Olympics 2020 - All African-born US distance team: what would your reaction be?

durdur wrote:

rojo wrote:

Yes, there is racism here but why do people harp on it? If this country was so awful, then why in the hell did Barack Obama's father decide to come here in 1954 when we were way more racist?

You do realize in Kenya in the last 10 years they have tribal warfare with up to 1,500 butchered and 180k to 600k displaced. I would say hating on someone for their tribe is not different than race. It's the same damn thing. So what you are complaining about exists basically all over the world - even basically all black countries.

"Yes, there is racism here but why do people harp on it?" We harp on it because we don't like it and think our country can do better. It's not that complicated.

The post you are responding to never made a comparative claim about the level of racism in the US compared to other countries, just stated that the US is a land of racism and is fearful of immigrants, which both are pretty clearly true. We might have less than some other countries, but why does people complaining about and pointing out the racism in our country or on this website strike such a nerve with you? Other countries also have cancer, so should stop trying to fight cancer here? Are people who bring up cancer just a bunch of whiners?

It's amusing how quickly triggered you are whenever someone dares mentions racism on your site. Almost without fail you denounce the complainers and give at least some form of implied support/soft justification for the racism posted on your site. Very similar to the approach used by Trump in the politically disastrous "both sides" statement.

And then you wonder why people think you are alt-right whacko? If you were more clever you could probably conceal it better.

Whataboutism wrote:

rojo wrote:

Yes, there is racism here but why do people harp on it? If this country was so awful, then why in the hell did Barack Obama's father decide to come here in 1954 when we were way more racist?

You do realize in Kenya in the last 10 years they have tribal warfare with up to 1,500 butchered and 180k to 600k displaced. I would say hating on someone for their tribe is not different than race. It's the same damn thing. So what you are complaining about exists basically all over the world - even basically all black countries.

1. He came on a scholarship and left as soon as he could back to Kenya.

2. This whataboutism isn't helping the argument. WWII was basically a European inter-tribal

warfare. 100 million dead, Holocaust, Nuclear bombing of Japan, genocide of Native Americans, Australian aborigines, New Zealand Maori.....We can do this the whole day.

America has a racism problem and needs to come to terms with it. This website is a prime example. hateful, bigoted posters have infested it and ruined it for most of us.

Wait a second wrote:

Whataboutism wrote:

1. He came on a scholarship and left as soon as he could back to Kenya.

2. This whataboutism isn't helping the argument. WWII was basically a European inter-tribal

warfare. 100 million dead, Holocaust, Nuclear bombing of Japan, genocide of Native Americans, Australian aborigines, New Zealand Maori.....We can do this the whole day.

America has a racism problem and needs to come to terms with it. This website is a prime example. hateful, bigoted posters have infested it and ruined it for most of us.

Name one country that doesn’t?

Have you traveled to other countries?

No this website isn’t infested.

I have traveled to/in four continents - all of the countries I have been in or lived in have varying degrees of intolerance, protectionism, racism, acceptance, social welfare safety nets, programs for minorities/immigrants/refugees, and humanity. The United States has all of that AND is the most welcoming and accepting of immigrants of any country I know.

By design, all ethnicities/nationalities or “races” ( a term I dislike and believe we are all of the human race) have hard-wired protectionist (tribal) traits to those that look, or act different, or come from a different land.

The USA is where many people from around the world want to come. It’s not perfect; however, it is more perfect (based on acceptance of others) than any country I have experienced.

I love the United States. I am originally from a different country. I am a fan of track and field. My reaction to the original post is: I would not like to see an all African US distance team based on the majority of those athletes coming from fast-track US imigration avenues like the US Army team. Great guys on that team and I don’t fault them for wanting to stay in the US and using a “soft type” loophole to gain US citizenship. I do fault our government for creating the loophole and using taxpayer funds (really without taxpayer knowledge) to essentially buy medals. I think our young “home grown” athletes that are of the caliber to possibly compete for an Olympic team spot must find this government program to be frustrating at the very least.

