She runs 1:59.90

Carnage on the track wrote:

Vagina's do not define female biology...ovaries do. From what I understand, CS does not have ovaries.

The testicles are what give men an advantage over women (not the penis). CS has testicles and therefore should not be allowed to compete against women.

I have no problem testing other females for gender verification. Ultrasounds are non invasive and pretty accurate.

You say you don't disagree with me so why are you even bringing it up? Do you like to argue just for the sake of arguing?

Wouldn't it be great if some lawyer would take up a class action law suit on behalf of all of the women that are affected by the decision to allow CS to compete against females?

POD

PlanetHarris wrote:

Cummins comments are disgraceful to say the least and she should be fine for her comments, for unsportsmanlike conduct. A very sore lose indeed.

The disgrace is that you hide the truth.

runnerd wrote:

Um, I am talking about her talent! If she runs at her potential which I believe is 1min53 second something.... Then its like running against a man because that's what some guys who are competing in college (in Canada anyway) are running. Fine those guys might not be winning but they train hard and compete hard and are way better than all females... Get it.

He knows he's a guy. That's why he thought you were saying he's a guy. Well he is a guy. There's no reason to say he's a she. I feel the women showed stand up and make a statement about this. Just refuse to race him. Don't compete in races he's in.

Or even one race where the women entered but didn't run or made some similar statement, would help people to see what is happening and that you're not accepting what is happening.

This is an issue that the LPGA tour has had to deal with forever. Many of the "women" look like "Unibrow" from Goldmember.

When those ladies get their left nut into it, they hit it a mile. Very unfair to the softer, less husky sounding women.

Wow! it just continues doesnt it? Get it right, she does not, nor has she ever had testicals. She has ovaries. What, just because she doesnt have breasts, an hour glass figure,and blonde hair that makes her a man. People please, just get a life! really. You judge from what you do not know. She was born a female, with ovaries, with a vagina. Her gift, her biological make up coupled with her intense ability to train harder and longer has made her perhaps what will go down as the greatest 800 meter champion in the history of track and field. All these steriotypes placed on what a woman looks like, runs like. Holy cow. Last time I checked, men were running 1:44- 1:47 for elite 800. So Alan Webb runs 1:52, slower than all the elete men, lets put him in the womens division. God! get a life. Someone, some woman has to be the fastest woman 800 in the world. Just because you dont like the way she looks, she runs, she dominates you dont approve? Maybe you would feel better if she got 36DD implants, grew her fingernails out 2 inches and colored them purple, got extensions in order to braid her hair. Bigots!,in the truest sense of the word.

I'm amazed at what most of you have written here. The results have not been made public and yet almost all of you know the 'truth'. You don't like how she looks and that's enough to convince yourselves? It's rather disgusting.

A Brit wrote:

I'm amazed at what most of you have written here. The results have not been made public and yet almost all of you know the 'truth'. You don't like how she looks and that's enough to convince yourselves? It's rather disgusting.

Put your money where your mouth is. Take he/she/it out on a date and tell us what's down there. Cause none of us think it's female.

inhouse wrote:

http://www.zimbio.com/Tetiana+Petlyuk

This photo doesn't really help your case. The only real difference I see are that CS doesn't have long blonde hair. Her hips are actually wider than TP and neither has breasts to speak of. Both have broader shoulders than me.

What makes a woman? What makes a man? It isn't black and white and there apparently isn't a point on the continuum that we can agree on.

It does make track more interesting, though![/quote]

Are you serious?

Which one would you jump into bed with?

Alf Shrubb wrote:

Are you serious?

Which one would you jump into bed with?

That's a slippery slope! there are a great number of female athletes across the spectrum of professional women's sports I don't find particular attractive. You sure you want to use that as a gauge?

Alf Shrubb wrote:

Are you serious?

Which one would you jump into bed with?

Neither.

I would at least like to see C S go straight to the front and lead every race.

C S doesn't need to have a rabbit or hang back and draft off of the others that are clearly inferior.

I give C S credit for doing the training and demonstrating fitness.

Racing men at the same level would give C S an opportunity to really test that fitness and limits.

(it is really hard to write without using the words he, she, him or her)

You’re fussy.

Who are you? - Brad Pitt?

Perhaps Savannah is more your scene.

http://www.google.co.uk/images?rlz=1T4SUNC_enGB381GB381&q=savannah+sanitoa&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=dK1yTIjpNMKU4gbx-q3eCA&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=6&ved=0CDkQsAQwBQ&biw=1263&bih=471

It's interesting that the German translator was a dude to account for Semenya's voice in the interview....

I'm afraid I'm married.

No, she has internal testes and no ovaries. You are mistaken.

kaitainen wrote:

that said, as we all discussed last year in depth, this is a challenging situation. i hope the IAAF imposed some sort of hormone testing. she doesn't look as ripped as she did last year, which may reflect hormone treatment or it may be a sign that she didn't work out quite as hard this year due to uncertainty regarding IAAF procedures.

you have it spot on regarding the hormone (testosterone) levels

I agree, she/he is not all female. I am also amazed at the way she/he picked up the pace in the last 50. Unbelievable!!

Looked like an easy jog until then. What could she/he do going all out from the gun? Something is not right about this, and we all know what it is. I have no knowledge of her physiology (beyond what I can see on the surface), but given the ease of her win and the raw power on display at the end, I would be pissed off if I was one of him/her competitors.

Carnage on the track wrote:

You say you don't disagree with me so why are you even bringing it up? Do you like to argue just for the sake of arguing?

i bring it up to try to force some intellectual or logical rigor. it's not enough for us to have a gut feeling that something is amiss. and it is important for there to be standards that are consistently applied.

we will see someone else, sooner or later, who brushes up against or crosses whatever line is chosen. if we can at least draw that line clearly, the decision of whether to allow her to compete will be objective.

i see semenya, based on media reports, as the easy case. and as i said above, the IAAF can't even handle her case. which does not bode well.

No, honestly...everyone on this thread is just speaking from conjecture, right? There has no been no proof about her organs, internal or external, or about her being man, woman, or mix, has there?

WTF is going on!??

Coach Dunbar - I think you are mistaken.

Most indications are that she has testes, and they are not descended.

I understand that this condition can have significant medical implications (aside from competitive running) so most reasonable people hope that she receives proper treatment on a timely basis.

And I think the assertion to bigotry is wrong. If she indeed has the enduring advantage that testosterone (at the level tow which has been alluded), then it makes for an unfair competitive advantage for the women.

My mother was a phys ed teacher and a great athlete in the 50's. The sports available to her were incredibly limited. She played golf because it was marginally socially acceptable to her - she of course was more talented at other sports but this was the choice for her - she faced real bigotry.

So now that we have made track and field for women a viable thing, and you suggest that it is bigotry to question an athlete who appears by all accounts to be capable of readily undermining the notion of gender distinction which is the bedrock upon which female competition rests? Ok, you may disagree, but that doesn't make anyone who has this viable point of view a bigot (although it makes you unpersuasive). Moreover, I am perplexed at kind of bigotry you refer to Do you mean gender bigotry? That is a circular assertion inasmuch as preserving the gender distinction is all about fair play for women. Ditto for transgender bigotry (many have empathy with her, even if they disagree she should be competing). Racial bigotry? I don't see it here - if anything it is the officials at the South African federation that have treated her poorly and insensitively - and the IAAF is stuck in the position of being overly politically correct and is hoping that the issue will go away - that doesn't look like it is happening.

Cheers, and look forward to a thoughtful response.