Rupp's 2 mile record should be under dispute...Illegal coaching

What a monumentally stupid thing to say. First of all, the results "they" get are nothing short of fantastic.

Secondofly, what "amenities" should they forfeit? Alter-G treadmills? PTs? Shoes? Modern physiological knowledge? Please tell us what "amenities" you would deem acceptable for an athlete to have access to in order for a record to be worthy of admiration. Do you really think that Bekele was setting records with nothing but his bare feet, determination, and grit, and not an army of coaches, doctors, physios, custom adidas shoes, video analysis, personal workout rabbits, and customized strength routines?

Yikes. Look at the screen while you type. Also, I fail to see how "hype" takes anything away from the prestige of setting an American record.

No, you don't. If you did, you wouldn't be bitching about Galen Rupp's records. What you really seem to want is to jerk off to some "blue collar" fantasy that involves an imagined unknown coming out of nowhere and setting records in order to validate your relatively meaningless pursuit of a personal goal (achieved through hard work alone, and absolutely nothing else at all) that no one cares about but you.

I can't stand this wrote:

Wow, its like some of you guys WANT American running to suck. We complain about African Imports, and now that we have a bona fide, born and bred, white guy running world class times, we're trying to write them off because his coach was on the infield of a small indoor meet and 20 seconds ahead of the next competitor?

Hang on a minute there, I thought race didn't have anything to do with this. Isn't all about being American? Are you saying that Rupp's accomplishments wouldn't mean as much he weren't white?

Have we come to an impasse?

There are the older, more experienced coaches,

competitors and race officials who know the rules

and say they matter and apply to everyone and

then there are Salazar's (Nike) minions who say

"no big deal", "nothing to see here", "rules don't

matter" knowing nothing of the rules that say

coaches are not allowed on the infield and the

people that are there are credentialed officials

doing their jobs.

So, what we have here is a battle between the clueless

and those trying to clue them in on the sport that

we respect and are loyal to.

Yep. End of discussion right there.

Anyone who thinks Rupp's time should have been DQed probably cares more about the record than Rupp does. Rupp didn't race for the record. He did it for Geoff Hollister. All he cared about was giving it 110% as Hollister would have wanted. That's what we should really be talking about here. Congratulating Rupp for a good effort and remember Hollister for everything he did for Track.

This is the equivalent of an umpire calling a runner out at second when the infield is turning a double play. The fielder never steps on the bag, just in the viscinity so the runner is called out. Al Sal may have been in the competition area but since he was in the viscinity of his legal area he gets no infraction.

I dont understand too how you could disqualify a runner for something he has no control over. He can't control his coach or what he does.

First of all, great run by Rupp. He is an animal right now and could do some damage this summer.

Secondly, there are reasons why we do not allow athletes' coaches to stand on the rail and give out splits like they were an official.

One official is allowed to give official splits and they had one giving them at each 200m mark.

It can be confusing to other athletes running as they may not know who the official split caller is and at what distances or increments the splits are given out as.

Although I don't think this was the case, the potential is there for one athlete's coach or supporter to give out extraneous information to other runners.

Alberto should not have been doing this, as he was in a position on the infield where he looked like an official split caller. The officials at the meet should have approached him and either had him on the outside of the track or further inside the rail so he did not look like an official.

Absolutely correct. Alberto should know better, but let's not blame Rupp.

In earlier years, I had warnings from officials when yelling splits from outside the track. Standing there looking like an official when you are actually a coach is ridiculous. That would be like Belichuk standing behind the line of scrimmage calling out audibles during a play.

coneill wrote:

Yep. End of discussion right there.

Anyone who thinks Rupp's time should have been DQed probably cares more about the record than Rupp does. Rupp didn't race for the record. He did it for Geoff Hollister. All he cared about was giving it 110% as Hollister would have wanted. That's what we should really be talking about here. Congratulating Rupp for a good effort and remember Hollister for everything he did for Track.

You've made me cry!

Frantically Obsessed wrote:

In earlier years, I had warnings from officials when yelling splits from outside the track. Standing there looking like an official when you are actually a coach is ridiculous. That would be like Belichuk standing behind the line of scrimmage calling out audibles during a play.

He essentially does that now, through an ear piece. Which brings up the question why can't runners wear ear pieces? This would solve the problem instantly!

