Nijel Amos 1:44.65 At Stanford Invite

Let's see what he does the rest of the season. Last season his best was 1:43.18, the 2016 season his best was 1:44.66 - a far cry from his very impressive two fastest times of 1:41.73 (9th all-time) at London and 1:42.45 (30th all-time), in the 2014 season.

No...absolute nonsense from someone who doesn't research and drinks too much Kool-Aid.

I see it as dramatic decline over the last 3 yrs. He was a teenage phenom at London running the 9th fastest ever 800. He's now in his prime at 25 and going downhill. What's going on here Slick?

A very impressive silver at London right behind the GOAT Rudisha. However:

What happened at the 2013 WC? DNS.

What happened at the 2015 WC? Failed to advance from the semi's

What happened at Rio? Failed to advance from the prelims!

What happened at the 2017 WC? 5th in a watered-down field.

Coe ran 1:41.73 in the pre-EPO era which ties Amos & Kipketer as 9th all-time fastest. Coe also ran a 1:42.33, which is 25th all-time fastest. Coe is a 2xOlympic Gold & 2xOlympic Silver medalist!...no comparison to Amos.

ex-runner wrote:

busy bee wrote:

[quote]ex-runner wrote:

1:44 is a great season opener for anyone. Which pros have ever opened their season in April with 1:41???

Well, that would be because Coe was busy getting the 1000, 1500, & mile world records. Coe had the record for 16 years! Did he have any incentive to break his own record again?

Do you even comprehend the insanity of that statement?

Has Rudisha been all about breaking his own record after running that 1:40? Haven't heard a peep from him about it since he did it....and he's the 800 specialist. Coe wasn't.

I look at it a different way. For me, Coe and Amos are the equal 3rd fastest 800m runners in history, rather than running the 9th fastest times. Only 2 men have run faster.

Amos’s run had the advantage of having Rudisha in front ‘dragging’ every ounce of effort from Amos just behind. For me, it easier to follow than being way out in front as Coe was. That is another reason why Rudisha’s run was so special. Secondly, there is no doubt that the London mondo track of 2012 would have been faster than the worn out, bleached and pot-holed track Coe ran on.

The reason Coe only ran 1:41 once is partly due to the fact that he was chasing other World records in his best season, partly due to the fact that there was no diamond league in 81, partly due to having to run a perecentage of domestic races (due to power of AAA and Andy Norman in controlling where and when British athletes raced at that time) and partly due to lack of incentive to break your own world record, when you’re already 1.71secs faster than anyone else in history!

You also have to remember that Coe ran his 1:41 very early in the season, June 10th. I think I recall Rudisha running a 1:41.74 in early June 2012, and look what he was capable of with another 2 months of training and fine tuning!?

No one, especially someone such as Coe, who has the European Cup and World Cups to win in late August/ early September 81, and with a planned mile race with Ovett in Brussels at end of season, is going to plan to be at a peak in his first International race of the season in early June!

I asked Coe about his Firenze race in 2012, when he brought out his biography, and asked him what he felt he could have run for 800 that season, 81, had he chased it a few times later in the year. He said he felt he could have run 1:41.2. I then asked what that would be on a modern mondo track, ‘like the one in the London Olympic arena’, to which he replied, “oh, then a few tenths faster”.

Unfortunately, the following 2 seasons, 82 & 83, which should have been his peak years (25/26) , he was badly affected by injuries and illnesses, so he was never in the condition to approach his 1:41.7 WR. Although anyone who can run 1:44.0 in a solo relay in v windy conditions off a 49.1 first lap, and having missed a couple of months training in early summer, must have been capable of a 1:43.0.

I also believe he could have run at least 1:42 low in 84 and 86, when one considers he ran 10m wide in the LA final in 1:43.6, and even more distance in his 1:44.5 win in Stuttgart 86, but he just didn’t get into a v fast circuit race when he was taken through first lap in 50 flat or faster.

With regards to Amos, considering he was supposedly only 18 or 19 in 2012, it is a bit strange he hasn’t approached that time, or at least run in a race that suggests that sort of time, since. I was particularly surprised at his lacklustre performance in a very weak World Champs final last year. But then, even the best have off days, and he could have been carrying an injury!?

a) How many times did "shell of his former self" Sebastian Coe run 1:44-1:46 after his world record in 1981? b) How many times did he run 1:43.10 or faster? a) A lot. b) 3 times.

Lets Tell It Like It Is wrote:

Let it Rupp wrote:

It's f*cking April at a college meet and his season opener. Relax.

