No, Obama and Hillary lied all the time. Schiff lied just the other day about the “whistleblower” contact. You justify liars you agree with.
No, Obama and Hillary lied all the time. Schiff lied just the other day about the “whistleblower” contact. You justify liars you agree with.
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
No, Obama and Hillary lied all the time. Schiff lied just the other day about the “whistleblower” contact. You justify liars you agree with.
As do you. Still waiting for Trump to release his taxes as he promised his base.
zephito wrote:
sooth sayer wrote:
LOL . . . run by two rightwing clowns. John Stossel and Maxim Lott.
John Stossel is a former Fox News pundit. Claims he is actually a Libertarian, but . . . LOL.
Maxim Lott creates very inaccurate financial calculators.
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/John_Stosselhttps://www.quora.com/How-accurate-is-Maxim-Lott%E2%80%99s-tax-plan-calculator-I-question-the-source-since-he-writes-for-Fox-News?share=1Ad hominem ...
Which has absolutely nothing to do with your post using data from two rightwing data manipulators.
PS. You have no clue how to use ad hominem.
Ciro wrote:
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
No, Obama and Hillary lied all the time. Schiff lied just the other day about the “whistleblower” contact. You justify liars you agree with.
As do you. Still waiting for Trump to release his taxes as he promised his base.
Well then we can agree our political leadership from both parties is lacking. Just look at the facade of this impeachment inquiry process. It is just a purely political move. May work or may backfire.
In regards to Trump’s taxes, I suppose many consider Hillary’s destruction of emails was fine. Or Biden’s obvious side deals for his son in Ukraine and China. Flagpole thinks it is all just fine. Of course all supporting his view of what is proper and legal. I suspect that this impeachment inquiry will morph into something much bigger, and it may be a 180 degrees different outcome than Flagpole’s prediction.
I am not personally invested in an outcome. I find this thread interesting at how often 2 + 2 = 5. Same characters did the same math in the Kavanaugh and 2016 Election Thread, and Mueller Investigation. Very willing to accept theories that were wrong or unproven. As disgusting as Trump is to some he is protected by the same Constitution as the rest of us. We should all look forward to this being litigated thru the courts, where points of law should be argued, not by partisan politics. Keep in mind that any bending of rules, procedures and law in handling this proposed process will be used by the other side when they are in control. So be careful what you wish for.
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
Warren’s own words. Just like the phony Native American heritage story. No better than Trump, perhaps worse.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Good one!
It’s not a facade, Trump brought this on himself and you should demand better of your elected representatives.
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
In regards to Trump’s taxes, I suppose many consider Hillary’s destruction of emails was fine.
CONGRATULATIONS! This may rank as the #1 deflection on this thread, which is really saying something.
"In regards to Trump's taxes," HRC's emails have *nothing* to do with them, or with his LIE (which is on video) that he would release them--at least if he won. He never had any intention of releasing his taxes; it was just a straight-up lie--another in a long, long list of them.
I mostly just find it sad that an intelligent and educated person could--apparently seriously--think that *anything* about another (former) politician could be any kind of reasonable response when queried about DJT's taxes and his lying about them. Wow.
Sad. Truly.
sooth sayer wrote:
Which has absolutely nothing to do with your post using data from two rightwing data manipulators.
PS. You have no clue how to use ad hominem.
You're technically right. I wasn't making an argument - I was posting data. The general gist is correct though; you imply the data is suspect because it comes from right wing guys. You're not attacking flaws in how they came up with those numbers, which would be relevant. They get their data from betfair. Are they falsely posting the wrong data? Or is betfair also suspect? If the Wall Street Journal re-posts/prints the weather forecast from the NWS is that also suspect just because the editorial page has a right-wing bias? Are you having fun trolling?
zephito wrote:
sooth sayer wrote:
Which has absolutely nothing to do with your post using data from two rightwing data manipulators.
PS. You have no clue how to use ad hominem.
You're technically right. I wasn't making an argument - I was posting data.
Data of very weak reliability. Data from two people known for creating biased data. Data which happens to skew to the far right.
lol imagine waking up everyday and being so frustrated about the president and believing, and obsessing over, all the negative news coverage
no wonder so many leftists use SSRIs
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
Ciro wrote:
As do you. Still waiting for Trump to release his taxes as he promised his base.
