Rudisha running the 1500!

Understand that running rounds has little to do with aerobic endurance. It has a lot to do with physical strength.

JRinaldi wrote:

Based off his 45.50 and 1:40.91, I'd say 3:31.74

Based off that, if the pace is slower than 3:45 he should be able to kick the last lap in under 50 seconds.

Kipketer managed 3:59y and 3:42.

Michael Johnson ran 43.18 - do you think he could manage 1:42 for 800m?

Rudisha would be LUCKY to run 3:35.

I've run a 52.4 last lap in a 3:44.6 race and was only a 1:47/3:40 guy, so I'm sure David could run sub 50 in the same type of race given he is 6 seconds quicker than me.

dsrunner wrote:

Cruz was actually very good at 1500/mile. In 1984

he was a favorite at 1500m also.

No, he wasn't the favourite going in to the Olympics for 1500m. He was only mentioned as a favourite by some punters after running so well in the 800m final. Said punters were clearly not well informed as his pb at the time was only 3:36.48. He said he would try a few more 1500s the following year, but his endurance was somewhat lacking compared to the big boys as he only managed a career pb of 3:35.70. He later got that down to 3:34.63 in 88.

Had he not scratched from the 1500 after the first round citing a cold, he would not have medaled in the final.

I tend to think Rudisha is similar to Cruz, although with slightly better 400 speed. I think Cruz's official pb was only 47.02 from 83 (when he was a 1:44.0 man), but he apparently ran 46 flat in training in 84, when he got down to 1:41.77.

Rudisha has ran 45.13, but at altitude, which is equivalent to around 45.5, his sea level best time. Although I'd have to say that at the time he won in London he must have been capable of 45.0-45.2.

With Rudisha perhaps a second faster than Cruz at 400m, and less than a second faster at 800m, then I would be surprised if Rudisha would be any better than 3:34 at 1500 while also training with 800m. If his main focus was to become 1500m then I could see him getting down to 3:32. But obviously all athletes are different and Rudisha may well have better endurance than we think. We can't just plug a few of his best times into a calculator and come up with a definitive 1500 time!

learn to read

the guy said "a" favorite, not "the" favorite

get a clue

he had a better 3'53.00 when losing to scott by 0.01s !

that was better than his 1500pb & any experienced observer of games knew that cruz was going to be a hugely dangerous guy if the final was slow as he coud handle rounds as that 3'36 was to win ncaa final beating marcus by nearly 1s

he much, much better by games & i have no doubt he was good for 3'32 in a 1-off race, perhaps even a 3'31 as kaki, a much inferior runner has shown can be run off mostly 800 training

if he'd run the 1500 i can see him having a 60/40 chance of having beaten cram for silver

clearly experience has taught you nothing

kaki was worst every candidate to run a fast 1500 being a muscular 800/400 guy & nobody expected better than 3'34/3'35 but he ran 3'31 !!!

cruz/rudy woud have expected much better 1500 than anything kaki ran

his 2'14 later in year in a low key meet with nothing field shows he had plenty endurance

nonsense

he was well past his peak after '84 with his congenital short leg giving him pelvic problems

he was good for 3'31/3'32 in '84 games

you clearly don't read or learn

the 400m altitude calculator along with 200/100 ones offers nothing for hypoxia effect on metabolism

it is a purely lower air-resistance/gravity output

for 400m altitude times, the final clocking is likely even an under-estimate for their sea-level =

try more like

44.8/45.0

& find me anyone here who thinks they wouda been shocked if in his london form he couda gone in a warm, dry zurich closer to 44.5

the kenyan nr is 44.2, faster than the euro record !!!

kenyans have plenty of 400 reservoir

no

cruz in rested preparation for 400/800 races was likely in low -45/low-1'41 shape in '84

rudy was not 1s quicker over 400, maybe 3/4s

the 800s differential is also likely to be ~ 3/4s in a paced run

eh ???

kaki not taught you anything ???

try more like

3'29/3'30

try more like

3'28/3'29

no

but plugging in

mid/high-44 / low-1'40

gives us a huge idea of potential

love the discussion here. I say 3:35.

ventolin, do you know what Kaki has split for a 400 in any of his 4 x 400 relays he's run in? he anchored the national record 3:04.00.

Kaki also ran 3:45 for 1500 at 15 years 11 months old and seemed to be in about 1:50 for 800 shape at that time. BMI of about 20.4.

Amos went 8:33 for 3000 at 16 years 2 months. 45.66 for 400 at 19 years, 1:41.73 at 18 years 5 months. BMI of about 19.0

Rudisha BMI about 19.5.

It's hard to envision Rudisha losing to anybody in the 1500, but that's just because I'm not used to seeing him lose I guess.

By not slowing down a lot, I mean that he runs pretty even splits for something going out in sub 50. If Symmonds, with his build, can run 3:34, and he does more long distance training (regular 5M tempos, for instance) than Rudisha currently, then with that training Rudisha should be able to hammer one. 3:31 by jrinaldi is not at all a bad pick. I still think he can do quite a bit better though if he really concentrates on it in his training.

