LeBron doesn't owe the city of Cleveland anything.

Once again, you fail: all those holds can be renounced! Then they will count for nothing! Do you not understand that? You act like cap holds for free agents are impossible to get rid of: there not!

I know it might be too much reading for you, but I suggest you read this:

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm

It will explain everything you need to know about the NBA salary cap. I especially think you should read #33 and #34. They will show you why cap holds don't really mean crap.

No kidding wrote:

So you say Cleveland is pathetic and stupid. Isn't Lebron from Cleveland?

Lebron is from Akron. Those are two separate cities 30 miles apart.

Well since my failure would be based solely upon your opinion, that is definitely something that wont cause me to lose any sleep....

I honestly do hope you enjoy your upcoming season watching the Cavs, well that is if that is something that you would even be able to stomach....I truly do look forward to seeing how Cavs management start handling player personnel moves now that they wont have Lebron to blame for giving the ok on this deal or that deal!!

I myself will rather enjoy watching the Cavs fall on their face without Lebron, and watching the incompetent moves that Cavs management make.

Hopefully you get lucky in the LOTTERY, cause that really is the only way that your getting any top players into the Armpit of America to play basketball!!!!!

Oh the Irony wrote:

Do you even know what frontrunner means? Hahaha! Cleveland hasn't won anything in close to 50 years!

This coming from the guy who says he is going to quit watching the Cavs and start watching the Heat. Who is the front runner? You say Tribe fans are pathetic (the fans who used to have the record for most consectuive sell-outs) and then say you're going to do the same thing with the Cavs. Hahahahaha, the ironies ARE endless.

You know who is pathetic: frontrunners like you who are fans of players instead of fans of teams.

First, In over 40 years, I had NEVER ATTENDED A CLEVELAND CAVALIERS GAME before Lebron got there. Just because I "live in the area" does not mean I have to be a die-hard fan of that team.

Second, I started going to watch Lebron when he was a junior in high school 9 years ago. I even went to watch him play in the Primetime Shootout in New Jersey where he had 52 points against the #8 team in the country. Did that make me an Akron St. Vincent Mary fan? Of course not. After Lebron graduated, I have never been to another one of their games and the only time I watched them on tv was when they got to the state finals.

I am a fan of Lebron James. I will be watching him and the Miami Heat and hope they win many titles. Lebron will eventually leave Miami and I will be no more of a fan of them than I was before Lebron got there.

You can call me a frontrunner for liking to watch the best player in basketball, but you can call everyone that who loves to watch great and exciting players like Payton Manning, Tiger Woods, Lance Armstrong, Steven Strasburg, etc, etc. I don't care about any of the teams those guys play on. I just love to watch them for the incredible performances they put on.

On a more local level, I also made a point to see high school games by Ben Mauk who set all of Ohio's passing records in football and Jon Diebler who broke the scoring record in basketball.

I still don't understand why you think it is wrong to be a fan of a player instead of a team. Could you expound on that for me?

1) I don't know if this has been mentioned (didn't read through ALL the posts) but what ever happened to LeBron's elbow? Following the final game of the Celtics series he informed Cleveland media he would be have surgery- nothing yet and doubt there will be...it's becoming a little more obvious over time that he may have quit on the Cavs since if he won a championship or even made the Finals, there would be no way he could leave the city.

2) To the city of Cleveland, Akron, and all of NE Ohio this is NOT the same LBJ we knew 3-7 yrs ago. This is not the same kid with "FAMILY" and "LOYALTY" and "330" tatooed on his body. Those are now meaningless. He cares more about the brand now, more about selling shoes, more about being flaunted around in South Beach, more about getting his friends cushy high-paying jobs with the Heat than getting the Cavs an NBA Championship.

3) I recommend you read this article which depicts the high possibility that LeBron James+DWade+Bosh had been seriously discussing MIA for over 4yrs...

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2010/07/inside_the_decision_miamis_cou.html

Well, you did fail because you acted like you knew about the NBA salary cap but I found out you didn't. Instead, you looked up articles that support your side of the argument instead of actually looking at the CBA.

