UPenn swimmer comes out as trans / switches to women's team after competing on men's team for 3 years and is dominating NCAA

RunRagged wrote:

my prediction wrote:

Every athlete deserves to complete on a level playing field. But why focus on leveling the field when we can level the athlete? To this end, I propose that going forward sports governing bodies replace existing categories with a single "neutral" category, in which every athlete participates.

Quite reasonably, it follows from this approach the implementation of a program in which all athletes must satisfy a range of relevant performance factors in order to compete.

In one embodiment, a mandate is included that each athlete must continually maintain testosterone levels between 3 and 5 nanomoles per liter.

This mandate, as embodied, would typically require that biologically female athletes undergo a program of masculinizing hormone therapy, while biologically male athletes would need to undergo a program of androgen suppression therapy. Thus, all athletes, whether male, female or otherwise, are freed from the systemic forces that seek to divide them into arbitrary gender categories.

Yesterday, all my troubles seemed so far away.

I realize that you are being facetious, but for the sake of the people who don't get what the issues are I must object.

The mandate in your scenario would necessitate that persons of both sexes undergo medical interventions to alter their natural sex hormone levels during important phases of life, including: embryonic and fetal development; the mini puberty of infancy that takes up 5 of the first 6 months of life after birth; the longer puberty of adolescence; the entire span of life that comprises adulthood.

The only way your plan could be achieved would be if all pregnant women, newborn babies, children and everyone else participating in sports were subjected to invasive, coercive sex hormone monitoring and tinkering.

You suggest that fairness between the two sexes in sports would be achieved if rules were in place to insure that "each athlete must continually maintain testosterone levels between 3 and 5 nanomoles per liter."

This is sexist and misogynistic. The normal levels of testosterone jn young adult females is 0.02-1.68 nmol/L.

If you're going to require all athletes have testosterone in the same range, why should the range you decide on be one that is unhealthy for females?

Also, why is testosterone, the predominant male sex hormone, the sole focus?

RunRagged wrote:

original liar soorer wrote:

How interesting.

I have been confused by why the feminist movement have been reported as so anti trans. And if there are “ a number… please define “ who are intact I can now see where the arguments lie.

There will thus be a big overlap between gender politics and sports fairness as intact biological males in womens sport will be at the cutting edge( not to be a joke) of debate.

To complicate matters further, it's not just that nearly all the adult and adolescent male persons who say they "identify as" women/girls today keep their dicks and balls, it's that most are also heterosexual, meaning attracted to girls/women sexually. They call themselves lesbians or "transbians" and they brand actual female lesbians who don't do "girl dick" as hateful bigots whose "exclusionary" sexual orientation makes them just as bad as racists, anti-Semites and Nazis.

For the vast majority of males who "identify as" as the opposite sex today, the "gender dysphoria" and "gender identity" issues they experience are rooted in autogynephilia, or AGP. AGP is a male paraphilia (sexual fetish) whereby boys and men are sexually aroused by the thought of themselves as female.

Lindsay Hecox- the lead litigant in the ACLU's lawsuit against the Idaho Fairness in Women's Sports Act - is a case in point.

Unlike strapping Lia Thomas - who looks and sounds to most people like an ordinary male jock with a typically thick neck, deep voice, linebacker shoulders and longish hair - Hecox has a build that's on the slight and small side, a high voice, and in recent years has acquired a sweet, "feminized," photogenic face thanks to cross-sex hormones and surgical procedures that evidently included a major nose job.

However, in high school before becoming a "civil rights pioneer," Hecox left a large, unladylike footprint on reddit under the user name lindsayloveslingerie that provides plenty of evidence that Hecox is just another bog standard autogynephile with a kink for ladies' undies and a desire to bed lesbians.

In posts on reddit subs devoted to topics such as male erotic cross-dressing and transgender "traps," Hecox made it clear that Hecox started to "identify as" a girl/woman after discovering in adolescence that stealing mum's panties and bras and wearing them when wanking was/is very sexually arousing.

Also, Hecox - who self describes as a "raging lesbo" and expressed hopes that college would bring Hecox a lesbian girlfriend - revealed that aside from wanting to screw lesbians, what Hecox mainly feels toward members of the female sex is not sisterly solidarity or compassion, but envy of our looks.

https://uploads.ovarit.com/91cd2b5b-f8e9-52b0-86e4-b1b5104e5350.jpg

colder and wiser wrote:

SDSU Aztec wrote:

No, he wouldn't. Lia Thomas' success proves that without a doubt, testosterone suppression has not negated her advantage from being previously being a male. It's so obvious, there's no reason for a professor to even comment on the subject.