Why do I need to f*cking relax? ? I don't have a dog in this fight - I'm pointing out some facts that you're obviously not aware of.

Almost 3 secs off his PB? You realize he's tied with Coe & Kipketer as the *9th* all-time fastest? He had a bad 2013 season with injuries but rebounded back a little in 2014 & 15. But what has he done since then other than get slower? A shadow of his former self and a one & done Olympic/WC medalist.

http://www.alltime-athletics.com/m_800ok.htm

Answer b should be once. He ran 1:42.33 in 1979, 1:41.73 in 1981, and 1:43.07 in 1985, so he did it just once after his world record.

Truly wrote:

ex-runner wrote:

Do you even comprehend the insanity of that statement?

Has Rudisha been all about breaking his own record after running that 1:40? Haven't heard a peep from him about it since he did it....and he's the 800 specialist. Coe wasn't.

Rudisha broke his own world record twice.

zxcvzxv wrote:

Answer b should be once. He ran 1:42.33 in 1979, 1:41.73 in 1981, and 1:43.07 in 1985, so he did it just once after his world record.

And anyone with a clue knows that 1985 was a weak year for him. If he could run 1:43.0 in 85, or indeed 1:43.3 in 89 at age 32, when way past his best, then he was certainly capable of 1:42 in 1984 and 1986.

For a start, his 1000m WR in 81 was worth at least 1:42.5 for 800m.

You do realise that 1:43.6 in LA, running 10m wide, is equivalent to 1:42.3 had he run the exact distance in a circuit race? And that was off a 51.3 (= to 50.9 had he not run 3m wide on 1st bend).

Or that anyone running a 1:44.5 (in the European final of 86), again with 10.5 - 11m wide, off a negative split and running a last 200m of 24.8 (= to 24.4/24.5 without running last bend 3m wide); making him capable of a 24.4 finish in a 1:43.1/1:43.2 race had he run the exact distance in a paced circuit race, is capable of a 1:42 low?

Based purely on time, some on here would appear to believe that Coe was a better 2 lap runner in 89, than he was in 84 (when world ranked #2) or 86 (world ranked #1), when he didn't even break 1:44, because he ran faster times in 85 and 89! Of course that wasn't the case.

Apart from the 85 race in Cologne, when else was Coe taken through 400m in 50.5 or faster after his 1:41 WR?

Of course factually, you are correct. Coe didn't break 1:43.0 again after his WR in 81. But any reading of this to mean he wasn't capable of doing so is totally wrong.

ex-runner wrote:

Truly wrote:

Has Rudisha been all about breaking his own record after running that 1:40? Haven't heard a peep from him about it since he did it....and he's the 800 specialist. Coe wasn't.

Rudisha broke his own world record twice.

The poster you are responding to was referring to his 1:40.91 WR in London. He broke his own record before this; knocking 0.02 off Kipketer's WR in 2010, then lowering it by 0.08 later that same year. All in all, Rudisha lowered Kipketer's mark by 0.20sec.

The reason why both Rudisha (chasing Kipketer's mark) and Kipketer (chasing Coe's mark) ran so many sub 1:43's, apart from the obvious reason that their eras came a long time after Coe's; and thus progression in times over 30 years should be expected; was because they were 'pure' 2 lap runners who ran nothing else other than 800m; ran at a time when there was a Golden/Diamond league system when sub 50 secs first laps were de rigueur; and most importantly, is because they were both chasing standards that they took a lot of time and efforts to surpass.

Whereas Coe broke the WR by 1.1secs in 79, and then a further 0.6sec in 81. With that 2nd WR, he was 1.71secs faster than anyone else in history. The incentive to prove himself and chase a WR he already held, and which was out of reach of everyone else until Cruz 3 years later, was not there, as it was for Kipketer and Rudisha. Thus he didn't have the need, even though there wasn't the possibilities to do so anyway, to go out in the months and years to come, and run a slew of 1:42's.

I personally think Amos is clean. If you dig around the web, he apparently was trying to become some sort of DJ or something and partying. He tried to miss a drug test because of marijuana but I believe that got sorted out. He had a large dispute over all of this with his parents. He is now training in America with a group that isn't NOP.

http://www.weekendpost.co.bw/wp-news-details.php?nid=699

https://www.facebook.com/BotswanaGuardian/posts/674998689190981

ithinkhesclean wrote:

I personally think Amos is clean. If you dig around the web, he apparently was trying to become some sort of DJ or something and partying. He tried to miss a drug test because of marijuana but I believe that got sorted out. He had a large dispute over all of this with his parents. He is now training in America with a group that isn't NOP.

