Would you run for a foreign country in the Olympics if you had the B standard?

GenericID wrote:

Keep deflecting - it makes you look like a bad loser, which is enjoyable.

Obviously you haven't the self-respect to admit when you are wrong.

The "bet" that you were supposed to prove was that your friend has TS clearance and uses a foreign passport she got as an adult.

However, from reading your post you clearly don't have friends, so I think you lost. Sorry

Concerned Citizen wrote:

Representing another country just says that you don't care at all about your country (either one), only yourself.

I disagree, I think there's a line between patriotism or contentment (liking your country) and exceptionalism (thinking only one country is worth supporting and denouncing all others).

The "bet" that you were supposed to prove was that your friend has TS clearance and uses a foreign passport she got as an adult.

No it wasn't. Quite clearly the bet was about the process, otherwise why would you write this: "I've been through the process and I know how it works."?

You were proven wrong on the process, so clearly you DON'T "know how it works".

However, from reading your post you clearly don't have friends, so I think you lost. Sorry

That would be very hurtful - if I were still in preschool!

It may help you to say these things in your head before posting - then perhaps you'll realize how stupid you are making yourself look.

I never said that the person I know was a friend - that's another thing you made up, just like your knowledge of the security clearance process.

Obviously, if you are wriggling this hard to get out of paying $50, making the coffee at Amazon doesn't pay very well? I'll let you pay $5 a week if that helps?

This should be a lesson for you: perhaps spending a little less time posting claims you can't back up on here and a little more time improving your skills with the cappuccino machine might improve your career chances?

I would in a heart beat. Especially if I have some kind of family connection to the country. For example if my parents or grandparents were Irish and Ireland invited me. I would go for it without even thinking about it. My DNA and blood come from there, even if I have never lived there or even speak the language. Everyone should recognize where your roots and ancestors come from and be proud of that.

Someone very wise once told me "your life didn't just start when you were born. You have thousands of years in your veins. You carry the DNA of ancestors that lived in the Earth hudreds of years ago" I have never forgotten that and feel very proud of my roots and my background is important to me. It would be easy to represent the land of my roots and my ancestors.

Alot of countries have tougher standards- Germany and the Netherlands have even stricter standards than Canada. In Europe most federations are cutting their budgets and don't even send teams/individuals to World XC or HM anymore.Also, some countries will not grant dual-citizenship like Germany (only by birth/heritage or EU nationals) or Japan. However Italy lets grandkids from Italian nationals have italian citizenship.

xenonscreams wrote:

dual citizener wrote:

The two countries that I have dual citizenship for both impose standards that are harder than the IAAF A standards.

FML, Canada and UK.

Yeah one of my friends here is from Canada, and she said they've been making it harder and harder to get on the Olympic team. I don't really understand. Isn't that kind of self-sabotage?

GenericID wrote:

blah blah blah I'm trying to cheat you out of $50 in a bet I clearly didn't win

Why are you addressing trello like he or she is me?

I don't think it's right to discuss salary but I make enough to save roughly 2/3 of my income, drive a 2009 BMW 128i (so not a super expensive car since it's used but kind of mid-range), and have a DDR machine in my living room.

For everyone else who has to subject themselves to this, I truly apologize. I really like some of the discussion this thread has generated. To be honest, I am kind of excited at the idea of my childhood dream still being a real possibility, even if it is not for my country.

hausfrau wrote:

Alot of countries have tougher standards- Germany and the Netherlands have even stricter standards than Canada. In Europe most federations are cutting their budgets and don't even send teams/individuals to World XC or HM anymore.

Don't US Olympic athletes have to fund themselves? I don't see how imposing strict standards is beneficial for a country unless they're paying for athletes to go. In any case, I feel like having athletes represent you on a world stage is a good thing, so if you have people who are good enough to go then you ought to send them. But I guess I would say that as an athlete.

xenonscreams wrote:

To be honest, I am kind of excited at the idea of my childhood dream still being a real possibility, even if it is not for my country.

Go for it!

Why are you addressing trello like he or she is me?

Because he or she clearly is you.

For everyone else who has to subject themselves to this, I truly apologize.

No apology for welshing on your bet then? You were clearly wrong, and it wasn't even me who supplied the evidence.

To be honest, I am kind of excited at the idea of my childhood dream still being a real possibility, even if it is not for my country.

I can't think of anybody who deserves it less - the Olympics is about honor and honesty qualities that you clearly lack.

Just go down to Guam and compete for them. Don't think you would even have to worry about changing passports since its a US territory. They have had US citizens run for them before with them having no problem coming back up to the states.

xenonscreams wrote:

Don't US Olympic athletes have to fund themselves? I don't see how imposing strict standards is beneficial for a country unless they're paying for athletes to go. In any case, I feel like having athletes represent you on a world stage is a good thing, so if you have people who are good enough to go then you ought to send them. But I guess I would say that as an athlete.

