Should we use exceptions to the rules that are extremely genetically talented as a general rule of thumb for the average kid out there? We already tried this low mileage BS, and America sucked in the 90s. Fact of the matter, the east Africans grow up running and walking everywhere growing up while Americans are being driven everywhere and barely move off the x box. Haile Gebresslie ran 10 kilometres twice a day growing up. Patrick Makau Musyoki ran 7 kilometres to school and back.
Exceptions to the rules and general rules of thumbs wrote:
Should we use exceptions to the rules that are extremely genetically talented as a general rule of thumb for the average kid out there? We already tried this low mileage BS, and America sucked in the 90s. Fact of the matter, the east Africans grow up running and walking everywhere growing up while Americans are being driven everywhere and barely move off the x box. Haile Gebresslie ran 10 kilometres twice a day growing up. Patrick Makau Musyoki ran 7 kilometres to school and back.
We run too many miles in US. In Olympics 1936 to 1956, US men were winning 800m gold medals on low mileage pre-Lydiard training. Lydiard said 800m to Marathon, 100 miles a week. In US, we followed that nonsense too long.
In US, we have 1000's of college XC runners every year training 100+ miles a week. Minus Rupp, US now can produce no Marathoner sub-2:12. US Marathon results, minus Rupp look like US Marathon results fifty years ago.
High mileage philosophy is scaring away many potential elite 800m men and women.
All you retards ever talk about is mileage. Nobody cares
Low mileage? wrote:
Exceptions to the rules and general rules of thumbs wrote:
Should we use exceptions to the rules that are extremely genetically talented as a general rule of thumb for the average kid out there? We already tried this low mileage BS, and America sucked in the 90s. Fact of the matter, the east Africans grow up running and walking everywhere growing up while Americans are being driven everywhere and barely move off the x box. Haile Gebresslie ran 10 kilometres twice a day growing up. Patrick Makau Musyoki ran 7 kilometres to school and back.
We run too many miles in US. In Olympics 1936 to 1956, US men were winning 800m gold medals on low mileage pre-Lydiard training. Lydiard said 800m to Marathon, 100 miles a week. In US, we followed that nonsense too long.
In US, we have 1000's of college XC runners every year training 100+ miles a week. Minus Rupp, US now can produce no Marathoner sub-2:12. US Marathon results, minus Rupp look like US Marathon results fifty years ago.
High mileage philosophy is scaring away many potential elite 800m men and women.
The idea that the interval focus training pre Lydiard was low mileage is wrong. Look up Igloi training, it involved lots of easy running before, during and after. Besides, a lot of the athletes back in the day underreported there training volume as it was seen as "ungentlment" like to train hard back in the day.
Lukas Verzbicas ran 35 miles/per week in high school.
Yes you can run well. Most people would run 1 minute faster in the 5k at 80 MPW instead of 40 MPW. 60 MPW is where many seem to get injured so that may be the best tradeoff to get close to best times while remaining healthy,
Low mileage? wrote:
Exceptions to the rules and general rules of thumbs wrote:
Should we use exceptions to the rules that are extremely genetically talented as a general rule of thumb for the average kid out there? We already tried this low mileage BS, and America sucked in the 90s. Fact of the matter, the east Africans grow up running and walking everywhere growing up while Americans are being driven everywhere and barely move off the x box. Haile Gebresslie ran 10 kilometres twice a day growing up. Patrick Makau Musyoki ran 7 kilometres to school and back.
We run too many miles in US. In Olympics 1936 to 1956, US men were winning 800m gold medals on low mileage pre-Lydiard training. Lydiard said 800m to Marathon, 100 miles a week. In US, we followed that nonsense too long.
In US, we have 1000's of college XC runners every year training 100+ miles a week. Minus Rupp, US now can produce no Marathoner sub-2:12. US Marathon results, minus Rupp look like US Marathon results fifty years ago.
High mileage philosophy is scaring away many potential elite 800m men and women.