Hmm! Well he has done himself no favours in the past!

The following extract from above link being particularly concerning!

'It is not the first time the 2012 Olympic silver medalist absconded from the test in fact, Masalila has revealed that it was the third time Amos failed to honor the call, and this time around the agency seems to be ready to crack the whip. Part of the letter states the athlete could suffer consequences.

Sources close to the athlete have also revealed that Amos has confessed the incident to them. ’’It appears that he was not prepared, and after receiving the call from WADA notifying him about their intentions he immediately fled to Botswana to avoid embarrassment because it appears he is not sure about his status,’’ one of the sources revealed.'

And I take it this is from a Botswanian newspaper!?

Also this: -

ithinkhesclean wrote:

I personally think Amos is clean. If you dig around the web, he apparently was trying to become some sort of DJ or something and partying. He tried to miss a drug test because of marijuana but I believe that got sorted out. He had a large dispute over all of this with his parents. He is now training in America with a group that isn't NOP.

http://www.weekendpost.co.bw/wp-news-details.php?nid=699https://www.facebook.com/BotswanaGuardian/posts/674998689190981

Where did you get the marijuana use as the reason he missed an OOC test?

Neither the "Weekendpost" report nor FB story you linked mentions anything about marijuana use. In fact, the Weekendpost report says he has missed not one but three (3) OOC tests and is playing playing "cat and mouse" with WADA.

So, it could just as well be PEDs as the reason he's dodging the advanced notice OOC tests (imagine that. Lol). And I bet if he was a Russian or Moroccan athlete you'd singing a different tune. ?

Let's call a spade a spade. Three deliberately missed tests is dodgy. Remember Ngugi refused one test and received a 4 year ban.

Deanouk wrote:

Of course factually, you are correct.

If you Google it, you'll see multiple posts on letsrun. Admittedly, that may all be based off something made up but I don't see much evidence of PED use based on his performances when he missed those drug tests. I wish there is some better sourcing on what happened.

Amos's splits looked like roughly 51.7, 27, 26.

That's a pretty slow first 400 and indeed 600 for a 1:44 and he did pick it up the last 200, which is not an ideal way to run a fast 800m. He's probably already in high 1:43 shape. The pacer was out too slowly and faded from 400 to 500 before Amos passed.

With a 45.94 FAT 400m already, Amos was ready to go out a lot faster and it was just March, so I would not be surprised to see him run another 1:42 this summer. His best was #2 last year to Korir. He himself says he doesn't know what he was doing to get to 1:41 back in 2012. I am very skeptical of that time being legal or his age being as declared, but at any rate, he is going to be a contender for top 800m runner again this year, though I currently give the edge to Saruni and his former teammate:

119 1:43.10 Emmanuel Korir KEN 15.06.95 1 Monaco 21.07.2017

142 1:43.18 Nijel Amos BOT 15.03.94 1 London 09.07.2017

301 1:43.60 Clayton Murphy USA 26.02.95 1r1 Torrance 15.04.2017

549 1:43.94 Wycliffe Kinyamal KEN 02.07.97 1 Rovereto 29.08.2017

556 1:43.95 Donavan Brazier USA 15.04.97 2 London 09.07.2017

#3 should not be forgotten, nor Brazier and Berian. Wycliffe Kinyamal, listed as 20 last year, was the fourth fastest individual, and with that being the first year he was on the scene, as far as I know, he should run faster.

Those splits show he is in great shape. Very few in history have been able to run 1:44.xx like that. He may not be in world record shape but he is in great shape.

So what happened at the Commonwealths?

is this update for the time or for the name of the runner? If you want an impressive season opener break 4 minutes for the full mile, run 1000m in a seasons best. 1:44.65 is a good result for anyone, but it doesnt tell if he has advanges in either raw speed or endurance vs a world class runner. Good result for Amos, but to make the post more interesting how about we talk about the race itself, the tactics.

hitmonlee wrote:

is this update for the time or for the name of the runner? If you want an impressive season opener break 4 minutes for the full mile, run 1000m in a seasons best. 1:44.65 is a good result for anyone, but it doesnt tell if he has advanges in either raw speed or endurance vs a world class runner. Good result for Amos, but to make the post more interesting how about we talk about the race itself, the tactics.

what are you on about?