Well then we can agree our political leadership from both parties is lacking. Just look at the facade of this impeachment inquiry process. It is just a purely political move. May work or may backfire.
In regards to Trump’s taxes, I suppose many consider Hillary’s destruction of emails was fine. Or Biden’s obvious side deals for his son in Ukraine and China. Flagpole thinks it is all just fine. Of course all supporting his view of what is proper and legal. I suspect that this impeachment inquiry will morph into something much bigger, and it may be a 180 degrees different outcome than Flagpole’s prediction.
I am not personally invested in an outcome. I find this thread interesting at how often 2 + 2 = 5. Same characters did the same math in the Kavanaugh and 2016 Election Thread, and Mueller Investigation. Very willing to accept theories that were wrong or unproven. As disgusting as Trump is to some he is protected by the same Constitution as the rest of us. We should all look forward to this being litigated thru the courts, where points of law should be argued, not by partisan politics. Keep in mind that any bending of rules, procedures and law in handling this proposed process will be used by the other side when they are in control. So be careful what you wish for.
You are making some assumptions about what I think.
1) I do not think Hillary's behavior with her e-mails was fine. I have never said that. I HAVE said they decided not to pursue prosecution for that and that I would bide by that decision because I am a rule of law person. Before you decide I am a hypocrite in any way, I have ALSO said I accept that Mueller did not find prosecutable crimes regarding conspiracy with Russia, and I am fine with that decision. I am fair and have 100% integrity 100% of the time...just know that going forward.
2) From what I know TODAY (this could change if more information were to come out), I DO NOT think the Bidens have done anything illegal. While Hunter Biden is actually a very smart man, a lawyer with his law degree from Yale, and he also served in the Navy reserve so he deserves some respect for all of that, he definitely DID benefit by being the son of Joe Biden. That is not illegal. There is NO evidence that what either Biden has done is illegal. An example of privilege? Yes. That is not illegal. If you have issues with that kind of privilege, then WTF do you think about Ivanka and Jared having positions in the White House? Those positions (even though unpaid) have way more power and need much more knowledge than sitting on a board, and they are both not qualified.
3) Your prediction is very vague. It seems you are saying that the Democrats will be charged with things and not Republicans. That is quite the BS wishful thinking on your part if that's what you mean. Trump WILL be impeached. Pence MIGHT be. Barr and Giuliani are in big legal trouble as are others.
4) You are DEEPLY invested in the outcome. BS to that comment.
5) The Mueller Report isn't done making its mark He is still coming as I have said...Trump WILL face big legal issues when he is out of office due to what Mueller found and farmed out.
6) This Ukraine thing is not a theory. We have the readout of the call, brother! Trump admitted it. Giuliani admitted it, and then Trump in front of cameras asked Ukraine and China to investigate Biden. That's not theory. He will be impeached over this.
7) This is not a partisan attack on Trump. He, both secretly and openly has sought the help of foreign governments (one of them an oppressive dictatorship with no real justice system) to investigate his political rival. His comment that he is for getting rid of corruption is bogus. Ukraine is one of the most corrupt countries on the planet according to experts, and the ONLY issue Trump wants to target has to do with his main political rival? (Don't say Biden isn't his main rival...he was way ahead in the polls back in the summer when this all was going on). It doesn't matter if he was the main one or not anyway. Criminal behavior. Now, I personally think we have quid pro quo (though it's not needed) when looking at the text messages, and I believe we will have more info that comes out that will make that clear.
Brother, without bringing up anyone else, can you honestly say that it is ok for a US President to seek the help of foreign countries to get dirt on a political rival? If you can't answer that correctly, what if we determine that Trump actually did FOR SURE hold up military aid money to Ukraine to get them to do what he wanted?
I won't even get into his emoluments violations, his OTHER FELONY campaign finance violations, his 10-11 (depending on what you count) instances of Obstruction of Justice mentioned in the Mueller Report, 5 of which experts have deemed clear cut examples.
Do you dare answer my questions I have posed to you that are emphasized above?