Gee, I wonder what happened after 1956? Oh yeah, Lydiard and Cerutty came on the scene. Both produced world class middle distance runners. 1960 800m was won by Peter Snell and the 1500m was won by Herb Elliott. 1964 800m and 1500m was won by Peter Snell. 1968 Olympic 1500m was won by Kip Keino who claimed that he ran between 60-100 miles a week. The 800m in 68 was won by Ralph Doubell, who ran between 19-25 kilometres per day and grew up pushing a bike 5-6 miles a day working as a paper boy. 1972 Olympic 1500m was won by Pekka Vasala. Who as we know was trained by Lydiard and we know what that meant. The 800m in 72 was won by David Wottle who usually ran 70-80 miles a week. 76 800m was won by Alberto Juantorena, who reportedly ran 25 kilometres a day in the winter time. 76 1500m was won by John Walker who hammered 90 miles per week. 1980 800m was won by Steve Ovett. Who as we know ran 100+ miles a week in the winter time. The 1980 1500m was won by Seb Coe who ran much more than what he reported. 1984 Olympic 800m was won by Joaquim Cruz. Who ran about 70 miles per week in the base phase. 1984 Olympic 1500m was won by Sen Coe. 1988 1500m was won by Peter Rono. Not sure about Peter Rono training, but he did run for the NCAA and trained under Brother O'Colm. The 1988 800m was won by Paul Ereng. Not sure on his training. 1992 800m was won by William Tanui. Not exactly sure about his training, but runner up to him and fellow country man ran 14.5 miles a day during his base phase. Not sure about the training of the Spainard who won the 1500m in 92. 96 800m was won by Vebjørn Rodal. Not exactly sure on his mileage. The 1500m at the 96 games was won by Noureddine Morceli. Who embraced LSD and often did his easy recovery runs in the 10 minute mile range. The 2000 Olympic 800m was won by Nils Schumann. 1500m was Noah Ngeny. Not much info on Noah training and not sure about the German. 2004 800m was won by a Russian Which training I'm not sure on. But speculation has it it is the son of Steve Ovett after he won the 800m. And, Hicham won the 1500m in 2004. Who as we know ran 100+ miles a week. 2008, 2012 and 2016 800m and 1500m was won by the following: Wilfred Bungei won the 800m in the 2008 Olympics, his mileage I'm not for sure on. The 1500m was won by Nick Willis in 2008, who's mileage seems to be around the 70 miles per range. The 2012 and 2016 800m was won by David Rudisha who runs usually in the 60-70 miles per week range. Makh Daddy who runs supposedly only 60 miles per week. And the 2016 1500m olympic gold medalist Mathew Centrowitz runs 100+ miles a week.
Sand Dunes wrote:
Low mileage? wrote:
We run too many miles in US. In Olympics 1936 to 1956, US men were winning 800m gold medals on low mileage pre-Lydiard training. Lydiard said 800m to Marathon, 100 miles a week. In US, we followed that nonsense too long.
In US, we have 1000's of college XC runners every year training 100+ miles a week. Minus Rupp, US now can produce no Marathoner sub-2:12. US Marathon results, minus Rupp look like US Marathon results fifty years ago.
High mileage philosophy is scaring away many potential elite 800m men and women.
Gee, I wonder what happened after 1956? Oh yeah, Lydiard and Cerutty came on the scene. Both produced world class middle distance runners. 1960 800m was won by Peter Snell and the 1500m was won by Herb Elliott. 1964 800m and 1500m was won by Peter Snell. 1968 Olympic 1500m was won by Kip Keino who claimed that he ran between 60-100 miles a week. The 800m in 68 was won by Ralph Doubell, who ran between 19-25 kilometres per day and grew up pushing a bike 5-6 miles a day working as a paper boy. 1972 Olympic 1500m was won by Pekka Vasala. Who as we know was trained by Lydiard and we know what that meant. The 800m in 72 was won by David Wottle who usually ran 70-80 miles a week. 76 800m was won by Alberto Juantorena, who reportedly ran 25 kilometres a day in the winter time. 76 1500m was won by John Walker who hammered 90 miles per week. 1980 800m was won by Steve Ovett. Who as we know ran 100+ miles a week in the winter time. The 1980 1500m was won by Seb Coe who ran much more than what he reported. 1984 Olympic 800m was won by Joaquim Cruz. Who ran about 70 miles per week in the base phase. 1984 Olympic 1500m was won by Sen Coe. 1988 1500m was won by Peter Rono. Not sure about Peter Rono training, but he did run for the NCAA and trained under Brother O'Colm. The 1988 800m was won by Paul Ereng. Not sure on his training. 1992 800m was won by William Tanui. Not exactly sure about his training, but runner up to him and fellow country man ran 14.5 miles a day during his base phase. Not sure about the training of the Spainard who won the 1500m in 92. 96 800m was won by Vebjørn Rodal. Not exactly sure on his mileage. The 1500m at the 96 games was won by Noureddine Morceli. Who embraced LSD and often did his easy recovery runs in the 10 minute mile range. The 2000 Olympic 800m was won by Nils Schumann. 1500m was Noah Ngeny. Not much info on Noah training and not sure about the German. 2004 800m was won by a Russian Which training I'm not sure on. But speculation has it it is the son of Steve Ovett after he won the 800m. And, Hicham won the 1500m in 2004. Who as we know ran 100+ miles a week. 2008, 2012 and 2016 800m and 1500m was won by the following: Wilfred Bungei won the 800m in the 2008 Olympics, his mileage I'm not for sure on. The 1500m was won by Nick Willis in 2008, who's mileage seems to be around the 70 miles per range. The 2012 and 2016 800m was won by David Rudisha who runs usually in the 60-70 miles per week range. Makh Daddy who runs supposedly only 60 miles per week. And the 2016 1500m olympic gold medalist Mathew Centrowitz runs 100+ miles a week.
