WHEATING 3:30.9

Gregsonmobile wrote:

But what about Webb. That guy was kinda talented and it took his years to run that fast and he only faster than Wheating by a hair now. And he's better than Wheating on all cylinders, except strategy. I am growing increasingly skeptical of Wheating now.

So true! Look, I like Wheating, but people are afraid to ask what if because he is American, plain and simple. If this was a Moroccan who dropped six seconds in one race people would be crying "cheat." Wheating is incredibly talented, but the capacity to run 3:30 when your previous was what 3:36? is certainly suspect. Webb is the ultimate talent, set aside his bs and problems and it still took him years to drop that far.

And to the idiot who claimed that 3:31 isn't where people dope? What the hell does that mean? Remember that Irish fellow who was a 30+ 10k runner, took EPO and then bam ran like 28 something? Bottom line: Wheating is great but we have to be suspect. In this sport it's guilty till proven innocent.

you have to admit Runner's World did get something right:

http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,7120,s6-243-297--13278-1-1X2X3X4X5X6X7X9-8,00.html

exactamundo wrote:In this sport it's guilty till proven innocent.

And how exactly does one prove his innocence in running?

The reason why Moroccan distance runners get called out as cheats is because so many of them have been busted, evidence of systematic doping, NOT because they have big improvements. Ethiopians don't get the same treatment, because their doping record is much cleaner, like male American distance runners.When American male distance runners start showing up in Balco-type investigations, get back to us.

Sagarin wrote:

hatetosaybutcomeon wrote:

Drugs anyone? We have to be suspicious. Yes the dude is talented but come on he isn't even a sub 14 5k runner and he goes and runs this?

Doubt it. Kid ran 1:45.0x at the trials two year ago and has "only" improved that to 1:44.62. He's merely extended his range. He definitely looked like he had more in the tank at Pre and he did, just as he said. jjjjjj's post is right. More upside from this guy. He will take the AR at some point if he can work that 800 PR down a bit more.

3:47.77 in first real overseas competition at the distance -- wow.

Robby Andrews ran 1:45.54 and he's how old??

In case you were not around in the spring of 2008, Wheating ran something like 1:47, 3:58 and 3:38 to win each of these three races with a huge kick. The 3:38 was clocked with a :26.0 last 200. MANY people were speculating that he was ready for a 3:36 or better THAT day if the race had simply been faster. This was his 3rd year of running, and only his 2nd year of year round running. He made the Olympics that summer, long after he peaked for NCAA's, with a 1:45.0. Again in that race he ran way out in the lanes and was impeded on in the homestretch. MANY thought he had a 1:44.5 or better that day.

I'm assuming you do not know a lot or have a lot of experience with top level distance racing, but when a guy blows people up in the last 200, he is not racing to his full level. What that means is, his best marks are not representative of his actual potential, just what it took to win the races. It has long been said that we wouldn't know what Wheating was capable of until he raced in Europe. Well that was true and now we do, or at least we have a glimpse. I'm hoping he gets in another 800 that goes 1:42.

He didn't race last summer due to calf injury, which he followed up with mono and a stress fracture. Dorian Ulrey went 3:35 last year in Europe and Seneca Lassiter went 3:33 right out of college in Europe. Neither of these guys were on Wheatings level, all due respect.

You were probably one of the guys who thought Wheating didn't deserve to be in the PRE mile, and couldn't understand what those of us who did, as well as the meet promoter, had seen to indicate he was ready. Well it's all been there if you knew how to look.

oh, I'm an idiot now. The point is that the fact that runner x has gone sub 3:31 is not in itself reason to say or suspect that he has doped. If he has gone 3:28, then you're going to wonder, legitimately. We know that Wheating was unpushed prior to the kick in the NCAA. What he does in races is to follow at the back of the pack and so we only saw what he could do following at the back of 3:40/1:46 packs. This was a 3:32 pack.

stuck with match.com wrote:

El Guerrouj runs a 3:26 and everybody cries doper! Wheating runs 3:30 and everybody cries hard work and talent, fastest man in the us!

Interesting.....

Of course, El Guerrouj ran 3:31 when he was 20 and I think ran 3:34 when he was 18 or 19. But NEVER did he have the kind of time drop that Wheating just posted.

Robby Andrews ran just slower than the #25 World Junior time in history, but came into the year as a high school AR holder. Wheating ran 1:50 or so at about the same age as Andrews.

Lagat went from 3:37 to 3:30 IN THREE YEARS. Wheating just did that IN TWO MONTHS, and AFTER A LONG NCAA SEASON. Remember that Lagat also ran in the NCAA and was able to do nothing of the sort. Either Wheating has vastly more talent than one of the only two people in history to run 3:26, or....

If this was a Kenyan kid who had been running 3:38/1:46, hadn't seen a PR in either since 2008....and SUDDENLY drops from 3:38 to 3:30, what would everybody be saying?

Given the Nike/AW history and the sudden drops for a number of athletes, the whole OTC scene is starting to look like the Moroccans...before Boulami got caught.

The progression of Wheating doesn't look like the progression of Kiprop, Webb, or Manzano.

