The Future of Footlocker XC

Tell that to Lucas V.

I'm glad you are not on my team you selfish little brat.

Nothing against Lucas V - he's a fine runner. But you probably couldn't have chosen a poorer example of a high school athlete to support your contention that it's all about the team. Are you kidding me? How many meets did LV run with his high school team this year?

Looking at the entrants to FL MW, I see most of the leading guys signed up there anyway. LV, Wills, Futsum, Brajdic.

As for the guy saying 'I'll never send one of my runners to FL again', wow, what an ego. Since when do you, high school coach, decide what post season meet a kid goes to. My kid was a 2 time FL finalist and he called his own shots.

Lucas V. already has his Footlocker title. I'm glad you weren't my coach, probably wouldn't develop the talent with future in the sport on your team, in favor of running only weak races that your team can do well in.[/quote]

That is stupud.

As far as I can tell from experience as a runner and now as a coach. XC is the most team oreiented sport there is, think about it, everyone practices the same position, in team sports everyone practices their position, in xc everyone does the same basic thing, it is a brotherhood. We all run together, suffer together, and win or lose together

You seek out challenges and try to conquer them. Lucas won the easy race last year, now he is moving up to a higher challenge.

Also great to see Jim Rosa lining up next to his team at NXN, a real class guy and a real competitor. Looking forward to watching the National Championship from Portland.

Lukas was going to run NXN last year until he needed to rest a sore achilles tendon.

athlete's foot wrote:

That is stupud.

As far as I can tell from experience as a runner and now as a coach. XC is the most team oreiented sport there is, think about it, everyone practices the same position, in team sports everyone practices their position, in xc everyone does the same basic thing, it is a brotherhood. We all run together, suffer together, and win or lose together

Well, I was D. 1 scholarship runner. I'm sure your experience as a scrub runner was team "oreiented" because you would never experience individual success, not too mention "stupud."

athlete's foot wrote:

You seek out challenges and try to conquer them. Lucas won the easy race last year, now he is moving up to a higher challenge.

No, the NXN champion won the easy race and was destroyed in the real race.

Choc Man wrote:

You heard it here. Watch for a major FL announcement after this years final. The clock is ticking.

Great point on reviewing who makes the larger committment to the sport while recognizing the team and individuals. How about an individual championship race between the NXN top 7 finishers and FL top 7 finishers for 2010. It would be no contest even with the girls with the strength of many great girls on NXN teams. Goodbye to the dreamers and the pretender.

As mentioned by others, Nike may very well put FL six feet under sooner than later, but it's the over the top Nike cheerleading and bashing of FL that leaves many people with an anti-Nike sentiment.

If you could take the blinders off and stop the cheerleading for a second, you'd see that the FL girls would absolutely dominate the NXN girls this year and it's not even close. If you don't believe me, take a look at the top #25 individual girls rankings on Dyestat and then see where each of those girls are going...I'll help you out, FL girls would win and it would be a blowout through the top 7.

Well, I was D. 1 scholarship runner. I'm sure your experience as a scrub runner was team "oreiented" because you would never experience individual success, not too mention "stupud."

I was an all-american, most of my friends to this day are my college teammates, we went through it all together and we are better for that.

Why are training groups being formed up in Oregaon? Because it is better tot train together with a group, being part of something bigger than yourself creates strenght, ask the FM coach what he thinks about TEAM?

How do you know what Runn intended with his words? He did not differentiate between girls and boys with his reckless statement. Ergo, Cuffe, Venables and the majority of the top 10 girls in the country are 2nd tier in his mind because they chose FL over Nike. It's no contest on the boys side with Nike providing the more competitive championship this year; I have no problems admitting that, but it seems like the Nike shills can't do the same with the girls side. Futsum made his choice, and that's entirely up to him and I have no idea what his rationale was, but won't he still see guys like Lutz and Lukas at FL Nationals (assuming they all qualify)?