Wow! You stated a lot. Stating so much, I almost forgot that you listed no sub-2:12 US Marathoners. You also did not detail the intense low mileage training many of the above athletes did from ages 12 to 22. Guys on letrun who have never broke 60 for 400m will not because fast runners as were Ovett and Morceli logging miles as Ovett and Morceli did once they advanced in age.
Low mileage? wrote:
Sand Dunes wrote:
Gee, I wonder what happened after 1956? Oh yeah, Lydiard and Cerutty came on the scene. Both produced world class middle distance runners. 1960 800m was won by Peter Snell and the 1500m was won by Herb Elliott. 1964 800m and 1500m was won by Peter Snell. 1968 Olympic 1500m was won by Kip Keino who claimed that he ran between 60-100 miles a week. The 800m in 68 was won by Ralph Doubell, who ran between 19-25 kilometres per day and grew up pushing a bike 5-6 miles a day working as a paper boy. 1972 Olympic 1500m was won by Pekka Vasala. Who as we know was trained by Lydiard and we know what that meant. The 800m in 72 was won by David Wottle who usually ran 70-80 miles a week. 76 800m was won by Alberto Juantorena, who reportedly ran 25 kilometres a day in the winter time. 76 1500m was won by John Walker who hammered 90 miles per week. 1980 800m was won by Steve Ovett. Who as we know ran 100+ miles a week in the winter time. The 1980 1500m was won by Seb Coe who ran much more than what he reported. 1984 Olympic 800m was won by Joaquim Cruz. Who ran about 70 miles per week in the base phase. 1984 Olympic 1500m was won by Sen Coe. 1988 1500m was won by Peter Rono. Not sure about Peter Rono training, but he did run for the NCAA and trained under Brother O'Colm. The 1988 800m was won by Paul Ereng. Not sure on his training. 1992 800m was won by William Tanui. Not exactly sure about his training, but runner up to him and fellow country man ran 14.5 miles a day during his base phase. Not sure about the training of the Spainard who won the 1500m in 92. 96 800m was won by Vebjørn Rodal. Not exactly sure on his mileage. The 1500m at the 96 games was won by Noureddine Morceli. Who embraced LSD and often did his easy recovery runs in the 10 minute mile range. The 2000 Olympic 800m was won by Nils Schumann. 1500m was Noah Ngeny. Not much info on Noah training and not sure about the German. 2004 800m was won by a Russian Which training I'm not sure on. But speculation has it it is the son of Steve Ovett after he won the 800m. And, Hicham won the 1500m in 2004. Who as we know ran 100+ miles a week. 2008, 2012 and 2016 800m and 1500m was won by the following: Wilfred Bungei won the 800m in the 2008 Olympics, his mileage I'm not for sure on. The 1500m was won by Nick Willis in 2008, who's mileage seems to be around the 70 miles per range. The 2012 and 2016 800m was won by David Rudisha who runs usually in the 60-70 miles per week range. Makh Daddy who runs supposedly only 60 miles per week. And the 2016 1500m olympic gold medalist Mathew Centrowitz runs 100+ miles a week.
