Tribute to 02:20 Marathon

`Why Slava has a fragile left foot he has already told himself. It`s not because of the training system. And now I have a very clear picture of the right paces up to his present shape that we will work on with.

Merry Christmas to all readers ! ( Even the doubters, lol ))

- Magic Santa -

Again, why is he running faster than 5k pace and taking 120s rest? You mentioned you should never go to 90s or above.

He is turning into Phil 2.0.

SouthernFriedRealist wrote:

Again, why is he running faster than 5k pace and taking 120s rest? You mentioned you should never go to 90s or above.

He is turning into Phil 2.0.

Just numbers, in order to understand whole picture:

1) Last 20x400 @73.8sec session at windy condition rest between reps was:

min=53sec

max=103sec (last 5 reps)

avg per 20's=88sec

2) Last 6.5x800 LT @02:31.5min session:

1=02:32min, 153bpm

rest=85sec

2=02:30min, 159bpm

rest=97sec

3=02:32min, 160bpm

rest=98sec

4=02:30min, 161bpm

rest=90sec

5=02:31min, 161bpm

rest=98sec

6=02:33min, 161bpm

rest=104sec

6.5=77sec (400m), 152bpm

rest=66sec

...stopped due to calves gone

After run 1 week without workouts due to calves and gradually loose fitness:

-20x400 @69sec could not hold rest below 90sec, we adjusted paces to:

-20x400 @72sec, again some reps rest exceeding 90sec, we adjusted paces to 73-74 sec, and finally rest was less than 90 sec mostly all reps.

3) another 13x800 LT @02:37min (latest LT, as you can see fitness lost compare to previous 6.5x800 LT @02:31.5min). Pace adjusted to match new fitness level.

1=02:33min

rest=107sec

2=02:34min

rest=110sec

3=02:36min

rest=109sec

4=02:36min

rest=111sec

5=02:36min

rest=110sec

6=02:37min

rest=116sec

7=02:37min

rest=121sec

8=02:37min

rest=133sec

8=02:37min

rest=139sec

10=02:41min

rest=137sec

11=02:39min

rest=136sec

12=02:39min

rest=142sec

13=02:38min

rest=112sec

During month of November due to injuries, new running technique, orthopedic insoles adaptation, calves and so on we mostly lost fitness:

5K paces 68-70sec to 73-75sec

LT paces 03:08-03:10 to 03:15-03:20

easy paces 04:20-04:25 to 04:30-04:35

At least 3-4 weeks without injuries is needed to get back again on high train. As somebody noted, ability I have, but methods we will find ?.

hr measurement wrote:

umm, what? wrote:

20 x 400 @ 5k pace is not a super hard sessionand only requires short recoveries. During true base training you could do that session and recover in a day no problem.

8km of repetition volume w/short-recovery at 5km pace? <<<Seems high.

If one is going for that volume, I would suggest first trying them at LT pace, which is 1.075 * 5k pace.

Yes it's a lot of volume, but nowhere near as hard as 6 x 1000m at the same pace. That comes later.

If it is done at the right pace, then you only need a short recovery, about 30 seconds for me back in the day.

This would be perfect during base training to prepare for those 6 x 1000m just before race season.

This thread is full of misinformation from JS claiming he knows better than all the great coaches of history.

It is our duty to protect other runners from his ridiculous claims.

Slava,

The point people are trying to make is that your “5k fitness” was not, at any point in time, 68-70 seconds per 400. Your LT pace was also not 3:08 pace. You can’t honestly believe that you could sustain 15:50 5k pace for an hour when you can’t even sustain that pace for 3-6 miles of 800 intervals work with huge amounts of rest. I would honestly guess your “LT”pace is your 5k pace and your “5k” pace is your somewhere between your mile and 3k pace.

You are trying to work out at paces that far eclipse your present ability and the results are predictable... inconsistency, injury and lack of progress.

Seriously, just run a 5k time trial. Get a real sense of where you are at and calibrate your training paces accordingly.

highhoppingworm wrote:

Slava,

The point people are trying to make is that your “5k fitness” was not, at any point in time, 68-70 seconds per 400. Your LT pace was also not 3:08 pace. You can’t honestly believe that you could sustain 15:50 5k pace for an hour when you can’t even sustain that pace for 3-6 miles of 800 intervals work with huge amounts of rest. I would honestly guess your “LT”pace is your 5k pace and your “5k” pace is your somewhere between your mile and 3k pace.

You are trying to work out at paces that far eclipse your present ability and the results are predictable... inconsistency, injury and lack of progress.

Seriously, just run a 5k time trial. Get a real sense of where you are at and calibrate your training paces accordingly.

Reasoned. I agree that the pace of 68-72sec on repetitions I will not pull out by as much as 5km. ?? OK, what time trial do I need to run, 1km, 3km or 5km at once? And where is it better to run, on the track, on asphalt with minimal gradient and turns? I'm going back to running tomorrow, the injury seems to have healed two days ago, I'm just waiting and not forcing. For the time trial, I need 3-10 days of light running and 1-3 workout plus 1-3 days of taping so that the time trial doesn't work out on under-healing and dead legs, right? Or else...