How was a field of Gedyon, Moussa, both Rosa's, Wills along with Lutz an easy race at NXN in 2009? Also least you forget that Lutz was doubling back not Lukas. Get your facts correct and LV won the easy race at FL in 2009, but that will not be the case in 2010 with NXN.

Calling teammates "scrub runners" you must have been popular as a D1 Scholarship runner. All members of a team achieve individual success only at their own individual level and that contributes to the overall team success. Answer me this, when CC was introduced as a sport especially on the HS level was it for individuals only or as a team sport?

Are HS runners recruited to run for college CC teams or as individuals? Certainly to be part of a team. Just ask Chris Derrick that from the recent NCAA races. It's about winning with your teammates as all individuals are part of some form of team at least at the CC level.

FL continually gets bashed. Why because they have refused to improve their original concept and build upon their prior success. If they were sharp business people and knew the sport and trends, they would have added a team component long before Nike introduced NXN. He who hesitates finishes last and that is what is happening with FL. Just go ask event related people what happened with the Golden West meet and the same applies to FL. They thought that no one could come along and create a better event/concept and boy how we can see that was wrong. If FL went away there would be some initial remorse, but not for long as there currently exists a better choice and experience TODAY and that is the NXN National Championship.

Though they throw a lot of money at this event, one major part of "The Nike Experience" that is complete crapola is the Portland Meadows course itself. Corporate interests seem to trump the runner's racing experience in that regard...and that's not so trivial a fact to many.

Here is a great analogy of the future of Fl taken from one of the final scenes from the movie Tombstone with Val Kilmer, et al.

Doc Halladay (Val Kilmer) takes the place of Wyatt Earp in a shootout with bad guy Johnnie Ringo and as Doc approaches Johnnie he states" Well Johnnie Ringo you look like somebody just walked over yo grave". Pretty solid description of what is going on with the FL event. Doc won by being the smarter combatant as with NXN v FL.

Duck Walk wrote:

Here is a great analogy of the future of Fl taken from one of the final scenes from the movie Tombstone with Val Kilmer, et al.

Doc Halladay (Val Kilmer) takes the place of Wyatt Earp in a shootout with bad guy Johnnie Ringo and as Doc approaches Johnnie he states" Well Johnnie Ringo you look like somebody just walked over yo grave". Pretty solid description of what is going on with the FL event. Doc won by being the smarter combatant as with NXN v FL.

This is the worst analogy I've ever seen. First, the movie scene was completely fictional. Second, the first thing Doc says to Ringo is "I'm your huckleberry" which is one of the funniest lines I've ever heard in a movie given it's context and delivery. Third, Doc was a better fighter, that's why he won. It had nothing to do with intelligence. He was faster. Ringo was actually remarkably well educated. NXN will bring down Footlocker due to money and name recognition. That's why. The meet itself was flawed from the start and had anyone else been putting it on it would have suffered an immediate death. The selection procedure was terrible and many top 5 teams were left at home the first few years. They couldn't score a meet, leaving Hilton out of the results until their coach corrected them and they had to redo them after they were released. The only decent person involved with the meet was Josh and they sacked him in spite of the fact that he saved their asses by finally annoying them into submission with the regional issue. Footlocker has become a bunch of paranoid cultists giving speeches at nationals that come one step short of asking the kids to drink Kool Aid. The way meet alumni are allowed to breeze in and out with current athletes has led to fdangerous situations with alcohol and other issues. Fortunately, for the most part, the kids ignore this and are the ones that make these meets because the adults on both sides are despicable.

