
The deficits won’t increase just because trump is in trouble & he needs to build a war chest of tax breaks for himself & his cronies, right? That would be corrupt.
Sally Vix wrote:
How is it an old article? It was updated in July of this year. You need to respect the facts. You can't just make up stuff because you want Trump's deficits to be the biggest. Facts matter here. For some of us at least. Trump HAS NOT had the largest deficits. Please stick of facts.
Dude the deficit for 2018 is $779B and they are talking his smaller one from 2016 - they aren't using current facts. Am I lying?
Trump deficits are on pace to outstrip Obama's so cut the BS. He's projected to put a +$1T hole in it for each of the next 3 years... with a totally healthy economy.
https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306Sally Vix wrote:
Trollminator wrote:
Oh and trump saying he's going to read out the transcript of the call on tv is such a big fat lie... he has no limits. He and GOP minions are going to work in unison to bury that call and anything related to it.
Were you equally as harsh on Adam Schiff - who had the transcript of the phone call - but instead made up bold and crazy lies? Are you nuts?
You lie as usual.. where is your proof that he lied? Are we going to revisit this topic and slap you down for like the 10th time on this issue? Get over it
Trollminator wrote:
Sally Vix wrote:
How is it an old article? It was updated in July of this year. You need to respect the facts. You can't just make up stuff because you want Trump's deficits to be the biggest. Facts matter here. For some of us at least. Trump HAS NOT had the largest deficits. Please stick of facts.
Dude the deficit for 2018 is $779B and they are talking his smaller one from 2016 - they aren't using current facts. Am I lying?
Trump deficits are on pace to outstrip Obama's so cut the BS. He's projected to put a +$1T hole in it for each of the next 3 years... with a totally healthy economy.
https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306
The poster said Trump has had record deficits. He has never had an effing deficit of $1 trillion. Obama had multiple over $1 trillion. If you can't admit that - I am done with you. I only deal with facts - you deal in fantasy.
Sally Vix wrote:
Trollminator wrote:
Were they operating with a similar bullish environment (aka ballooning the deficit is not needed at all)??? Tell me what trump's deficit will look like in 2024 at this pace. You are nuts.
You need to quit lying. The US budget deficit in 2018 was $779 billion. Admit that Trump has always had lower deficits than Obama and Bush had in many of their years. Admit that or you are not serious about facts. You are okay just making up Sh%t.
Compare that $779 to any of Obama's last 5 years. You are looking at a couple of years in the middle of the 2nd worst recession in US history. Avg out Obama's 8 years and compare that to trumps. And then on top of that if you include the projected (WH numbers btw) Obama's avg looks tiny. The economy is super strong, why is he doing that?
Trollminator wrote:
Sally Vix wrote:
Were you equally as harsh on Adam Schiff - who had the transcript of the phone call - but instead made up bold and crazy lies? Are you nuts?
You lie as usual.. where is your proof that he lied? Are we going to revisit this topic and slap you down for like the 10th time on this issue? Get over it
He even said he was giving "his interpretation" - so if you can't even admit that - we are done.
Trollminator wrote:
Sally Vix wrote:
You need to quit lying. The US budget deficit in 2018 was $779 billion. Admit that Trump has always had lower deficits than Obama and Bush had in many of their years. Admit that or you are not serious about facts. You are okay just making up Sh%t.
Compare that $779 to any of Obama's last 5 years. You are looking at a couple of years in the middle of the 2nd worst recession in US history. Avg out Obama's 8 years and compare that to trumps. And then on top of that if you include the projected (WH numbers btw) Obama's avg looks tiny. The economy is super strong, why is he doing that?
Are you really this clueless? I said that Trump has NOT had the biggest deficits - that is what the poster said. Trump has NOT had the biggest deficits. Can you even admit that???????
I just read an interesting idea:
Programs like medicare and social security are good and fine - they take care of old people, esp the ones who really need it.
but
they increase inequality in a way.
how?
if you know that your SS benefit will take care of you when you get old...you don't feel the need to save. So you don't. Which is rational for many people...two SS benefits in a middle class household will provide say $50,000/yr, which isn't too shabby.
So if you want to increase the value of benefits like that...you will also likely increase the 'wealth inequality' numbers. Not 1:1, but to some degree.
The answer of course is to adjust the wealth inequality numbers to take the high value of SS and medicare into account. when you do that, inequality numbers come WAY down. I mean a two worker household on SS has a risk free annuity worth almost a million dollars. But instead we'd rather talk about how poor those people are.
It's an interesting concept. Unintended conseqences are one of my favorite things.
Sally Vix wrote:
Trollminator wrote:
Dude the deficit for 2018 is $779B and they are talking his smaller one from 2016 - they aren't using current facts. Am I lying?
Trump deficits are on pace to outstrip Obama's so cut the BS. He's projected to put a +$1T hole in it for each of the next 3 years... with a totally healthy economy.
https://www.thebalance.com/us-deficit-by-year-3306306The poster said Trump has had record deficits. He has never had an effing deficit of $1 trillion. Obama had multiple over $1 trillion. If you can't admit that - I am done with you. I only deal with facts - you deal in fantasy.
The poster is being proven right with each passing month, and by trump's own projections he's going to surpass Obama's deficit increase if he does 8 years. You are cherry picking 3 years, look at the average and tell us that looks ok when the economy is completely healthy right now. Here's the apples to apples comparison: in Obama's last 4 years the avg deficit was $543. Trump's average from 2017-2019 is $845, that is 56% higher. Explain that.
Sally Vix wrote:
Trollminator wrote:
You lie as usual.. where is your proof that he lied? Are we going to revisit this topic and slap you down for like the 10th time on this issue? Get over it
He even said he was giving "his interpretation" - so if you can't even admit that - we are done.
Yeah and he did give his interpretation. So where is the lie?
Trollminator wrote:
Sally Vix wrote:
The poster said Trump has had record deficits. He has never had an effing deficit of $1 trillion. Obama had multiple over $1 trillion. If you can't admit that - I am done with you. I only deal with facts - you deal in fantasy.
The poster is being proven right with each passing month, and by trump's own projections he's going to surpass Obama's deficit increase if he does 8 years. You are cherry picking 3 years, look at the average and tell us that looks ok when the economy is completely healthy right now. Here's the apples to apples comparison: in Obama's last 4 years the avg deficit was $543. Trump's average from 2017-2019 is $845, that is 56% higher. Explain that.
You don't have an answer for this Sally - why is Trump ballooning the deficit when the economy is already super strong and when he promise he would eliminate the debt ceiling?
Trollminator wrote:
Sally Vix wrote:
The poster said Trump has had record deficits. He has never had an effing deficit of $1 trillion. Obama had multiple over $1 trillion. If you can't admit that - I am done with you. I only deal with facts - you deal in fantasy.
The poster is being proven right with each passing month, and by trump's own projections he's going to surpass Obama's deficit increase if he does 8 years. You are cherry picking 3 years, look at the average and tell us that looks ok when the economy is completely healthy right now. Here's the apples to apples comparison: in Obama's last 4 years the avg deficit was $543. Trump's average from 2017-2019 is $845, that is 56% higher. Explain that.
This is very, very simple. I will go very slowly. The poster said that the deficits have never been higher than with Trump. That is a lie. We have 2 years to look at. Both were well under $1trillion . They were $1.4 trillion or thereabouts under both obama and trump. I really don't care about projections. They are just that! - Projections. I proved the poster was wrong. Just let it die.