Officials cost Wilson at least one spot in the 800

Okay...I'll watch again...give me the exact second the worst elbow occurs in the link at top of thread.

800 Coach wrote:

Wake up! That is as blatant an elbow as you'll ever see in track and Field. Heck, that would be elbowing in a hockey game.

An obviously intentional elbow to an opponent's midsection? In the NHL, that might be a match penalty for Attempt To Injure. Of course, if we're handing out NHL penalties, Montano gets 2 minutes for diving.

WOW! I was looking for the elbow and was expecting some minor contact. The overhead view shows that Russian really winding up for that!

I don't care if it was an "accident". That kind of contact and motion should not be tolerated in IAAF races.

2:36 and 2:42

Okay...just watched it again. This time I only focused on Wilson. (The first time I was watching the Russian.) When I watched just looking at Wilson it did look way worse.

The Russian definitely moves aggressively into Wilson and into Wilson's lane. It's more than the "bump" I called it earlier. (I'll defer to the coaches, officials, and track vets as to whether that alone would merit a DQ).

I can't tell if the last elbow swing from the Russian causes Wilson to veer further wide or if that movement was from the previous contact. I know you are very sure on this point, but I cannot tell from the video on my screen.

coach d wrote:

800 Coach wrote:

Wake up! That is as blatant an elbow as you'll ever see in track and Field. Heck, that would be elbowing in a hockey game.

An obviously intentional elbow to an opponent's midsection? In the NHL, that might be a match penalty for Attempt To Injure. Of course, if we're handing out NHL penalties, Montano gets 2 minutes for diving.

10/10

In posting this video I never could have imagined so many different opinions. In reviewing it again, I think both Montano and the Russian should have been disqualified for veering from their lane to intentionally impede the progress of others. That would have given Wilson no worse than 4th place, which she might have gotten anyway if not pushed off balance at a key moment. I'm an Ajee Wilson fan after watching this again. Great race by the teenager.

Martinez' momentum was already taking her clear into third. Poistogova made a burst at the end that, even with the blockade and collision impeding her momentum, put her ahead of Wilson. The only one who benefitted was Montano. Here are the lacings without Montano's antics. Fortunately it didn't affect the top three.

Sum

Savinova

Martinez

Poistogova

Wilson

Montano

Lupu

Masna

I agree that Wilson wasn't on a trajectory to pass Martinez, so the roller-derby antics at the end didn't appear to impact the medal positions.

If the officials won't enforce the rules then what is the incentive for people to follow them? I think they should come down hard on lane drift at the end of races. You see it happening more and more in major events. It's pretty obvious that the only purpose for someone with a clear path to not run a straight line to the finish (shortest distance) is to block other runners from passing them.

Are you really dumb enough to think any one is complaining about her rigging up?It is ok to slow down. It isn't ok to cut across 2 lanes to imped the other runners. Was is intentional? Probably not. If it was tactic she should have come off the earlier (when she had posiiton to do so) and tried to sucker the other runners into passing on the inside and then shutting them off or at least make them break stride.. She didn't go wide until 2 of them had passed her. Does that matter? Not really. Being tired isn't an excuse for interfering with other runners.It should be pointed out though that Poistogova has only herself to blame for her situation. She had a pretty much open lane in front(Wilson couldn't pass her without going wider) of her but she cut back inside and then when faced with the choice of going inside or back out, picked out. If she picked inside she could have squeeze through where Martize did. But to do that she would have had to guess that Montano would keep cutting across the track instead of running straight. She picked wrong and was forced to make room for herself and that effort cost her a good shot at the bronze.

Clear view wrote:

In posting this video I never could have imagined so many different opinions. In reviewing it again, I think both Montano and the Russian should have been disqualified for veering from their lane to intentionally impede the progress of others. That would have given Wilson no worse than 4th place, which she might have gotten anyway if not pushed off balance at a key moment. I'm an Ajee Wilson fan after watching this again. Great race by the teenager.