The saddest part in all of the Nike NXN vs. FL "battle" is that the REAL meet - US XC Nationals (team selection) is virtually ignored by too many people, especially HS-aged athletes and their coaches. That a potential selection to a National team (one that is pays the trip expenses if you make the team - unlike in my country) draws so few entries is both alarming and a testament of what is wrong with the US perspective. Given the number (and quality) of athletes participating in HS and College XC, there is no reason (even with age manipulation) why both the US Junior and Senior teams are not competitive with the Africans - it starts here! That this meet is so far off the radar of HS-age kids as a worthwile objective (whether they make the team or not)is also why the Senior age athletes care so little for it later as well. Change the perspective and athletes will rise to the occasion, keep it as it is - FL and NXN as the be-all and end-all- which are really just minor meets that go nowhere and tell little as to the real development of the athletes, and no wonder the Africans can't be beaten in XC.

US participation at the XC trials has always been pretty weak amongst high school kids. I agree that this hurts us but don't think it is FL or NXN's fault. I think high school coaches are myopic in this respect and if there were no FL or NXN, then state would be the end all. People need to look at someone like Hasay and see she is the prototype for success. Started young, ran 70+ mpw as a soph in high school, and raced Junior Trials in high track and cross.

Thank you. I've coached D1 scholarship runners (5) who said the team's success meant more than their individual success. In one case, that attitude got the girl the scholarship because the college coach liked her team oriented approach.

I wish FL jumped at the chance to have one race with Nike.

I am from Upstate NY-we are a Nike region- the FL race is watered down because the NY regional is the same day. Look at the teams that have GREAT individuals.

That is NY, a state deep in XC talent.

XC is an individual sport only if you don't have a good team.

I guess it is the region you are in which molds your attitude towards the race. Our local area has a few kids who may qualify for nationals. There is much discussion over who is going where.

[quote]Jubilee wrote:

it's the over the top Nike cheerleading and bashing of FL that leaves many people with an anti-Nike sentiment[/quote

Every bit of the anti high school runners making their own choices sentiment is coming from Nike.

That is sad, because if Nike really cared about high school runners then they would focus on what's best for the kids, which includes having good things to say about the Footlocker meets or at least saying nothing at all.

I get the impression that Footlocker doesn't really care what Nike is doing, as long as the kids are well served.

Besides their great history, Footlocker is continuing to provide a great environment for the kids, and is not disparaging anyone.

J.R. wrote:

[quote]Jubilee wrote:

it's the over the top Nike cheerleading and bashing of FL that leaves many people with an anti-Nike sentiment[/quote

Every bit of the anti high school runners making their own choices sentiment is coming from Nike.

That is sad, because if Nike really cared about high school runners then they would focus on what's best for the kids, which includes having good things to say about the Footlocker meets or at least saying nothing at all.

I get the impression that Footlocker doesn't really care what Nike is doing, as long as the kids are well served.

Besides their great history, Footlocker is continuing to provide a great environment for the kids, and is not disparaging anyone.

As opposed to the over-the-top, anti-Nike rants that get posted every time someone tries to talk about NXN?

I think it's wrong for a bunch of adults and coaches to get on here and presume to know the motivations of high school runners that they don't personally know anything about. I think it takes a damn talented runner to qualify for either meet. You guys have no real clue as to why a runner might choose one meet over the other. I think you should feel pretty ashamed to get on here and spout off about a runner choosing to run FL so as to avoid competition. That's pretty low of you. I know one runner who will choose FL because their family can drive to it and can't afford to fly to Portland. I can think of a lot of other reasons. Maybe they aren't into hurdling hay bales. Maybe they respect the tradition of FL. Maybe they ran FL last year, were treated well, and don't feel right about dumping the meet. The runners are who they are - running FL vs NXN doesn't change that. Some guys are lucky and live in a region where they don't have to choose and can run both. Others aren't so lucky. There ate probably a thousand Kenyans out there who won't run either and could win. Whatever. Try being a little more humble and just respecting their decisions. Do any of you haters coach Any qualifiers?

FLN & NXN are not sports. The sponsors pay for talent to fill their trade shows at FLN & NXN where they sell cheap Chinese gear marked up 200%. At a real sports champs the teams and athletes pay their own way. FLN & NXN are staged ads put on by the marketing guys.