Is Ledecky clean?

Nonsense wrote:

Lilly king meet jessica hardy

Jessica Hardy's old news.

Coach Cookie wrote:

Nonsense wrote:

Lilly king meet jessica hardy

Speaking of Jessica Hardy... her coach also coaches Efimova and Morozov... right here in the good ol' US of A.

I don't know much of Efimova's history, but my understanding is that her most recent bust was for Meldonium. Not to beat a dead horse (i did that in a previous post), but it likely has no PED characteristics, based on the 192 studies i reviewed. That being said, I believe she was busted for steroids previously to that. Did not appear that any of it did her much good.

OLD SMTC SOB wrote:

Coach Cookie wrote:

Speaking of Jessica Hardy... her coach also coaches Efimova and Morozov... right here in the good ol' US of A.

I don't know much of Efimova's history, but my understanding is that her most recent bust was for Meldonium. Not to beat a dead horse (i did that in a previous post), but it likely has no PED characteristics, based on the 192 studies i reviewed. That being said, I believe she was busted for steroids previously to that. Did not appear that any of it did her much good.

WTF are you talking about? She stole a silver medal away from a clean athlete yesterday.

That's a nice opinon. THERE IS NO QUESTION SHE USING SOMETHING TO MAKE HER THAT GOOD. And there are many people outside of USA Doping uh Swimming that are edcauted good people and it has become clear that the Olys in general has serious problems. But as long as there are pepople that have your opinon... why change. So on goes the doping with test that are a joke, and good people that want to reform the Olys. Reform not meaning clean the Olys will never be clean so we need some sort of check system. Glad its not my job.

If there is "NO QUESTION", then please provide the data that leads you to that conclusion.

Coach Cookie wrote:

OLD SMTC SOB wrote:

I don't know much of Efimova's history, but my understanding is that her most recent bust was for Meldonium. Not to beat a dead horse (i did that in a previous post), but it likely has no PED characteristics, based on the 192 studies i reviewed. That being said, I believe she was busted for steroids previously to that. Did not appear that any of it did her much good.

WTF are you talking about? She stole a silver medal away from a clean athlete yesterday.

She has a drug tainted history, indeed. Meldonium however has not shown to be a PED. Whether the steroid she was busted for had lasting effects is hard to determine. So short of being banned outright, she followed the rules as they currently stand. Unfortunate as that may be. I feel for the bronze medalist, but at least she didn't get the gold.

You're not understanding.

Let me make my point more clear: the Ledeckys are dorks.

Not only would they never even think of using PED's, IMO they would be frightened to do so. They are the consummate "true believers" in truth, justice, and fair play, and are likely frightened at even the thought of running afoul of established social rules, right down to things like parking tickets.

Without being disparaging, they are real dorks. I mean real, true, honest-to-goodness dorks.

I'm no spring chicken, I think that in track, for instance, drug use is rampant, and that it is also widespread in swimming. Nor do I consider the Ledeckys friends. But in this respect, in my judgment, they are absolutely beyond even the slightest scintilla of suspicion.

Squeaky clean dorks.

Hitemwiththehein wrote:

She won a gold medal at age 15. I may be naive but it would be pretty sick of her parents and coaches to give her drugs in her early teenage years, I just cannot believe that would happen. Her family is also very wealthy and Ivy League educated. There is nothing financially for them to gain doping a teenager... So their only motivation would be obsessive competitive narcissism which does not fit the mold at all. She's a talent.

Remember Genevieve Jeanson ?

Mr. Obvious wrote:

Hitemwiththehein wrote:

She won a gold medal at age 15. I may be naive but it would be pretty sick of her parents and coaches to give her drugs in her early teenage years, I just cannot believe that would happen. Her family is also very wealthy and Ivy League educated. There is nothing financially for them to gain doping a teenager... So their only motivation would be obsessive competitive narcissism which does not fit the mold at all. She's a talent.

Yes, because nobody who is wealth and educated is at all obessive. Or competitive. Or narcissistic. Or prone to taking shortcuts when it benefits them.

I have no idea if she is clean or not, but this kind of "defense" is just ridiculous.

Exactly. If you're wealthy, you probably didn't get there by chance. You have to be willing to do what others won't. And you probably would have the resources to support doping. Plus her uncle owns the NY Islanders. Think he'd have one or two connections???