Wow! You stated a lot. Stating so much, I almost forgot that you listed no sub-2:12 US Marathoners. You also did not detail the intense low mileage training many of the above athletes did from ages 12 to 22. Guys on letrun who have never broke 60 for 400m will not because fast runners as were Ovett and Morceli logging miles as Ovett and Morceli did once they advanced in age.
Did you forget about the 70s and 80s? Bill Rodgers, Frank Shorter, Alberto Salazar, and many more all sub 2:12 marathoners and all of the put in the mileage. Sure you guys can tell yourselves BS about quality over quantity. Or say stuff about oh we don't want to burn them out or injure them. Fact of the matter the Japanese have about one-third the population than that of the US. Yet, they have about 10x the amount of sub 2:10 marathoners. The reason why is that the Japanese emphasize the importance of building strength and the aerobic engine of their runners.
Low mileage? wrote:
Sand Dunes wrote:
Gee, I wonder what happened after 1956? Oh yeah, Lydiard and Cerutty came on the scene. Both produced world class middle distance runners. 1960 800m was won by Peter Snell and the 1500m was won by Herb Elliott. 1964 800m and 1500m was won by Peter Snell. 1968 Olympic 1500m was won by Kip Keino who claimed that he ran between 60-100 miles a week. The 800m in 68 was won by Ralph Doubell, who ran between 19-25 kilometres per day and grew up pushing a bike 5-6 miles a day working as a paper boy. 1972 Olympic 1500m was won by Pekka Vasala. Who as we know was trained by Lydiard and we know what that meant. The 800m in 72 was won by David Wottle who usually ran 70-80 miles a week. 76 800m was won by Alberto Juantorena, who reportedly ran 25 kilometres a day in the winter time. 76 1500m was won by John Walker who hammered 90 miles per week. 1980 800m was won by Steve Ovett. Who as we know ran 100+ miles a week in the winter time. The 1980 1500m was won by Seb Coe who ran much more than what he reported. 1984 Olympic 800m was won by Joaquim Cruz. Who ran about 70 miles per week in the base phase. 1984 Olympic 1500m was won by Sen Coe. 1988 1500m was won by Peter Rono. Not sure about Peter Rono training, but he did run for the NCAA and trained under Brother O'Colm. The 1988 800m was won by Paul Ereng. Not sure on his training. 1992 800m was won by William Tanui. Not exactly sure about his training, but runner up to him and fellow country man ran 14.5 miles a day during his base phase. Not sure about the training of the Spainard who won the 1500m in 92. 96 800m was won by Vebjørn Rodal. Not exactly sure on his mileage. The 1500m at the 96 games was won by Noureddine Morceli. Who embraced LSD and often did his easy recovery runs in the 10 minute mile range. The 2000 Olympic 800m was won by Nils Schumann. 1500m was Noah Ngeny. Not much info on Noah training and not sure about the German. 2004 800m was won by a Russian Which training I'm not sure on. But speculation has it it is the son of Steve Ovett after he won the 800m. And, Hicham won the 1500m in 2004. Who as we know ran 100+ miles a week. 2008, 2012 and 2016 800m and 1500m was won by the following: Wilfred Bungei won the 800m in the 2008 Olympics, his mileage I'm not for sure on. The 1500m was won by Nick Willis in 2008, who's mileage seems to be around the 70 miles per range. The 2012 and 2016 800m was won by David Rudisha who runs usually in the 60-70 miles per week range. Makh Daddy who runs supposedly only 60 miles per week. And the 2016 1500m olympic gold medalist Mathew Centrowitz runs 100+ miles a week.
Wow! You stated a lot. Stating so much, I almost forgot that you listed no sub-2:12 US Marathoners. You also did not detail the intense low mileage training many of the above athletes did from ages 12 to 22. Guys on letrun who have never broke 60 for 400m will not because fast runners as were Ovett and Morceli logging miles as Ovett and Morceli did once they advanced in age.
"Lack of speed isn't caused by running too many miles, it's caused by lack of speed training"
No one would run 35 now for marathon training and think they could run successfully. I thought the argument was you can run close to your best from 1500-10k on 35-40 a week.
Oh well, count me as another for the ran 50-60 mpw for a year and ran like dogshit, couldn't put a good workout together, got injured a lot, and was constantly told I looked unhealthy to 35 mpw next year PR in 5 and 10k.
Exceptions to the rules and general rules of thumbs wrote:
We already tried this low mileage BS, and America sucked in the 90s.
Beside Rupp you still suck.
