California HS XC 2023 CIF

Can we stay on topic? This is the California thread not another national one. Kay thank you. No one cares about Niwot, Herriman, CBA, or Jesuit LA. Go post on your own respective threads and stop adding minutiae to this one that is specifically for CALIFORNIA.

Go post here instead:

151.8 returning speed rating score based on Clovis and Woodbridge.

Oakdale continues to overperform everyone's expectations. They've built quite a program up there over the past 5 years. For the past 3 years, they've run their best when it counts....in November.

For them to be 3rd in the Championship race at Clovis this year portends big things from them later.

I don’t think Californians improve that much from Woodbridge-Clovis-Mt Sac-State-Nationals. Good Californians are more consistent if anything. They do get better at running harder courses, usually the 1st hard course is a learning experience.

If someone had the best race of their life at Woodbridge, it is unlikely that they will improve significantly. If you don’t believe me, look at their track season. Best races often come early-mid season.

Weather is usually significantly hotter at Clovis than at State. That is why we see the improvement. 75-80 degree weather compared to 58-65 degree weather matters a lot. Arcadia 3200 would not be the same if it were run in 75 degree weather. 58 degrees is why Arcadia is so fast.

In California, it is all about racing hard all the time. The smarter teams will make sure they save some left for the end of the season. Each big race feels like a national championship race. As I said before, look at the track times, they are racing constantly trying to pr.

Name 1 runner that ran a good race at Arcadia and was able to improve his 3200 time at state.

if anything they get worse at the end of the season, track season shows this very clearly

Matthew Donis 8:53 arcadia 8:51 state meet. Arcadia vs state meet is not a great comparison of improvement as one is a time trial the other is the state meet. The state meet is usually more Tactical. In California you do have to race hard more times through out the season as the qualifying process is brutal but it does not mean runners don’t improve.

Nobody in the Arcadia invitational is running a time trial. His interview said he wanted to go all there, 100% tapered for it.

Hunter Jones last cross country season is a good example of what it is like to be a Californian. That guy went all out on too many races. He also ran too many races. By the time he got to the national races he started to fall apart.

Despite what Californians say, Hunter Jones time at NXR was equivalent to what Leo Young was running at Woodward Park. Those were the two best performances last xc season. I would say they were more impressive than Aaron Sahlmans win at nxn.

Looking back at NXN the Young Bros. ran a tactically dumb race. Lex fell apart & Leo died at the end. We can't repeat history but I think if Leo had just run slightly more reserved he would have won the race.

Would be cool to see this team make NXN

When you run a time trial you try to run the best time possible like Arcadia. When you run a State meet you run to win. Glad I cleared up the confusion for you.

That is very hard to believe considering midwest is allowed to wears spikes in their races. Spikes help a lot more than people think it does. In addition, the course looked very fast. The course would have to be quite a bit longer than a 5k for the performances to be equivalent

That would also put Hunter Jones at German Fernandez's best cross country performance / california's best performance ever. German Fernandez could run a 4:01 mile and 2 hours later run a 8:35 3200 by himself. Hunter Jones couldn't break 8:40 with super shoes in a competitive field that pushed him.

14:55 at crystal springs is very unimpressive even at 90 degree weather.

Great Oak was missing Westin & Jacob Brown from this race

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Southwestern League Preview 2023 - Results

MileSplits official Results formatted results for the 2023 Southwestern League Preview, hosted by Temecula Valley (SS) in Temecula CA.

Link:ca.milesplit.com/meets/566023-southwes...

Tully speed rated it as 189.4.

189.0 was what 15:00 at Clovis rated this year.

This one is very wrong in my opinion. 15:00 clovis is on an entirely different level than 14:55 crystal springs. Any California coach can vouch me on this one.

I am inclined to agree with you, so I am not arguing the point. Especially since last year Shipsey ran 14:54.5 and was speed rated at 186.82.

However, what may have happened is that other runners were more affected by the conditions, allowing Caldwell to separate himself more from the rest of the pack this year, which affects the speed rating. Evidence for that can found looking at Sage Creek, which ran both Woodbridge and Crystal Springs. Their speed ratings were slower at Crystal Springs.

WB CS
Bowman 170.60 166.8
O'Toole 168.90 169.53
Marchi 164.47 155.87
Rowlett 156.10 154.03
Gray 153.93 153.03

I would disagree when the performance is called "unimpressive". The field had many known quantities. The math shows this was a very good run. I'd love to see Caldwell run the traditional Mt Sac course, since last year as a soph he ran the 5k there at Champs West, and was speed rated at 189 as well. He just eats up hilly courses.

man I don't care what your data says, I ran both courses many times, years ago. There is a significant difference between 15:00 clovis and 14:55 crystal springs. It's not even close. They are not in the same ballpark, no "bad conditions" could make that happen.