3:54 Webb? Really?

newname wrote:

He also had taken about a year off from training in 1971 and was 35 pounds overweight at 195.

Ryun ran the Dream Mile against Liquori in 1971. Doubtful Ryun was 195 pounds in 1971-72. Most of Ryun's performance problems seem to have been linked to his allergies.

This is true, but as you get older getting that talent to come out is more difficult than when you were younger. That it why it is frustrating for Webb Fans for him to drop a training regime under Salazar that was working. He got down to 3:35/3:36, 7:51 for the 3000 indoors, and beat rupp in a 5k in San Jose. That shows a lot of fitness. It was when he ran a 4:00 indoors in early 2011 after coming back from Aus or NZ running 3:37 that he dropped alberto. He was running consistent again...and subsequently has run horrifically relative to his talent level. If he would have stuck with Alberto he most likely would be running well right now and we would be talking about his Olympics chances. As it is, he seems like a long shot to even make the trials.

Overtraining doesn't cause a person to run 24 seconds over their PR. Either he has a broken leg, AIDS or cancer.

holbythebear wrote:

Anyone else think he might be overtraining? No way he has the strength to beat Rupp in a 5k not too long ago, then run a 3:54 1500 without something seriously wrong. I hear people say it was a workout. Is he training in Gainsville? If not, this was not a pure workout and this should be worrying. I hope his coach knows that it takes a really long time to recover from overtraining.

[quote]Not a troll wrote:

Overtraining doesn't cause a person to run 24 seconds over their PR. Either he has a broken leg, AIDS or cancer.

[quote]

It could be that ebola virus.

No way this was set up as a workout. In a sense he didn't care about the times because he was doubling 40 minutes apart. But if he wanted to run 3:54 as a tempo he could have gone to any high school track. To enter a race and run this poorly was a terrible idea.

In fairness to Webb re: Ryun, he also looks if not 35 pounds overweight, significantly stocky.

Which begs the question already asked in all these threads of what exactly the plan is here. Why is he doing all these races, getting slower in each one, where he is clearly out of shape, can't accelerate at all and is getting blown by like he's standing still on every final lap. What does this possibly accomplish, especially for an athlete with known confidence problems. He at least formerly had the advantage in races of the intimidation factor which always gives the psychologial advantage if your competitors are worried about what you can do - but I don't think anyone is worried about Webb now.

Why doesn't he see a nutritionist, drop 15 or so pounds, and then try racing?

I am actually starting to think things might be on the right track for him. We know Vig can coach, and we know Webb has tons of talent. Watching those races - he clearly was not pushing all out as he finished both races and kept jogging and never bent over like the rest of the runners. I can't say what the plan and purpose is here, but there seems to be one and he seems to be on page with it - which is a good sign after the way he departed from Salazar.

It should be very obvious by now that Web was doping in 2007. I just wonder if he is wearing a wig or the drugs that he took to grow some hair is affecting his performance.

He is injured, plan and simple.

I think I've figured this whole thing out. Remember when Joaquin Phoenix grew the long beard and announced that he was quitting acting and launching a career as a rapper? Then, he went on Letterman and acted completely stoned and spaced out? The whole thing turned out to be an elaborate hoax, as far as I know, even though he carried on with the charade for months.

Webb seems to be orchestrating the same sort of scheme, running 1:54 800s and 3:54 1500s, and it is working like a charm! Well played, Webb! I look forward to seeing what else you've got up your sleeve and how this lark is going to end!

Come on everyone, talent does NOT go away. Webb is going to rock at the trials, all he has to do is want to do it and he will.

insightlessness wrote:

I am actually starting to think things might be on the right track for him. We know Vig can coach, and we know Webb has tons of talent. Watching those races - he clearly was not pushing all out as he finished both races and kept jogging and never bent over like the rest of the runners. I can't say what the plan and purpose is here, but there seems to be one and he seems to be on page with it - which is a good sign after the way he departed from Salazar.

I really wish I could agree with that, but the thing is in the 800m he went out in 26, took the lead and came through in 54. There's no way he wasn't trying to run a fast time there. And in the 1500m, he was hovering around 60-61 second pace until the last 400-500m when he died a horrible death. Coming off the final turn in the 1500m, he was in last place. Sadly, it looked like he ran just hard enough in the final 100m to make it so he wasn't last, but then he practically walked across the line. Sure, maybe he could have run 3:52 if he hadn't eased up, but I think it was clear that the day didn't go well for him at all. He ended both races "easy" because he had given up, not because they were workout races.

I don't know much about miling or Webb, but what I DO know is that it is an Olympic year.

One's "crap" times should be somewhat weak only in relation to their max potential, not in an absolute sense.

Trials and London are sooner than you think.

Webb is a complete non-factor this year in the 1500, there is no use paying any attention to him at all, except as a curiosity.

What's the letsrun consensus? Was he massively doped in HS?

He was massively talented in HS and he still is. You can whip yourself into shape in 6-8 weeks. Webb will be fine.

"You can whip yourself into shape in 6-8 weeks."

Not into Olympic shape, and not in the 1500, and not when you are that far behind, you can't.

Sprintgeezer wrote:

"You can whip yourself into shape in 6-8 weeks."

Not into Olympic shape, and not in the 1500, and not when you are that far behind, you can't.

So what's his goal then if he isn't training for the Olympics? Is he just racing for fun now?

Sprintgeezer wrote:

What's the letsrun consensus? Was he massively doped in HS?

This is an interesting question. For years I never entertained the idea that he could have been doping because I believed that if he doped, then he would have had to have doped in high school, which seemed far fetched.

Now with the last couple of years it is just so bizarre. Has the American running scene ever seen anything like this before? He goes from being arguably the most talented distance runner in America (this was even said by Salazar and Rupp) to someone who would struggle to win at a high school meet.

The old Webb could have showed up any day of the week, any day of the year and run a 4:01 mile with ease.

Is Webb now off the juice and was fooling us all along?

How does everybody know that he was "talented", and not just "fast"? A fast person can be doped, but not necessarily "talented".

Plus, there are, and have been for some time, lots of doped HS athletes. LOTS.

And to the other poster who asked what he is training for, I don't know. Maybe you can tell us.

Because if it's for the Olympics, he is a total failure.

If that's the case, then I'M training for the Olympics, too.

Milers don't dope anyway. There is little benefit to doping for endurance. It is all talent.