I post on LetsRun
I post on LetsRun
I'm a basketball player, I play in the park every Saturday morning and Wednesday evenings with my kifs. I'M 5'8" WEIGH 160 pounds and can't hit foul shots. But I'm a real baller just like KD and LeBron, I'm as much a baller as Oprah and others are runners.
I don't mind the hobby joggers, to each his own. Running is a sport that can accommodate a wide variety of individuals with different goals and motivation. As long as they leave me alone I'm cool with the participation medals.
That said, there are a number of people who are openly hostile towards faster, competitive runners. I'm not sure what that's about, but it seems to infect a small number of hobby joggers.Those people are insufferable and drive me up the freaking wall.
Live and let live, and we can all get what we want out of running and go home happy.
Admitted hobby jogger here, though i could care less about medals and agree there should be a lot less of that sort of thing -- I run races to compete against myself and not for glittery toys. (I would probably stop running if I was told it would take 15 years off my life, but 5 years? Pluck it, its worth it.)
BUT -- without us there wouldn't be the many races of various distances that are out there. We provide the money. Maybe thats what you want -- fewer but more competitive races. But there's something to be said (though clearly you aren't saying it) about the small "d" democracy of the current running landscape. There's competitive space (and money) for the elites and room for everyone else as well. In my experience those of us in the middle of the pack always cheer for the leaders. We aren't impediments. The real impediments are the folks who start in the wrong corrals, stop to walk in the middle of the road and otherwise clog the way. But they gum up the works for me, not for you in the front.
And a lot of us mid-packers are the fans who watch the major marathons that are televised, who follow the stars. Without us in the audience, the sport dies.
Maybe your point is just that you are better than we are. Yes, you are better than we are. I will give you that,
He may be faster than we are, but he is not better than we are!
Let's pretend you can break 15 minutes in a 5K. BFD. When ALL of the Kenyan and Ethiopian elites can easily lap you, who are you calling ANYONE a pretend runner? It's all relative. That guy who runs a 3-hour marathon can still kick butt on 99% of the world when it comes to running. Deflate your head, please.
OderNotWiser wrote:
BUT -- without us there wouldn't be the many races of various distances that are out there. We provide the money. Maybe thats what you want -- fewer but more competitive races. But there's something to be said (though clearly you aren't saying it) about the small "d" democracy of the current running landscape. There's competitive space (and money) for the elites and room for everyone else as well. In my experience those of us in the middle of the pack always cheer for the leaders. We aren't impediments. The real impediments are the folks who start in the wrong corrals, stop to walk in the middle of the road and otherwise clog the way. But they gum up the works for me, not for you in the front.
What this guy said.
I'm a hobby jogger. I take training as seriously as possible for someone with 3 kids under 4 years old and a full time job... but that usually means 40-50mpw, 5-6 days per week, doing 2 mile repeats around 6:25/mile.
I know my 'place' in races, I don't think listening to music on my runs will 'pump me up', and I don't brag on Facebook. I run with a purpose and an educated about the sport. So what - I'm slow. I enjoy it and I need it to be healthy (not to lose weight - but in every sense of the word).
I love learning from and following the training of fast guys around town and in major races. I bet most hobby joggers don't know the names of any elites.
I digress. My point is that it's not all about performance. It's as much about attitude and commitment to the sport. I do think many people run for the low barrier of entry and as a result, many people don't view it as a real sport. Akin to church softball leagues.
douchelin^3 wrote:
This is a topic that people need to discuss, no matter how upset people get. They need to hear it.
Why?
squarelyjc wrote:
I'm a hobby jogger. I take training as seriously as possible for someone with 3 kids under 4 years old and a full time job...
If you have a job or family that could interfere with your training, you are not a serious runner. I know a guy who got divorced because his wife could not handle his dedication to running. And many people on this board only take jobs that do not distract them from running. If that means you have to save rent by living in your mother's basement, so be it.
A Typical LRC A-hole wrote:
squarelyjc wrote:I'm a hobby jogger. I take training as seriously as possible for someone with 3 kids under 4 years old and a full time job...
If you have a job or family that could interfere with your training, you are not a serious runner. I know a guy who got divorced because his wife could not handle his dedication to running. And many people on this board only take jobs that do not distract them from running. If that means you have to save rent by living in your mother's basement, so be it.
But the poster isn't a "serious runner." Thats the point. Reading comprehension. S/he is an admitted "hobby jogger." S/he trains as seriously as possible WITH . . ..
I'm serious about this wrote:
I'm so sick and tired of reading about people who call themselves runners off 5 miles/week, smile and wave and jump for joy during races with their headphones jammed in their ears, and look down their nose at me when they talk about how many marathons they've completed. YOU AREN'T A RUNNER, STOP PRETENDING TO BE ONE, STOP GETTING OFFENDED WHEN IT'S THE TRUTH. Let's cut out this politically correct garbage-- handing out participation medals for races and treating your 20 minute milers the same as the college elites. When you run 100 mile weeks, train your ass off all year long, and live and breath running, then I'll consider it--- but only if you can break 7 minutes in the mile, Sir Weekday Warrior. Eat my split shorts.