Agreed. If you're talented enough, that can get you down to at least 15-low for 5k.
Dowling Catholic Undertrainer wrote:
You may not like anecdotal evidence but Karissa was fully mature in 2011. She would have been an average 17:30 college runner had she gone to some D3 school where she would have remained at 40MPW. Instead, she is a world class runner.
Karissa Schweizer
2011 - 30MPW 19:00
2012 - 35MPW 18:40
2013 - 40MPW 17:50
2014 - 45MPW 17:20
2015 - 50MPW 16:30
2016 - 60MPW 15:58
2017 - 65MPW 15:19
2018 - 75MPW 15:17
Ahh.. 15:17 is not world class; zero Diamond League meets with that resume...
US reality check wrote:
Exceptions to the rules and general rules of thumbs wrote:
We already tried this low mileage BS, and America sucked in the 90s.
Beside Rupp you still suck.
Top 25 US 5000m times:
1 12:53.60 Bernard LAGAT 12 DEC 1974 USA USA 2 Monaco (MON) 22 JUL 2011
2 12:55.53 Chris SOLINSKY 05 DEC 1984 USA USA 5 Stockholm (SWE) 06 AUG 2010
3 12:56.27 Dathan RITZENHEIN 30 DEC 1982 USA USA 3 Zürich (SUI) 28 AUG 2009
4 12:57.55 Paul CHELIMO 27 OCT 1990 USA USA 6 Bruxelles (BEL) 31 AUG 2018
5 12:58.21 Bob KENNEDY 18 AUG 1970 USA USA 5 Zürich (SUI) 14 AUG 1996
6 12:58.56 Matt TEGENKAMP 19 JAN 1982 USA USA 7 Bruxelles (BEL) 04 SEP 2009
7 12:58.90 Galen RUPP 08 MAY 1986 USA USA 3 Eugene, OR (USA) 02 JUN 2012
8 13:01.15 Sydney MAREE 09 SEP 1956 USA USA 2 Oslo (NOR) 27 JUL 1985
9 13:02.40 Evan JAGER 08 MAR 1989 USA USA 8 Bruxelles (BEL) 06 SEP 2013
10 13:02.74 Ben TRUE 29 DEC 1985 USA USA 1f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 04 MAY 2014
11 13:02.80 Hassan MEAD 28 AUG 1989 USA USA 2f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 04 MAY 2014
12 13:05.69 Ryan HILL 31 JAN 1990 USA USA 8 Bruxelles (BEL) 11 SEP 2015
13 13:07.33 Eric JENKINS 24 NOV 1991 USA USA 5f1 Heusden-Zolder (BEL) 18 JUL 2015
14 13:07.95 Lopez LOMONG 01 JAN 1985 USA USA 3f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 04 MAY 2014
15 13:08.04 Chris DERRICK 17 OCT 1990 USA USA 11 Bruxelles (BEL) 06 SEP 2013
16 13:10.00 Adam GOUCHER 18 FEB 1975 USA USA 8 Heusden-Zolder (BEL) 22 JUL 2006
17 13:10.86 Alan WEBB 13 JAN 1983 USA USA 8 Berlin (GER) 04 SEP 2005
18 13:11.77 Mebrahtom KEFLEZIGHI 05 MAY 1975 USA USA 2 Hechtel (BEL) 05 AUG 2000
18 13:11.77 Tim BROE 20 JUN 1977 USA USA 6 Oslo (NOR) 29 JUL 2005
20 13:11.93 Alberto SALAZAR 07 AUG 1958 USA USA 3 Stockholm (SWE) 06 JUL 1982
20 13:11.93 Anthony FAMIGLIETTI 08 NOV 1978 USA USA 2 Walnut (USA) 13 APR 2007
22 13:12.01 Andrew BUMBALOUGH 14 MAR 1987 USA USA 5f1 Heusden-Zolder (BEL) 13 JUL 2013
23 13:12.91 Matt CENTROWITZ 28 JAN 1955 USA USA 1 Eugene, OR (USA) 05 JUN 1982