Wait a second wrote:

Whataboutism wrote:

1. He came on a scholarship and left as soon as he could back to Kenya.

2. This whataboutism isn't helping the argument. WWII was basically a European inter-tribal

warfare. 100 million dead, Holocaust, Nuclear bombing of Japan, genocide of Native Americans, Australian aborigines, New Zealand Maori.....We can do this the whole day.

America has a racism problem and needs to come to terms with it. This website is a prime example. hateful, bigoted posters have infested it and ruined it for most of us.

Name one country that doesn’t?

Have you traveled to other countries?

No this website isn’t infested.

I have traveled to/in four continents - all of the countries I have been in or lived in have varying degrees of intolerance, protectionism, racism, acceptance, social welfare safety nets, programs for minorities/immigrants/refugees, and humanity. The United States has all of that AND is the most welcoming and accepting of immigrants of any country I know.

By design, all ethnicities/nationalities or “races” ( a term I dislike and believe we are all of the human race) have hard-wired protectionist (tribal) traits to those that look, or act different, or come from a different land.

The USA is where many people from around the world want to come. It’s not perfect; however, it is more perfect (based on acceptance of others) than any country I have experienced.

I love the United States. I am originally from a different country. I am a fan of track and field. My reaction to the original post is: I would not like to see an all African US distance team based on the majority of those athletes coming from fast-track US imigration avenues like the US Army team. Great guys on that team and I don’t fault them for wanting to stay in the US and using a “soft type” loophole to gain US citizenship. I do fault our government for creating the loophole and using taxpayer funds (really without taxpayer knowledge) to essentially buy medals. I think our young “home grown” athletes that are of the caliber to possibly compete for an Olympic team spot must find this government program to be frustrating at the very least.

Whataboutism wrote:

Wait a second wrote:

Name one country that doesn’t?

Have you traveled to other countries?

No this website isn’t infested.

I have traveled to/in four continents - all of the countries I have been in or lived in have varying degrees of intolerance, protectionism, racism, acceptance, social welfare safety nets, programs for minorities/immigrants/refugees, and humanity. The United States has all of that AND is the most welcoming and accepting of immigrants of any country I know.

By design, all ethnicities/nationalities or “races” ( a term I dislike and believe we are all of the human race) have hard-wired protectionist (tribal) traits to those that look, or act different, or come from a different land.

The USA is where many people from around the world want to come. It’s not perfect; however, it is more perfect (based on acceptance of others) than any country I have experienced.

I love the United States. I am originally from a different country. I am a fan of track and field. My reaction to the original post is: I would not like to see an all African US distance team based on the majority of those athletes coming from fast-track US imigration avenues like the US Army team. Great guys on that team and I don’t fault them for wanting to stay in the US and using a “soft type” loophole to gain US citizenship. I do fault our government for creating the loophole and using taxpayer funds (really without taxpayer knowledge) to essentially buy medals. I think our young “home grown” athletes that are of the caliber to possibly compete for an Olympic team spot must find this government program to be frustrating at the very least.

1. There’re tons of examples but I’ll give you one; Germany. They’ve largely acknowledged and atoned for ther racist past, something America is unable or unwilling to do.

2. Are you insinuating that the “home grown “ athletes aren’t good enough to compete? Why would they be frustrated if they’re of a good enough caliber?

Wait a second wrote:

Whataboutism wrote:

1. There’re tons of examples but I’ll give you one; Germany. They’ve largely acknowledged and atoned for ther racist past, something America is unable or unwilling to do.

2. Are you insinuating that the “home grown “ athletes aren’t good enough to compete? Why would they be frustrated if they’re of a good enough caliber?

To your points:

1) I wish that were true of Germany. However, it is my experience, when having spent time there in the 1980’s, that not to be reality in the minds of the people. Currently, in Germany, the people are quite upset with their government over imigration policy. So much so that that issue alone is altering Germany’s political and social landscape. If you are inferring anti Semitic acknowledgement and atonement then I agree with you, as people I know in Germany are very ashamed of their history of this.

2) My statement “home grown athletes that are of the caliber to possibly compete for an Olympic team spot must find this government program to be frustrating at the very least”

This government program l reference in my statement is the US Army program that enables Kenyan runners (specifically but that may be expanding for all I know) fast-track (pun is intended) US citizenship due to the fact that these guys (no women... yet that I understand) run fast - very fast.