BOOM I AM SMART!

stuck with match.com wrote:

BOOM I AM SMART!

"Doing the right thing is not the problem.

Knowing what the right thing is, that's the challenge."

-Lyndon Johnson

You may be smart about some things, but not T&F rules.

Your earlier comment about Salazar (in your mind)

being allowed to be on the infield of the track.

I believe you spelled vicinity wrong. That's not

the only thing you were wrong about. Salazar and

any other coach are not allowed there.

Then I would suggest checking the USATF rule book,

Rule 144 Assistance to Athletes, where it forbids

what Salazar did and what you suggested that

they use audio devices like an "ear piece".

That is also an NCAA violation in their rule book too.

Someone who has a copy of the IAAF rule book can tell

you what paragraph or subsection that is.

Rule 144, 2. "conveying of advice, information or direct help to an athlete"

Referee Guy wrote:

Rupp's coach, Salazar, was on the infield giving splits. This is highly illegal. He was "in the competition area" (see below)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T66mVIA0V7A

Any athlete giving or receiving assistance from within the

competition area during an event shall be warned by the Referee and advised that, if there is any repetition, he will be disqualified from that event.

The following shall not be considered assistance:

(d) Communication between the athletes and their coaches not

placed in the competition area.

How would you go about a DQ at this point?

1: was Alberto warned by a referee?

2: was Rupp warned?

3: was there any advising of the penalty if it continued? 4: is there a limitation on the final moment that a grievance can be filed?

5: if no warning was given, can anyone file a grievance after the fact and, without the original warning, enforce a DQ?

I suspect that even though you are quoting the rules correctly, if the referees did not do their job properly, that is not Rupp's concern and he should not be disqualified.

SO...I disagree that Rupp's record should be under dispute. If anything should be under review it is the referees. Rupp did his part right. Alberto, although he did his part improperly, was likely never warned. Therefore it is not a failure on Rupp or Alberto it is a failure on the Referee and the record should stand. Don't impugn Rupp.

I THOUGHT this was a rule violation when I saw it!

But in the spirit of not visiting the sanction upon Rupp, I say that it should be AlSal himself who should be sanctioned.

What that sanction is, I don't know--I don't know if there are any guidelines for this sort of thing, but I can think of all sorts of sanctions that could effectively be applied to a coach.

In that event, it could be decided that the performance--and hence the record--would stand.

coneill wrote:

All he cared about was giving it 110%

I don't care who you are, you CAN NOT give more than 100%. Can't give more than you have to give.

As I heard a person say, If someone says they are giving 110% it really means they're only giving 80-90%. True!!

Fat Joe wrote:

Who f***ing cares? You, sir, have a small mind and are a whiny ass female dog.

If you are really Fat Joe than you would have rhymed your response. For all the other trolls out there that say you see it all the time and lots of coaches do it (no beeg ting) you are wrong or a liar. Come out to Albuquerque on the 25th and show me all the other coaches that are out there crossing the track and lingering on the infield where they know they are not supposed to be. Not up for NM? How about Nampa, Idaho March 9th? I am sure all you track experts will be in attendance to show us all those coaches who are like Salazar and either don't know or totally disregard the rules of the sport.

Sprintgeezer wrote:

I THOUGHT this was a rule violation when I saw it!

But in the spirit of not visiting the sanction upon Rupp, I say that it should be AlSal himself who should be sanctioned.

What that sanction is, I don't know--I don't know if there are any guidelines for this sort of thing, but I can think of all sorts of sanctions that could effectively be applied to a coach.

In that event, it could be decided that the performance--and hence the record--would stand.

Agreed. They should not allow this to happen. Certainly nothing against Rupp. He had a great race.

I'm not sure they even had an official guy giving splits. Salazar would yell splits at Rupp and then ignore the rest, so he certainly could not have been the official splits guy.

I just watched the race and that was the first thing I noticed? Do all coaches have full access to the track and can all coaches stand on the rail giving splits like an official?

Or just Alberto.

lane 8 wrote:

[quote]coneill wrote:

As I heard a person say, If someone says they are giving 110% it really means they're only giving 80-90%. True!!

So Rupp was just tempo-ing that 2 mile time? I guess he could just try harder next time, and then he definitely won't need splits.