But Boulami went from 8:11 to 7:55 in two years. The next year he was buzsted.

I think you can guess what track and field people around the world are saying these days, and not just about one guy.

charlev wrote:

Sagarin wrote:

Doubt it. Kid ran 1:45.0x at the trials two year ago and has "only" improved that to 1:44.62. He's merely extended his range. He definitely looked like he had more in the tank at Pre and he did, just as he said. jjjjjj's post is right. More upside from this guy. He will take the AR at some point if he can work that 800 PR down a bit more.

3:47.77 in first real overseas competition at the distance -- wow.

Robby Andrews ran 1:45.54 and he's how old??

I believe Robby is a year younger and over a half second back from when Wheating ran his 1:45.0, though has about 3-4 years of training and racing on wheating when wheating did it. Robby is great though.

WH33T7NG fanboi wrote:

Lest you forget Gregson has been enjoying all the perks of being a professional athlete, he's been doing this pro thing for awhile.

Thatidiot Pfiffer from the Kiwi thread would have you believe that Wheating is better off than Gregson from havin experience in the "NCAA System."

the other thing with the doping claim is that my sense is if they're not in a systematic doping program, that with top athletes they are more likely to start doing it after years of stagnation and/or injury, or when they are suddenly surpassed (think Bonds). Why would you start doping when you are beating everyone at one level (NCAA), have barely scratched the surface of your talent and have not yet even been tested by the top competition in Euro races (as of several weeks ago)?

Stop hating on Wheating. Let the guy run. He's in Europe, having the time of his life, running better than any American really has in a long time. He's clean, talented, and ready to put American MD running back on the map. I agree that the big question now is, 15 or 8? I say 15. His back of the pack racing style won't work in two years when London comes around, not in the 800 anyway, but if he can learn to hang mid pack (not running in lane 2 like at Pre), he'll be just fine.

STOP WITH THE AMERICAN-BORN BULL

He is the fastest ever who was from New England and went to school in the North West. Who cares!!

HE IS THE 4th fastest American ever at that distance.

Great job Andy......oh by the way!..I love the "the American born stuff"!...please keep us posted!

transplants don't count!

Holy cow Coach D, I suggest you read my post above. I'm sorry, but you really don't get it. Have you ever raced distance at any competitive level? Weren't you the one saying that Wheating wouldn't even win NCAA's or something like that?

Lets review who Wheating has beaten handily PRIOR to the start of the summer season:

Robby Andrews and a slew of other 1:45 and 1:46 guys, and he did this while doubling for 1500.

Dorian Ulrey 3:35 man on the DMR mile

Leer 3:36

Centro 3:36

Acosta (Now 3:36/3:53)

Lee 3:37

Miller 3:37

Bolas 3:37

And on and on.

He looked like a man among boys at NCAA's and he got a late start to his outdoor season.

I think you are lacking something VERY important with all that jibberish you posted, CONTEXT! When you simply sit and mop up 3:35 and 3:36 what do you think that makes you? It certainly makes you better than 3:35 and 3:36 espcially when you can already run 2-4 seconds faster than those guys at 800.

You saying that he dropped from 3:37 to 3:30 like those were both true best for him exposes your ignorance. His 3:37 was run in Texas, in the heat, as the 4th race in 3 days, in a qualifying meet for NCAA's, where he was obviously running conservative not only because of how he looked but because anyone who wants to win 2 NCAA titles in one meet with a team title on the line is not going to lay it all out for a qualifying round.

As one person mentioned, this is about a 3 second pr for him over his mile time. Also he's only been challenged to his max a few times now. It's not like he's been running in elite rabbitted races time and time again, and then all of a sudden drops a 330.9 out of no where. We never had a really good basis for him to start with.

To those commenting on his 800. Don't be morons. Until a few weeks ago it was...oh he hasn't improved his 800 in 2 years. Then he improved it. I have no doubt if he got in some more you would see something even better. Wheating is a great 800 runner as well, and you can't just take snapshots saying, oh he's way better at the 1500 now. He may be a better 1500 runner, but i don't think we've seen what he can do at the 800 just yet.

anyone know if he's running another 800 soon?

Why do you jackasses keep lamenting the "7 second drop!!!!!" in Wheating's 1500 PB as evidence of possible doping?

The progression has been laid out for you in very easy to understand terms and still you try to grab hold of any "evidence" that will feebly support your biases.

Doping concerns are clearly fair game but to try and fabricate support for your agenda is laughable, and quite frankly, embarrassing.

God I hope you're not a real coach.

That being said, Wheating has been on a fairy tale ride since he arrived at Oregon and, until the depth of his talent is known, it doesn't appear likely that it has been chemically induced.

To me he appears to be in possession of the same "game changing" talent as Usain.

I am still skeptical. But..hey, if David friggin Torrence can run 1:45 FLAT why not 3:30 for Wheating. It just seems like were in the middle of one of those American distance running free for alls where you just get in there and grab everyhting you can while it hopping.

hehehehehehasdasd134134 wrote:

he got 4th

wow that sucks