I completed Chicago and consider myself a full-fledged runner. Next mararthon, my goal is beating 10 hours and actually running 1 mile of it.
OderNotWiser wrote:
A Typical LRC A-hole wrote:If you have a job or family that could interfere with your training, you are not a serious runner. I know a guy who got divorced because his wife could not handle his dedication to running. And many people on this board only take jobs that do not distract them from running. If that means you have to save rent by living in your mother's basement, so be it.
But the poster isn't a "serious runner." Thats the point. Reading comprehension. S/he is an admitted "hobby jogger." S/he trains as seriously as possible WITH . . ..
Thank you for clarifying this for the poster... I didn't say I was a 'serious' runner. I enjoy my balanced lifestyle and probably don't have the natural talent that most serious runners do, so the cost/benefit analysis of running more wouldn't pay off for me. That doesn't mean I don't take what I do seriously - but it does mean I only take it seriously within limits. I don't run for no reason. I have a purpose, I want to learn, and I want to improve. I study form and physiology.
To my previous point, your average hobby jogger probably has no idea about these things. Maybe I'm a sub-serious runner... HA!
While some "serious runners" may consider me to be a "hobby jogger," most of my non-running friends see me as being a very serious runner! It's all kind of relative. I think we need to have respect for everyone who is helping to keep the sport alive, no matter how fast or slow they may be! I see the mass participation of so called hobby joggers as being the backbone of road racing. As has already been pointed out, that is where the money is coming from to fund these events. Also, I think about all the money flowing into charities from the hobby jogging community! Many of us regularly run for charity, and most local races are put on by charitable organizations as fund raisers. If people didn't turn out for these events they would disappear. Then where would all the "serious runners" go to show off their talent after their glory days in high school and college are over?
And how much money are you making running? Because if you're not making money and supporting yourself with that income alone, then YOU AREN'T A RUNNER.
Not going to comment on who is a runner and who is a hobby jogger. It is a matter of personal belief. I'm 62 going on 63. I still run everyday. Try to get to the track at least once a week. Ran a cross race last year and did ok. I ran it. I didn't race it. I am too slow to race anymore. God bless all those people who go out there and take the sport seriously. How fast is that? I don't know.
How many days per week? I don't know.
But, the reality is, those "hobby joggers" are driving the sport. It has become big business to where they have changed the sport. In my opinion, not for the better. They have lost site of the history of the sport. This, to me, is the bigger issue and one which saddens me. Recent announcement that New Haven 20k is planning to switch to a half marathon next year after 40 years as the premier 20k in the country. Why? Because joe jogger has no idea what 20k is. People complaining about the length of Falmouth, Litchfield, the Johnny Kelly race, Manchester....why aren't they 5k's? Half marathons? or marathons? Hell, nobody wants to run a 10k anymore! Never mind an 8k. What happened to cross and road races where you put a line down and said "ok, start here, run around that tree, over to the bar in bumbletown and the first one back wins a beer?"
0/10
No golf clap for you!
OderNotWiser wrote:
And a lot of us mid-packers are the fans who watch the major marathons that are televised, who follow the stars. Without us in the audience, the sport dies.
Running used to be better when every runner was an amateur. It was a level playing field for everyone. We had more sub-2:20 and sub-2:30 guys competing in big races like Boston and NYC. Now those sub-elite guys would rather run in smaller races where they can win tiny prize money because they have no chance against sponsored pros in WMM.
Yes, there were fewer events and fewer runners. But most runners took it seriously. We didn't have all those "participants" who are more interested in post-race party than the race itself. Those were the good old days...
If you're running 100 miles/week to break 7 mins/mile then you're doing it wrong. :-) Seriously though, plenty of races round my way with no medals, small prize money/prizes, registration on the day and cheap registration (around $7 - $15). No "big" names of course, but always a good few serious club runners etc., and the odd international standard runner. Good local races organised by good local athletic clubs. And if there's tea and sandwiches afterwards, all the better. Marathons tend to be bigger affairs with medals etc. As for me - C
If you're running 100 miles/week to break 7 mins/mile then you're doing it wrong. :-) Seriously though, plenty of road races round my way with no medals, small prize money/prizes, registration on the day and cheap registration (around $7 - $15). Take your pick of distances - 5k, 6k, 4 miles, 8k, 5 miles, 6 miles, 10k, 7miles, 10miles, Half mara, 15 miles, 25k, Full mara. No "big" names of course, but always a good few serious club runners etc., and the odd international standard runner. Good local races organised by good local athletic clubs. And if there's tea and sandwiches afterwards, all the better. Marathons tend to be bigger affairs with medals etc. The OP needs to move countries!
As for me - I'm just your typical mid life crisis runner in his early 40s. I run 4 to 5 days a week. I'll be lucky if I ever break 3:20 for the marathon or 19 minutes for 5k, but I'm in it for the love of the sport. I'll try my hardest to get faster - but at my age having taken it up so late in life, I'm just being realistic I think. But slow and proud of it - not a hope. Slow sure, but proud - not really. Am I a runner? I'd never describe myself as that, I'm just a guy who runs..