24 13:13.32 Abdi ABDIRAHMAN 02 DEC 1978 USA USA 4 London (GBR) 22 JUL 2005
25 13:13.49 Bruce BICKFORD 12 MAR 1957 USA USA 2 Oslo (NOR) 27 JUN 1985
Only one of these times were set in the 90s, most were set in the 80s or 2000s
Top 25 10000m times:
1 26:44.36 Galen RUPP 08 MAY 1986 USA USA 1 Eugene, OR (USA) 30 MAY 2014
2 26:59.60 Chris SOLINSKY 05 DEC 1984 USA USA 1f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 01 MAY 2010
3 27:07.55 Shadrack KIPCHIRCHIR 22 FEB 1989 USA USA 9 London (GBR) 04 AUG 2017
4 27:13.98 Mebrahtom KEFLEZIGHI 05 MAY 1975 USA USA 4 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 04 MAY 2001
5 27:16.99 Abdi ABDIRAHMAN 02 DEC 1978 USA USA 7 Eugene, OR (USA) 08 JUN 2008
6 27:20.18 Leonard KORIR 10 DEC 1986 USA USA 13 London (GBR) 04 AUG 2017
7 27:20.56 Mark NENOW 16 NOV 1957 USA USA 1 Bruxelles (BEL) 05 SEP 1986
8 27:22.28 Dathan RITZENHEIN 30 DEC 1982 USA USA 6 Berlin (GER) 17 AUG 2009
9 27:24.67 Bobby CURTIS 28 NOV 1984 USA USA 2f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 01 MAY 2011
10 27:25.61 Alberto SALAZAR 07 AUG 1958 USA USA 2 Oslo (NOR) 26 JUN 1982
11 27:28.19 Tim NELSON 27 FEB 1984 USA USA 5f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 01 MAY 2011
12 27:28.22 Matt TEGENKAMP 19 JAN 1982 USA USA 6f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 01 MAY 2011
13 27:29.16 Craig VIRGIN 02 AUG 1955 USA USA 1 Paris (FRA) 17 JUL 1980
14 27:30.53 Diego ESTRADA 19 DEC 1989 USA USA 9 Eugene, OR (USA) 29 MAY 2015
15 27:31.34 Todd WILLIAMS 07 MAR 1969 USA USA 3 Knoxville, TN (USA) 06 APR 1995
16 27:31.38 Chris DERRICK 17 OCT 1990 USA USA 3f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 29 APR 2012
17 27:32.49 Hassan MEAD 28 AUG 1989 USA USA 15 London (GBR) 04 AUG 2017
18 27:33.93 Alan CULPEPPER 15 SEP 1972 USA USA 5 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 04 MAY 2001
19 27:34.72 Alan WEBB 13 JAN 1983 USA USA 1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 30 APR 2006
20 27:37.17 Bruce BICKFORD 12 MAR 1957 USA USA 1 Stockholm (SWE) 02 JUL 1985
21 27:37.45 Bob KENNEDY 18 AUG 1970 USA USA 5 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 30 APR 2004
22 27:37.74 Anthony FAMIGLIETTI 08 NOV 1978 USA USA 3 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 30 APR 2006
23 27:40.21 Brent VAUGHN 04 SEP 1984 USA USA 7f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 29 APR 2012
24 27:41.05 Ed EYESTONE 15 JUN 1961 USA USA 1 Walnut (USA) 27 APR 1985
25 27:41.17 Ben TRUE 29 DEC 1985 USA USA 8f1 Palo Alto, CA (USA) 29 APR 2012
Only one of these top 25 were set in the 90s, again most were set in the 80s or in the 2000s.
