How to justify competitive running at the amateur/hobbyjogger level?

Unless you are a name we'd recognize on here your "competitive mindset" means you were always just competing against yourself. Breaking 15 for 5k is just a made up barrier that's important to you and you alone. Winning the local turkey trot is meaningless to anyone except you.

who o why wrote:

I'm not trying to be judgmental. I'm trying to understand my own motivations by comparing them to those who've been forced to make the transition already. I'd like someone to further deconstruct and ARTICULATE what this guy means. Because it's still not clear to me why running hard is any better than "tempoing" once you're past your peak.

You've gotten lots of answers to your question but you haven't really said anything about your own competitive history, what races you are thinking about doing now, your age, etc.

fwiw, I'm a 49-yr-old who has horribly slow as a kid, I get a kick out of competing and slowly inching my way up the local competitive landscape, and although I don't particularly enjoy running workouts, the only way to see what I can do in races is to get in some hard workouts.

This is an interesting question, and as I got older and saw my running friends get older, there seemed to be many different answers. to give you a frame of reference, I will soon turn 60, and at my best, in my late twenties, I PRed at 2:44:11 and 34:40 for ten km. That is to say, I was pretty much in your league, although in that time, the competition was such that I finished far further back in races. I have absolutely no regrets at all about the time and effort I expended trying to compete at my level. I loved it. I got out in my early 40s. The best explanation I can give is that I could not bring my training, my expectations, and my performance into line. As a result, I was dissatisified for a couple years and decided I had enough. I still do about thirty miles a week, with nothing hard. I suggest two things if you decide to continue running on a non-competitive basis: first, leave your watch at home. I've found I can enjoy running slow, but I don't want to be reminded that I am going maybe three minutes per mile slower than in my prime. Second, I would advise against racing at all, not evene once or twice a year for old time sake. You will not be fit to race and it will not be satisfying. Let go of it. I wish you the best.

I run competitively to be a part of the running community. I love going to races and forming new relationships and enjoying a nice beer afterwards. I'm not fast by any means, but I live in a small college town where I'm fast enough to win almost any race I enter. It's a great confidence booster. I ask myself if I still would run the same way if I lived in a big city where I wouldn't crack the top 50 in most races, and the answer is yes. Speed aside, I love going out for runs and seeing other runners enjoying the same sport that I love.

Masters? wrote:

How can someone in their 40s or 50s or 60s still have a "competitive mindset" about running?

Maybe you should ask Geb or Benoit why they still compete, knowing they will never run as fast as they once did.

why o why? wrote:

I've been thinking more and more about this. What's the point? I understand that motivation is personal, but that's why I want to hear from others about why they continue to do structured training when the end result is top 10 locally (17:00 5K) or top 150 nationally (2:50 at Chicago 2012), let's say.

What is your reason for not just adopting a fitness lifetyle where running "for time or place" is not a goal. And would you still enter races or go out with a watch on a daily basis if that were the case?

It's simple. Even at my advanced age, I'm still an athlete. That means I train to do my best, regardless of how it compares to others.

I do structured training because I like to push myself. I'm a former collegiate 800 meter runner and jogging, just to jog, doesn't do it for me. I'm not satisfied unless I'm running intervals from 100 - 800. 1000's suck but I love the thought of being fit enough to do them.

I'm 43 years old and about 3 years ago I decided I wanted to get in shape to run a 59 second 400. It took me about two years and many minor injuries to get my body back in condition just to be able to train in a manner that might get me to my goal. I couldn't be happier.

I love the feeling of pushing myself. I'm the only one at the track almost 100% of the time. I some times wonder why I push myself to run hard and hurt. I've come to the conclusion that doing it makes me happy on many levels in a way that nothing else can.

Enjoyment, as well as trying to achieve goals of, say, eventually getting the 17:00 to 15:xx and the 2:50 to 2:35.

Such a good thread.

fannypack wrote:

I run competitively to be a part of the running community. I love going to races and forming new relationships and enjoying a nice beer afterwards. I'm not fast by any means, but I live in a small college town where I'm fast enough to win almost any race I enter. It's a great confidence booster. I ask myself if I still would run the same way if I lived in a big city where I wouldn't crack the top 50 in most races, and the answer is yes. Speed aside, I love going out for runs and seeing other runners enjoying the same sport that I love.

I'm nowhere near winning any race (unless everyone else forgets the date and I'm the only one who remembers, ha!). But like you, I also appreciate the community and being part of that.

I also like the challenge of pursuing goals, which change as I get older. PRs are pretty much behind me, but not the buzz of pushing myself in a race or workout.

If there were no races, would I do the same thing? Certainly hope so, even if I doubt very much that the same choice of shoes, apparel, running clubs, sports med docs, massage therapists, etc., would be available. Races have more or less spurred the growth of an industry that supports runners and running. Would that industry survive the lack of races? And for how long?