Put yourself in the shoes of an athlete that is of the caliber to possibly compete for an Olympic team spot. That possibility rolls around every four years. You are training well, racing well, and progressing well to the point of having made the trials and Olympic standard. Now you face parachuted in competition, that are recently of different nationality but through a loophole (and wanted talent) US citizen runners. Not one but two, three, or four people from this group are possibly, or are, faster than you. They are given fast-track US citizenship unlike others who wish to become US citizens. These guys end up toeing the line at the US Olympic trials and you come in third or fourth behind two or three of these guys. Only two athletes per event make the team. All that you have trained for and sacrificed for is for not. Now think of the younger runners in our country that followed this runner, during his high school, collegiate, and pro career, that just got beat by guys they may not have heard of. Then these younger runners learn about how and why very fast runners from other countries are all of a sudden competing for the USA. Do you think their knowing about this increases or decreases their likelihood of long term commitment to track and field and chasing their Olympic dream? Be honest in/with your thoughts.

Whataboutism wrote:

Wait a second wrote:

To your points:

1) I wish that were true of Germany. However, it is my experience, when having spent time there in the 1980’s, that not to be reality in the minds of the people. Currently, in Germany, the people are quite upset with their government over imigration policy. So much so that that issue alone is altering Germany’s political and social landscape. If you are inferring anti Semitic acknowledgement and atonement then I agree with you, as people I know in Germany are very ashamed of their history of this.

2) My statement “home grown athletes that are of the caliber to possibly compete for an Olympic team spot must find this government program to be frustrating at the very least”

This government program l reference in my statement is the US Army program that enables Kenyan runners (specifically but that may be expanding for all I know) fast-track (pun is intended) US citizenship due to the fact that these guys (no women... yet that I understand) run fast - very fast.

Put yourself in the shoes of an athlete that is of the caliber to possibly compete for an Olympic team spot. That possibility rolls around every four years. You are training well, racing well, and progressing well to the point of having made the trials and Olympic standard. Now you face parachuted in competition, that are recently of different nationality but through a loophole (and wanted talent) US citizen runners. Not one but two, three, or four people from this group are possibly, or are, faster than you. They are given fast-track US citizenship unlike others who wish to become US citizens. These guys end up toeing the line at the US Olympic trials and you come in third or fourth behind two or three of these guys. Only two athletes per event make the team. All that you have trained for and sacrificed for is for not. Now think of the younger runners in our country that followed this runner, during his high school, collegiate, and pro career, that just got beat by guys they may not have heard of. Then these younger runners learn about how and why very fast runners from other countries are all of a sudden competing for the USA. Do you think their knowing about this increases or decreases their likelihood of long term commitment to track and field and chasing their Olympic dream? Be honest in/with your thoughts.

1. Thanks for admitting that there are other countries that have atoned for their racism, however imperfectly. The American attitude, as exemplified by the co-founder of this website is essentially, "there is racism in America, so what? If you don't like it you can eff off to wherever you came from" or something along those lines.

2. As to the poor " home grown" athletes the obvious solution is to train harder and earn their spot in the US Olympic team. Simple as that. That's the American way, isn't it?

The other solution would be to introduce a "special Olympics" where the sweet "home growns" can win all the medals.

dude what wrote:

durdur wrote:

"Yes, there is racism here but why do people harp on it?" We harp on it because we don't like it and think our country can do better. It's not that complicated.

The post you are responding to never made a comparative claim about the level of racism in the US compared to other countries, just stated that the US is a land of racism and is fearful of immigrants, which both are pretty clearly true. We might have less than some other countries, but why does people complaining about and pointing out the racism in our country or on this website strike such a nerve with you? Other countries also have cancer, so should stop trying to fight cancer here? Are people who bring up cancer just a bunch of whiners?

It's amusing how quickly triggered you are whenever someone dares mentions racism on your site. Almost without fail you denounce the complainers and give at least some form of implied support/soft justification for the racism posted on your site. Very similar to the approach used by Trump in the politically disastrous "both sides" statement.

And then you wonder why people think you are alt-right whacko? If you were more clever you could probably conceal it better.

Which part of Rojo's post was racist?