Top 25 marathon times:
1 2:05:38 Khalid KHANNOUCHI 22 DEC 1971 USA USA 1 London (GBR) 14 APR 2002
2 2:06:07 Galen RUPP 08 MAY 1986 USA USA 1 Praha (CZE) 06 MAY 2018
3 2:06:17 Ryan HALL 14 OCT 1982 USA USA 5 London (GBR) 13 APR 2008
4 2:07:47 Dathan RITZENHEIN 30 DEC 1982 USA USA 9 Chicago, IL (USA) 07 OCT 2012
5 2:08:10 Mbarak HUSSEIN 04 APR 1965 USA USA 3 Seoul (KOR) 14 MAR 2004
6 2:08:56 Abdi ABDIRAHMAN 02 DEC 1978 USA USA 4 Chicago, IL (USA) 22 OCT 2006
7 2:09:08 Mebrahtom KEFLEZIGHI 05 MAY 1975 USA USA 1 Houston, TX (USA) 14 JAN 2012
8 2:09:21 Alberto SALAZAR 07 AUG 1958 USA USA 5 Fukuoka (JPN) 04 DEC 1983
9 2:09:27 Bill RODGERS 23 DEC 1947 USA USA 1 Boston, MA (USA) 16 APR 1979
10 2:09:32 David MORRIS 17 MAY 1970 USA USA 4 Chicago, IL (USA) 24 OCT 1999
11 2:09:35 Jerry LAWSON 02 JUL 1966 USA USA 7 Chicago, IL (USA) 19 OCT 1997
12 2:09:37 Dick BEARDSLEY 21 MAR 1956 USA USA 1 Duluth, MN (USA) 20 JUN 1981
13 2:09:41 Alan CULPEPPER 15 SEP 1972 USA USA 6 Chicago, IL (USA) 13 OCT 2002
14 2:10:04 Patrick PETERSEN 03 DEC 1959 USA USA 7 London (GBR) 23 APR 1989
15 2:10:05 Phil COPPESS 02 SEP 1954 USA USA 1 St. Paul (USA) 06 OCT 1985
16 2:10:15 Jeff WELLS 25 MAY 1954 USA USA 2 Boston, MA (USA) 17 APR 1978
17 2:10:19 Tony SANDOVAL 19 MAY 1954 USA USA 1 Niagara Falls, NY (USA) 24 MAY 1980
18 2:10:20 Garry BJORKLUND 22 APR 1951 USA USA 1 Duluth, MN (USA) 21 JUN 1980
19 2:10:24 Luke PUSKEDRA 08 FEB 1990 USA USA 5 Chicago, IL (USA) 11 OCT 2015
20 2:10:29 Kirk PFEFFER 20 JUL 1956 USA USA 7 Fukuoka (JPN) 07 DEC 1980
21 2:10:30 Frank SHORTER 31 OCT 1947 USA USA 1 Fukuoka (JPN) 03 DEC 1972
22 2:10:36 Brett GOTCHER 01 SEP 1984 USA USA 7 Houston, TX (USA) 17 JAN 2010
23 2:10:41 Benji DURDEN 28 AUG 1951 USA USA 2 Niagara Falls, NY (USA) 24 MAY 1980
23 2:10:41 Bill DONAKOWSKI 21 JUN 1956 USA USA 1 St. Paul (USA) 12 OCT 1986
25 2:10:47 Brian SELL 11 APR 1979 USA USA 6 Chicago, IL (USA) 22 OCT 2006
Only two of these top 25 marathon times were set in the 90s, most were set in the 80s and 2000s.
NeedSomeTalent wrote:
If you have some talent, any race 8k or under you can run very competitively off 35-40 miles a wk and 2 workouts per week. Change my mind.
Yes you can run very competitively in relation to your potential. Probably not your absolute best as many have pointed but if you train consistently year round and hard you'll be close.
Half, marathon and beyond need more mileage for sure, no shortcuts.
Slow Pokes don't count wrote:
Said by the guy who runs 26 minutes. Nobody is running 23:30 on 40 mpw. Poll 1000 college guys and you will see a direct correlation between the number of miles run and the times run.
you are right. I was running round 30-40 mpw. Could only get down to 24:20 for 8k and 14:01 5k. However don't think I managed to ever break 31 for 10k.
Doug Padilla seemed to run well on that amount of MPW. Granted, he was more of a 1500-5000 runner but he did run XC in college as well.
Might need to bump it up quite a bit if doing half or full marathons.
Have of the people in the top 10 at this year's Lansing Turkey Trot in Michigan run 30 mpw and turned in 15:10-15:40 performances for a 5k
OP is very correct, once you have a certain aerobic base, its all about how hard you can push yourself to your absolute limit.
In Recovery wrote:
Dowling Catholic Undertrainer wrote:
You may not like anecdotal evidence but Karissa was fully mature in 2011. She would have been an average 17:30 college runner had she gone to some D3 school where she would have remained at 40MPW. Instead, she is a world class runner.
Karissa Schweizer
2011 - 30MPW 19:00
2012 - 35MPW 18:40
2013 - 40MPW 17:50
2014 - 45MPW 17:20
2015 - 50MPW 16:30
2016 - 60MPW 15:58
2017 - 65MPW 15:19
2018 - 75MPW 15:17
Ahh.. 15:17 is not world class; zero Diamond League meets with that resume...
Guess you've changed your mind.