A swimmer wrote:

Hitemwiththehein wrote:

Her family is also very wealthy

I see this as more reason why she might have been taking drugs since childhood.

Exactly. You think poor people can afford to do all that and cover it up?

Throws Like a Girl wrote:

Coach Cookie wrote:

She's our Caster Semenya. She'll probably be transgender later in life.

Nope. Definitely a girl. Look how she throws a baseball:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/d2/6c/f5/d26cf560d32b6db41f62c635591ba567.jpg

In fact, forget all of these invasive genetic tests. Just have every athlete throw a baseball and we can pretty clearly tell if they are male or female. It's probably a more accurate test than genital inspection.

+1 post of the Olympiad

SwimGuy wrote:

Hosszu's suspicion is not so much because of her times, but because of the drastic change in her times- she didn't perform that great in London, then asked her (now) husband Shane Tusup, who is a somewhat shady or possibly abusive guy, to start coaching her. She then pretty quickly saw significant improvements to the point that she beat the 400 IM world record, which was held by the confirmed doper Ye Shiwen, by a whole two seconds.

This is pretty opposite of Ledecky, who has been crushing and consistently improving for many years.

So I don't think its the fact that Ledecky and Hosszu have times that are outliers that make them open to suspicion or consideration, but rather we should look at their progressions and ask if they look iffy. With that in mind, I believe KL is clean, and simply a freak of nature

Hosszu apparently didn't even lift weights. Of course she would improve drastically. Not to say she is clean, but if you're a runner and you've never done a long run then suddenly start doing them, one should expect your times to improve.

Yeah and a family with 100s of millions of dollars, sports connections, and basically unlimited resources.

John Leonard, the US executive director of the World Swimming Coaches Association once said:

‘Any time someone has looked like Superwoman in the history of our sport they have later been found guilty of doping.’

If someone could outpace one of the fastest male swimmers in the world and finish three-and-a-half lengths ahead of her nearest female rival, he said, ‘all those things, I think, legitimately call that swim into question’.

Read more:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2181121/Ye-Shiwen-US-attacks-China-drugs-row-supergirl-swimmer.html#ixzz4GsHSmB2p

Only two women have gone under four minutes: Ledecky and Italy’s Federica Pellegrini, who twice accomplished the feat in 2009 while wearing the high-tech buoyant suits that since have been banned.

Olympics 400M IM medley / 400M Freestyle

1988 Janet Evans USA 4:03:85 WR

1992 HUN 4:36:34 Dagmar Hase GER 4:07:18

1996 Michelle Smith IRL 4:39:18 Michelle Smith IRL 4:07:25

2000 Klochkova UKR 4:33:59 Bennett USA 4:05:08

2004 Klockkova UKR 4:34:83 Manadou FRA 4:05:34

2008 Rice AUS 4:29:55 WR GBR 4:03.22 (top 4 under 4:03:85)

2012 CHI 4:28:43 FRA 4:01:45

2016 Hosszu HUN 4:26:36 Ledecky 3:56:46

3:56:46 bests the Mens world record up to 1974. That time wins the mens gold medal in every olympics through 1972 and gets broke at 1976.

Should it be examined ? Sure.

Do I think she is doped? No.

Is she testing clean? Yes.

Are we witnessing greatness? Yes.

Get your heads out of the clouds of suspicion and appreciate the greatness on display. A deserving champion demonstrating women can do more than once thought capable.

There is proof in psychology that we believe what we want to believe. We want to believe a 15-year-old and now a 19-year-old display superhuman abilities never before thought possible...and that there's nothing to worry about. Maybe you should quit believing in a fantasy.

Recreational drugs, yes. But I doubt teenagers are scoffing PEDs for kicks.

Some points comparing Ledecky and Janet Evans (1988) -

1. Ledecky is only slightly faster (400 m 3:56 vs 4:03).

2. Today's pools are much faster.

3. Training has advanced.

4. Ledecky is 7 in taller in an event where height counts (freestyle).

5. Evans was restricted in training hours at Stanford.

Plus, Ledecky dominates the relatively unpopular distance events.

jbarrett wrote:

Recreational drugs, yes. But I doubt teenagers are scoffing PEDs for kicks.

They aren't taking them for kicks. They are taking them to win races and get scholarships. How often and when it occurs is pretty much impossible to say. It isn't like there is any serious testing of HS athletes.

The question is, how many of her 42 Rio Olympics condoms has she used so far?