Running out of your lane is done all the time up the homestretch. Take a look at the 3000m St and the women's 1500m. That is accepted and it is why it is becoming a good tactic to stay on the rail in the homestretch if you are in 2nd to 5th coming around the corner. The elbow that the Russian gave Wilson is another story. That is almost never tolerated.

i was shocked that this wasn't a major topic of conversation as soon as the race happened.... i convinced myself i must have just been imagining how bad the elbow was.

You are right about the increasingly common tactic of people moving on the inside in the anticipation that the leader will drift wide. An obvious example of that was Brenda Martinez in this race. Had Montano remained in the first lane she most likely would have gotten the bronze by traveling a shorter distance to the finish line and keeping Martinez behind her.

ritzy635 wrote:

i was shocked that this wasn't a major topic of conversation as soon as the race happened.... i convinced myself i must have just been imagining how bad the elbow was.

That elbow is so deliberated and flagrant. I can't understand the apologists on this thread and some others, who make dumb comments like, oh, this is de rigueur for Track & Field and Cross Country. I am a tad sensitive to this stuff, I should say--it is controversial, but not conclusively settled, in my mind, when I view occasions in international elite 5ks where East Africans and sometimes Caucasian athletes are jostling each other, sometimes so bad that some fall off the track (e.g. Solinsky, hehe--some think this was a "joke" for his size, but I'm not discussing that here). Cheap stuff, foul play, does go on some of the time, even beyond modest elbows, unintended collisions, modest jostling and spiking.

But that Russian's behavior is unacceptable. It's as clear as daylight. Her conduct was totally unnecessary for her normal racing routine. A fairly competing and endowed athlete would simply have just continued down the line and tried to do what is basic to the sport--RUN FASTER AND RACE. She went out of her way to CLEARLY launch an ELBOW at Ajee Wilson.

If it had been me, admittedly, I would have been too surprised or shocked to react in time. Only the clarity of the race footage provoked an appropriate reaction (in the sense of eye-for-an-eye, not in the sense of productive conduct for a paid professional athlete)--when I saw that, I thought, dang, that Russian deserves to be knocked out. Of course, wouldn't be a wise idea (for an American, to boot) to do that in Moscow.

That threshold of conduct has NO place in the sport of Track & Field and distance running. That sort of conduct has nothing to do with the goals and spirit of the racing endeavour.

All these macho comparisons to unrelated sports are irrelevant. Take your machismo elsewhere, to Sport Fighting or other violent endeavours.

i was shocked that this wasn't a major topic of conversation as soon as the race happened.... i convinced myself i must have just been imagining how bad the elbow was.

--

Perhaps the finish line judges didn't have as clear a view of the Russian's elbowing as we see on the overhead video shot, especially with Montano staggering sideways at the end of the race. The British broadcast didn't show it as clearly as the video posted here. U.S. officials might not have been aware of it either, especially if Wilson (just a teenager) didn't complain.

I share your pacifistic feelings about track, almost, but watch the conflict a few more times - it's not clear that the elbows landed with any force at all.

I Hate Instant Replay wrote:

Okay...just watched it again. This time I only focused on Wilson. (The first time I was watching the Russian.) When I watched just looking at Wilson it did look way worse.

The Russian definitely moves aggressively into Wilson and into Wilson's lane. It's more than the "bump" I called it earlier. (I'll defer to the coaches, officials, and track vets as to whether that alone would merit a DQ).

I can't tell if the last elbow swing from the Russian causes Wilson to veer further wide or if that movement was from the previous contact. I know you are very sure on this point, but I cannot tell from the video on my screen.

The video from the side is not as revealing as from the frontal video, directly beyond the finish line. Poistogova moved into Wilson's space, not necessarily to impede Wilson, but it had that effect. A DQ does not require INTENT to impede.

Watching the video at the 3:00 mark (a front view), the Russian's elbows look intentional, but not as aggressive, flagrant or damaging as some are saying.