Do you have recent faculty experience? I agree that it's stating an obvious fact, but there's a good chance that stating this obvious fact would get you reported to your campus Title IX coordinator, an investigation launched into how you are creating a hostile environment by stating an obvious fact, potentially escorted off campus by security, in the best-case outcome required to take sensitivity training, and possibly censured by the professional academic society of your choice.

I think everyone, including trans men and women, would be better off if people were allowed to state obvious facts or even state their opinions without fear of committing professional suicide.

colder and wiser wrote:

SDSU Aztec wrote:

No, he wouldn't. Lia Thomas' success proves that without a doubt, testosterone suppression has not negated her advantage from being previously being a male. It's so obvious, there's no reason for a professor to even comment on the subject.

Do you have recent faculty experience? I agree that it's stating an obvious fact, but there's a good chance that stating this obvious fact would get you reported to your campus Title IX coordinator, an investigation launched into how you are creating a hostile environment by stating an obvious fact, potentially escorted off campus by security, in the best-case outcome required to take sensitivity training, and possibly censured by the professional academic society of your choice.

I think everyone, including trans men and women, would be better off if people were allowed to state obvious facts or even state their opinions without fear of committing professional suicide.

RunRagged wrote:

colder and wiser wrote:

Do you have recent faculty experience? I agree that it's stating an obvious fact, but there's a good chance that stating this obvious fact would get you reported to your campus Title IX coordinator, an investigation launched into how you are creating a hostile environment by stating an obvious fact, potentially escorted off campus by security, in the best-case outcome required to take sensitivity training, and possibly censured by the professional academic society of your choice.

I think everyone, including trans men and women, would be better off if people were allowed to state obvious facts or even state their opinions without fear of committing professional suicide.

In the UK, a number of female professors have been de-platformed, denounced, hounded, harassed, physically threatened and turned into campus pariahs for research and writing that challenges gender ideology - and for pointing out the myriad ways in which "gender/sex self ID" conflicts with the rights of girls and women, gays, lesbians, religious minorities, and for showing how it undermines safeguarding. Some of these women have had to hire body guards. Some have lost their jobs.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/oct/16/academics-are-being-harassed-over-their-research-into-transgender-issueshttps://www.spectator.co.uk/article/trans-activists-are-hounding-women-out-of-public-life

In the US, female academics who challenge gender ideology and point out the rank sexism and misogyny at the heart of it have been under attack for a number of years too. Such as Callie Burt at the University of Georgia, Donna Hughes at the University of Rhode Island and Carole Hooven at Harvard.

https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2021/8/11/biology-lecturer-gender-comments-backlash/https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2021/03/25/professor-odds-her-university-over-gender-identity

It's now becoming verboten to speak truthfully about biological sex in medical schools too:

https://bariweiss.substack.com/p/med-schools-are-now-denying-biological

SDSU Aztec wrote:

RunRagged wrote:

In the UK, a number of female professors have been de-platformed, denounced, hounded, harassed, physically threatened and turned into campus pariahs for research and writing that challenges gender ideology - and for pointing out the myriad ways in which "gender/sex self ID" conflicts with the rights of girls and women, gays, lesbians, religious minorities, and for showing how it undermines safeguarding. Some of these women have had to hire body guards. Some have lost their jobs.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/oct/16/academics-are-being-harassed-over-their-research-into-transgender-issueshttps://www.spectator.co.uk/article/trans-activists-are-hounding-women-out-of-public-life

In the US, female academics who challenge gender ideology and point out the rank sexism and misogyny at the heart of it have been under attack for a number of years too. Such as Callie Burt at the University of Georgia, Donna Hughes at the University of Rhode Island and Carole Hooven at Harvard.

https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2021/8/11/biology-lecturer-gender-comments-backlash/https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2021/03/25/professor-odds-her-university-over-gender-identity

It's now becoming verboten to speak truthfully about biological sex in medical schools too:

https://bariweiss.substack.com/p/med-schools-are-now-denying-biological

Come on, RR. These are people that are questioning the legitimacy of transgenderism. Questioning the effectiveness of testosterone suppression in negating the advantage in sports of having been male, isn't even remotely the same thing.