Night Observer wrote:
Flagpole wrote:
Warren is super smart, and that is always a plus with me. I couldn't get myself to vote for Romney over Warren, especially not knowing for sure how the House and Senate will turn out. And, as I said, Republicans, especially the party, not the individual voters, need to suffer a consequence for electing Trump. Finally, while I don't agree with all the stuff Warren wants to fund, I don't think any of those things will be bad for the US.
I didn't ask who you would vote for, I asked which group would be better for the country. P answered that Romney with a democratic house and senate would be the best for the country. I agree with that.
I know what you asked. Under normal circumstances I MIGHT agree with you, but there needs to be a BIG backlash to Conservatives for electing and then enabling the most corrupt President the US has ever had. The best thing for the country in 2020 is to have a Democrat President as that makes the biggest statement. Would be even better if they keep the House and take the Senate. Republicans deserve a HUGE push back for infecting us with Trump. McConnell needs to lose his power in the Senate. Republicans deserve to lose a lot because of what they have done and continue to do with regard to Trump.
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
No, Obama and Hillary lied all the time. Schiff lied just the other day about the “whistleblower” contact. You justify liars you agree with.
Iggy, I think all of us accept that ALL politicians, certainly on the national level, lie and spin and misconstrue. There just is NO comparison to Trump though. It is ridiculous to try to make an equivalency, and it isn't even close...not for ANY other politician on either side of the aisle.
Trumpettes are NOT Americans!
Ciro wrote:
oopsieeeee wrote:
It's Rick Perry's fault! LOL! You can't make this schit up like this clown of a POTUS.
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump-rick-perry-ukraine-895348/#utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=social_bar&utm_content=bottom_amp&utm_id=895348An absolute coward of a “man”
Trump is a psychopath. Although he has no empathy he has a good understanding of people and how they react. He actually, when he wants to, can project fake concern and relationship. He uses to his advantage and he can get people to be loyal to him, to follow him and to lie for him. They feel like they have a special relationship with him.
But as he has done so many times in the past, as Perry will learn, when they are of no use to him, he easily turns on them. He has no problem doing so.
Flagpole wrote:
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
No, Obama and Hillary lied all the time. Schiff lied just the other day about the “whistleblower” contact. You justify liars you agree with.
Iggy, I think all of us accept that ALL politicians, certainly on the national level, lie and spin and misconstrue. There just is NO comparison to Trump though. It is ridiculous to try to make an equivalency, and it isn't even close...not for ANY other politician on either side of the aisle.
Colbert has an interesting segment on his show, "Dumb or Corrupt". Iggy is making a case that Trump's lies are no different in terms of damage or amount than any other politician. He tries to justify this with some weak examples.
So with all that Trump as done, does Iggy really believe it equivalent (dumb) or is he just lying and trying to excuse it (corrupt)?
Iggy seems intelligent enough to see the truth, but he posts as if he really believes what he posts. I think Iggy's is under the Trump spell and this has made him dumb.
Reality calling Iggy, break out of the Trump spell and see the truth. He has conned you unmercifully.
Good morning! How are all you LRC stable geniuses doing this fine AM?
Flagpole wrote:
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
No, Obama and Hillary lied all the time. Schiff lied just the other day about the “whistleblower” contact. You justify liars you agree with.
Iggy, I think all of us accept that ALL politicians, certainly on the national level, lie and spin and misconstrue. There just is NO comparison to Trump though. It is ridiculous to try to make an equivalency, and it isn't even close...not for ANY other politician on either side of the aisle.
OK. I’ll give you that point.
“Brother, without bringing up anyone else, can you honestly say that it is ok for a US President to seek the help of foreign countries to get dirt on a political rival? If you can't answer that correctly, what if we determine that Trump actually did FOR SURE hold up military aid money to Ukraine to get them to do what he wanted?”
I don’t think anything Trump said or documented actions is against the law. If so, why are the Democrats just trying to ran this process thru? The Democrats have been, like you, pushing for impeachment or reversing the results of the 2016 election since day one. That is my objection.
You are the one invested in an outcome. I actually like Warren, even though I think she panders to her base as much as Trump, just opposing bases.
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
I don’t think anything Trump said or documented actions is against the law.
You are wrong.
UR WRONG wrote:
Ghost of Igloi wrote:
I don’t think anything Trump said or documented actions is against the law.
You are wrong.
If the actions documented are proven to be true and accurate they are absolutely illegal.