I think he can take the WR under the right conditions. The motivation, competition and energy at the meet would have to be extremely high, though. It couldn't be done a la Daniel Komen pumping out a 7:20/3000 like it's a tempo run.

No WR for Rudisha.

In his London shape (unlikely he can hold this level for very long without injury) he could have ran 3'28 in a perfect race.

For his debut, think more about 3'31-3'32 time.

For the 1500WR he has to maintain his 45flat speed while also being capable of 13'15 5k. For reference, his London 5k ability was something like 13'35-13'40 at best.

And beside all the possibilities, why should the best 800m runner of all times move up where he struggles to compete with the best? Not gonna happen. He will run some 1500 like Symmonds for strength and focus on 800.

Come Undone is absolutely correct about Cruz being no threat in the 1500 in LA 84. He had no really fast times to his credit and never ran faster than a 3:34 in the years that followed.

Cruz was far more of a speed based 800 guy, and his best ever in training according to his official website is 46.0. He was not capable of 45 low. Just like Cram stated his best ever 400m was 48.1 in 85, and he was not capable of 46 low. Why do you continue to take seconds off what the athletes themselves state they ran?

And you are absolutely wrong about Kaki being a 400/800 runner. Give me one 400 time that Kaki has run, open or relay split? Then explain why he ran 3:45 for 1500m at 16, when winning the bronze medal at the World Youth Champs in 2005! That is a time faster than Coe, Cram or Ovett managed at that age. He is quite clearly an 800/1500 type.

He'd also ran a 3:39 at 18. Just because he hadn't run many 1500s prior to his 3:31 doesn't mean he wasn't capable of running faster earlier. In same was Coe only had a pbs of 3:42 & 3:57 at 20; he just didn't run many top level races at the distance for several years.

well ladies n gentlemen, based on my experience and judgement, i would say he wud go around 3.36 ...min straight out of his 800 m training. if he trained for 1500 meter one season i cud see him go maybe 3.30-3.32. if he has talents for the events there is no limit to where he wud go...maybe 3.27 maybe even lower...i dunno really.

hard to say. its 2 different events now. in 800 you have to run with acid and pain the last 200 m but in the 1500 meters you have a 3rd lap that aint fun. if he can live with that kind of pain and not Cruise around in 58-60 pace then he is a real threat....

nonsense

what part of losing to scott by 0.01s in 3'53 you not comprehend ???

he was a huge threat if the 1500 final had been slow

because he was chronically injured after '84 with a leg injury

learn to read

he never ran faster than 1'42.49 after '84 when any grown-up following the sport believed that at just 22y in '85, he shouda buried the wr down to low-1'41

impressive speed but no circumstances given of how much rest/prep he had for it

more nonsense

cram's official pb is 49.1

that 48.1 is a tt again with no context of rest or prep

i have asked you dozen times, find a 1'42 guy who had genuine 48+ speed at the time

someone pointed out he has run in the national 4x400 relay record team

a nonsense race where winner ran 3'36 !!!

there are a probably close to a dozen youth kenyans who coud run 3'45 at any given time

because they were rubbish at that age

those 2 woudn't have made top-10 in kenyan national youth championships today over 800 or 1500

nonsense

sudanese have never produced anywhere close to a world elite 1500 runner ever, their nr being 3'33 before kaki

they are generally 400 types with 2 of their guys having gone sub-45

more nonsense

he'd already run 1'42.69 that year !!!

no one in theire right mind woud mention 1'42 & 3'39 in same paragraph !?

if there has ever been a 1'42 guy who coudn't have run 3'39 with no specific 1500 training at all, name them

no

3'39pb when you have 1'42 offers no info whatsoever on his 1500 ability back then

coe & kaki are not same animals

coe was running rubbish 1'53s at age kaki was running 1'42 !!!

The Champ wrote:

Kipketer managed 3:59y and 3:42.

Michael Johnson ran 43.18 - do you think he could manage 1:42 for 800m?

Rudisha would be LUCKY to run 3:35.

Micheal Johnson is African american. Rudisha is Kenyan... Genetics. When he runs the 1500 its going to be so funny to see him prove everyone saying that wrong. I'm not expecting him to be a record breaker like he is at 800 but it'd be a joke to say he wouldn't be competitive.

The Champ wrote:

Kipketer managed 3:59y and 3:42.

Michael Johnson ran 43.18 - do you think he could manage 1:42 for 800m?

Rudisha would be LUCKY to run 3:35.

Micheal Johnson is African american. Rudisha is Kenyan... Genetics. When he runs the 1500 its going to be so funny to see him prove everyone saying that wrong. I'm not expecting him to be a record breaker like he is at 800 but it'd be a joke to say he wouldn't be competitive.

hitmonlee wrote:

The Champ wrote:

Kipketer managed 3:59y and 3:42.

Michael Johnson ran 43.18 - do you think he could manage 1:42 for 800m?

Rudisha would be LUCKY to run 3:35.

Micheal Johnson is African american. Rudisha is Kenyan... Genetics. When he runs the 1500 its going to be so funny to see him prove everyone saying that wrong. I'm not expecting him to be a record breaker like he is at 800 but it'd be a joke to say he wouldn't be competitive.

Kipketer is kenyan...