But then again, there likely will never be a lack of races, because the competitive urge, as posters above have shown, never goes away. Heck, I might at 100 want to shuffle to the nursing home lunchroom faster than my room-mate. ;)

Knowing this, people hold races--and people attend them.

And age group awards? If they're usable--such as gift cards or the like--whether they're lame or not is irrelevant to the $ I save using using them. (Okay, sure I already paid for the race and the gift card may only partly recoup the cost, but given I may have been planning to run the race anyway, I'm cool with that.) So I'm always happy to win an age group award in such cases. I don't need to, but as they're available, part of the fun is to aim for them. And as I haven't a snowball's chance of winning overall, the age divisions enhance the thrill of the chase for the less speedy.

However, I've been known to enjoy races with no age divisions or with 10+ year age divisions. It's in part the competition and pushing myself and in part the time afterward to connect with friends who share my interest.

I'm a 56-year-old who now has to work very hard to break 18:00 min. However, I still love the structure of constructive training, and racing against anybody who happens to be running around my pace.

I would really struggle to find the motivation to put in that kind of work without the incentive of racing. I think with some of us, the desire for competition never goes away.

I've been jumping back and forth between this thread and the other one that Conundrum started on self-worth which I think goes hand-in-hand with this issue.

I like that a few of you shared your story about transitioning away from competitive running and admitted that it's a whole different ball-game when you're past your prime. By the way, this doesn't have to be confined to masters. If a guy at 30 who has been training since college reaches a wall and due to physical limitations, why should he keep hammering?

So far, the justifications you've given me relate to an abstract sense of pain-tolerance. You keep running and training hard because it feels good to dig deep. Are you talking about the physiological sensation of your lungs burning and your legs turning to mush? Or are you talking about the psycholgical effects of knowing that despite age and other impediments you will not surrender to a peaceful jog?

When you're still "competing" in the real sense (as in to win the race or set a PR), this can be justified as part of sport. I think we're disagreeing on that fine line between running as sport and running as exercise. All these weekend warrior tennis players or bowlers are not engaged in sport, they're exercising...they're socializing.

Sport is about achieving top performance. And our "sport" make sit very easy to quantify performance because the clock never lies.

You're right. I quit.

why o why? wrote:

I've been thinking more and more about this. What's the point? I understand that motivation is personal, but that's why I want to hear from others about why they continue to do structured training when the end result is top 10 locally (17:00 5K) or top 150 nationally (2:50 at Chicago 2012), let's say.

What is your reason for not just adopting a fitness lifetyle where running "for time or place" is not a goal. And would you still enter races or go out with a watch on a daily basis if that were the case?

You are looking for some deep meaning for something that is easy to answer. If you enjoy what you are doing, it makes you feel better about yourself and is not harming others, that is all you need to justify something. The only other people that you may need to justify something to is wife and kids. If they care for you they would want you to do thing that you enjoy and would be better if you inclued them in that activity.

No way you have had your mind changed on here. No way!

who o why wrote:

When you're still "competing" in the real sense (as in to win the race or set a PR), this can be justified as part of sport.

All you need to compete is a competitor. Sometimes that's the clock, sometimes that's the guy you see at races every week, sometimes it's a training partner, sometimes it's a random person who happens to be right with you in a race.

Most of the "weekend warrior" tennis players, golfers and bowlers I know do not confine their participation to weekends and they are both competing and socializing and a lot of them are competing really seriously.

Running as exercise would pay little attention to things like time and race placing. If you're doing either or both then you're competing even if that competing has been reduced to trying to race a single mile at what was once your marathon pace.

Youshuldquit wrote:

why o why wrote:

For me, running fast is an art in itself. There's nothing magical about a 7:00 mile. But when I'm floating down the road at a 5 minute clip and it feels effortless, that is very much enjoyable.

You do realize that on a global scale your 5 minute mile is about as special as the 7 minute mile don't you? You ain't grabbing no Olympic medals with either.

I don't know the term for people like this, but they can be very annoying. Just because someone isn't Olympic calibre does not mean they should give up the sport entirely.

FYI, low 5's are good enough to place well in the majority of local road races, especially if the distance increases

No. Sport is not about "acheiving top performance." It is about exercise, about getting your heart rate up a bit.

Look at it this way... 82 year old Ed Whitlock set a half-marathon record for his age group. everyone on this website and runner's world would be happy for him. But others in the world would be like... wtf? who cares, it's all about survival, not a fukkin record for the 80 year olds who run half-marathons?!!?! It's like, hey man, I'm just trying to get by here, just trying to live another day, so who cares if some old white guy likes to run a lot? In fact, he might even have his head up his ass?!! I mean, like, wtf, how many 82 year olds like to run a lot?!! So to each their own...