I haven't been following this thread too closely, but has Canefis run an actual time trial yet?

I feel like 5k is a good middle ground in that it doesn’t take too much out of you and still gives you a reasonable VDOT that has some correlation up to HM.

The Wizard JS wrote:

doesnt make sense wrote:

Does Elisha admit you coached him?

I don`t know .

You don't know because you were never his coach.

mjmjmj wrote:

The Wizard JS wrote:

I don`t know .

You don't know because you were never his coach.

That is just cra-p talk from you. You don't contact a world class coach and ask how to do to run sub 2:09 marathon and then gets the coaching and gives the times done at the workouts during 3 months and then reveals that you didn`t follow the training given. ;)

The last chat with him I had after the race where he told me he won easy and had plenty of power left to go faster if it had been necessary.

The Wizard JS wrote:

mjmjmj wrote:

You don't know because you were never his coach.

That is just cra-p talk from you. You don't contact a world class coach and ask how to do to run sub 2:09 marathon and then gets the coaching and gives the times done at the workouts during 3 months and then reveals that you didn`t follow the training given. ;)

The last chat with him I had after the race where he told me he won easy and had plenty of power left to go faster if it had been necessary.

And it made perfect sense that he was so happy with your majiq coaching that he would dump you.

You are full of lies. And contrary to what you claim, it is you who has to prove what you say is true, not the other way round.

mjmjmj wrote:

The Wizard JS wrote:

That is just cra-p talk from you. You don't contact a world class coach and ask how to do to run sub 2:09 marathon and then gets the coaching and gives the times done at the workouts during 3 months and then reveals that you didn`t follow the training given. ;)

The last chat with him I had after the race where he told me he won easy and had plenty of power left to go faster if it had been necessary.

And it made perfect sense that he was so happy with your majiq coaching that he would dump you.

You are full of lies. And contrary to what you claim, it is you who has to prove what you say is true, not the other way round.

If all you say is true, why doesn't anyone here believe you? Why do people believe other coaches but not you? Why do people tell you you are an annoying, lying troll, spamming the boards?

You lie, you spam the boards, you have never been asked to coach Kamworor, Kenyan runners you claimed to have coached have come forward and told people they were never coached by you.

I challenge you to prove the crap you spew on here is true. Not at any "talk" you will "organize", because you never do, never will.

Prove it here. Screenshots from emails, Facebook conversations, WhatsApp chats, whatever.

Prove it or stop with your crap trolling once and for all!

And focus on your athlete!

Slava needs a coach who puts his athletes first. Not an egomaniac who only cares about himself.

Canefis wrote:

OK, what time trial do I need to run, 1km, 3km or 5km at once? And where is it better to run, on the track, on asphalt with minimal gradient and turns?

Personally, since you are training for a marathon, and since aerobic strength seems your weakness, I'd suggest running 10 miles at a consistent pace. The pace you can do that in will be your current marathon pace or slightly quicker. This is not as taxing as an actual time trial, and is a normal marathon training session, so you've nothing to lose. You should do it without a significant taper (one day off is OK).

The Wizard JS wrote:

mjmjmj wrote:

And it made perfect sense that he was so happy with your majiq coaching that he would dump you.

You are full of lies. And contrary to what you claim, it is you who has to prove what you say is true, not the other way round.

You don`t get it.The Kenyan management big elephants just overflowing with corruption. They don`t want any freelancing online coach to coach their runners even if he is the best they can get,

and even if it`s for free.

You still can't prove it.

I`m not a liar. Have never lied here at the boards during now 5 years beeing here as a freelancing online coach. Kamworor asked me to coach him to a world record attempt. Kiprop agreed to be coached by me for his winter buildup but changed his mind when the agreed date of 1 November 2016 came. Kiprop also first agreed me to coach his comeback to 2022 but again changed his mind and now have decided to work with his father as coach ( his father is a former very good middle distancer).I can`t understand why you(and some) think that I invent and lies about what I write here at LRC?? I`m here as an official person and you just as a fiction name . Do you really think I would disgrace my name here by lying and inventing things that were not true??

- True Santa -

mjmjmj wrote:

The Wizard JS wrote:

You don`t get it.The Kenyan management big elephants just overflowing with corruption. They don`t want any freelancing online coach to coach their runners even if he is the best they can get,

and even if it`s for free.

You still can't prove it.

The thing is that I can! ;)

The Wizard JS wrote:

lies

- Lying Santa -

Correct

The Wizard JS wrote:

mjmjmj wrote:

You still can't prove it.

The thing is that I can! ;)

The thing is that you can't! ;)

And you are ruining Slava like you ruined Phil's performance.

You are harmful. You are like poison.

You are a crap coach if the training you are prescribing Slava is what you do.

Oh and Merry Christmas :)

I hope Santa brings you some humility and the ability to see that the way you are "promoting" your coaching services here will only push people away from you.

Take care and stop lying! ;D