I've always thought the same thing and have never gotten a good answer (why does e.g. South Africa make athletes hit the A standard 3 times to send them). Some Canadian female marathoners made a public stink about how Canada wouldn't send any of them to the Olympics even though they were willing to pay their own way. Has NOTHING to do with money.

Some say it raises the standard for their athletes and makes them better - but the numbers don't support that. Canada won one medal, a 3-way-tie for bronze. Britain sent the maximum number of athletes possible and did quite well for them. A guy like Duane Solomon would not have been sent in many countries. Definitely not the answer either.

After thinking about it, my best guess is that developed countries like Canada, Australia, etc, want it to be just as hard for their athletes to make the team as it is for American athletes, perhaps so that their athletes look just as good or to deter Americans from immigrating to those countries and taking Olympic spots from their own athletes. Still.

crazy raisin wrote:A guy like Duane Solomon would not have been sent in many countries. Definitely not the answer either.

Which event did he win? Medal in?

the 3 per country rule in "athletics" is a much bigger problem than federations not sending a full team. Why should athletes not get to compete just because they are a hurdler from the US or a Kenyan Marathoner?

crazy raisin wrote:

After thinking about it, my best guess is that developed countries like Canada, Australia, etc, want it to be just as hard for their athletes to make the team as it is for American athletes, perhaps so that their athletes look just as good or to deter Americans from immigrating to those countries and taking Olympic spots from their own athletes. Still.

your way off. you are thinking that athletics development authorities have absolute discretion over their budgets. they do not

in Canada, athletics is compared to other sports, and money is allocated. there was a long thread about it, and i missed a lot of the nuances, but basically there are a lot of sports getting funding, and they compete with each other. they money they send is benchmarked - how many top 10 finishes. this in a country where women's hockey is always in the Olympic final.

all sports are created equal, no matter what a runner might think. public funding is for the public benefit, not the athletes. If they allow athletes to pay their own way, then we go back 100 yrs to the time when amateurs, because they worked a job, were banned. you had to be wealthy to compete. so letting athletes pay their own way is basically allowing athletes to bride their way onto the team. I dont know much, but I know that this does not fly in Canada.

Bunny Foo Foo wrote:

Nope. I am an American.

No you're not.

Few years ago, Dana Veldakova from Slovakia (or her twin sister, also a triple jumper) hit the B standard in triple jump. The Slovakian federation refused to put her on the team (not sure if it was Olympics or WC) but she offered she would pay it on her own. They agreed and promised to repay it if she made it into the finals. I think she did.

The problem with your thinking is you assume that they are fine with the athletes competing but won't fund them - in reality they simply won't allow them to go whether they have the funding or not.

Sheila Reid had to beg Athletics Canada, appealing twice, to let her go until finally they made an exception for her under some "young developing blah blah blah" program. It's not about money.

I guarantee you >99% of athletes who qualify (by IAAF's standards, not Canada's) would be perfectly willing to pay their own way to the games. A couple "B-caliber" athletes expressed just that. Even if the athletes were broke I would be happy to donate to their cause, as would other people and sponsors.

Look, Canada pays to send a full squad to World Cross Country every year which is way tinier than the Olympics and way easier to qualify for. You cannot tell me the country won't send athletes to the Olympics due to lack of funds.

show off in prelims wrote:

crazy raisin wrote:A guy like Duane Solomon would not have been sent in many countries. Definitely not the answer either.

Which event did he win? Medal in?

He did better than the 800 runner that Canada DID send......

the 3 per country rule in "athletics" is a much bigger problem than federations not sending a full team. Why should athletes not get to compete just because they are a hurdler from the US or a Kenyan Marathoner?

That's the IOC's decision, but it goes back to the Ancient Games tradition of three athletes per country.

The practical benefit of it is that they'd rather have a wide mix of countries participating in an event. Imagine if Kenya and Ethiopia could enter as many 10k runners as they want, an event where you need to limit the field to about 30 people. They would have to lower the standard to the point that it's almost exclusively East Africans in the event, or else the field would get too big.

What if you were Belgian? Does the concept of patriotism apply in Belgium? Belgians are the Dutch or French who happened to be left in the middle when a war ended. Nobody remembers which war. All I'm saying is, everyone has their own idea of what patriotism means and to some it means more than to others and that's OK.

I feel calmer now. The drugs are kicking in. Anyone got any munchies?

you still think in terms of athletics. the fact is that athletics Canada is part of the national body, and all sports are evaulated together.

if you allow some athletes to pay their own way, it is not a meritocracy. that might be the way it is done in the US, but in Canada we do not like the idea that you can buy your way onto the Olympic team, while say a poor boxer from NL could not afford to pay his own way.

XC is easy - 20 some people. an olympic team is much larger.

its not about money at the individual sport level. it is about losing your budget for the next year. if you send a bunch of scrubs, your budget will get cut. so standards are set to send those who have the best chance of being considered a "success", compared to other sports like XC skiing, speed skating, hockey etc.

like it or not, Canada makes its decisions on a national basis, not sport by sport.