I'm glad you admit you were wrong though.

P.S. I knew you were wrong went you brought up cap holds when they had nothing to do with the argument at hand, except for LeBron's. It was a rookie mistake though, I'm sure you'll learn from it.

And I take it you live in North Carolina. If that's the case, have fun living in a state that only cares about college basketball. Maybe I'll see you at a Carolina Panthers game someday...oh wait, no one goes to those.

You know what I like, I like that you get out of what I write only what you want....LOL I only brought up cap holds as a point of showing why the Cavs were WAY over the cap salary, and that was only cause you were blabbing at the mouth saying they were way over in order to support your argument that they made all these moves for LEBRON, Well no crap they made the moves for LEBRON but they only made moves that in the end made it a no brainer to leave, If he would have stayed I would have respected his loyalty but felt it was a dumb move and that he was going to become the Dan Marino of the NBA, great but never win that ring....but hey, take what I say and twist it whatever way you want....If it makes you feel better, then at the end of the day I feel better that I could help your self esteem!

Yes I do live in NC presently, but I am only hear because of the Army....so yeah you probably wont see me at ANY Carolina sports games, except maybe I will go and watch the Bobcats beat up on the Cavs when there in town....No lets stratch that idea, why waste money watching one of the worst teams in the NBA....and yes I am referring to the CAVS.

At the end of the day you can turn this into an argument about whatever you want...cap space, Lebron making piss poor personnel decisions,etc....BTW at the end of the day LEBRON is gone, he is in MIAMI now, it is time for you to get over it!!

I do feel bad for you, who do you have to cheer for now?? The cavs??? LMAO. The Browns? LMAO. The Indians? LMAO...WOW I totally understand your bitterness toward Lebron now!!!!

To Quote the original OP, LEBRON DOESNT OWE THE CITY OF CLEVELAND ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!

AND IT DOESNT TAKE SOMEONE FROM TO CLEVELAND/OHIO TO FIGURE THAT ONE OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I never said it was wrong to be a fan of a player. I said it makes you a frontrunner, which it does, and that makes you pathetic because you called out the Cavs and Tribe fans for being frontrunners. Don't you see the irony in that?

just an outsiders view wrote:

No kidding wrote:

So you say Cleveland is pathetic and stupid. Isn't Lebron from Cleveland?

Lebron is from Akron. Those are two separate cities 30 miles apart.

So you're saying it's only people that live in the city of Cleveland itself that are pathetic and stupid. Anyone who lives in Akron or any surrounding city or town is not stupid or pathetic even though they may be a Cleveland fan?

Since you're a lover of everything Lebron is/was Lebron a Cleveland fan? Just trying to understand your logic.

Bron bron surely took the easy way out, can't get the job done himself so he gives up just like he did in those playoff games. Not returning phone calls and texts is also pretty inexcusable.

Who does/has gotten the job done themselves?

Oh the Irony wrote:

I never said it was wrong to be a fan of a player. I said it makes you a frontrunner, which it does, and that makes you pathetic because you called out the Cavs and Tribe fans for being frontrunners. Don't you see the irony in that?

The cleveland fans filled the Jake 44,000+ for years as long as they were WINNING. As soon as they started LOSING, only 10k goes until june when 20k go leaving more than half the seats empty. In 2 years, the Q will be reporting bogus attendance of 12-14k when only about 8k will be actually showing up.

The difference for me is that I am still a Lebron fan even though as all the haters like to say "he hasn't one anything yet". Frontrunners are the people who GIVE UP when the going gets tough. I didn't give up on Lebron just because he hasn't won yet.

It is now pretty obvious who the true Lebron fans are and who are just leeches who only cared about Lebron when he was winning for their team or making them a lot of money.

I guess you are one of those leeches. If that makes me a pathetic Lebron fan and you a leech with the other ignorant sheeple, I can live with that.

that mysterious "one" somewhere in my last post should be a "won"

Nice job not focusing on the circumstances surrounding Cleveland back in the 90's and now in the 2000's and instead blaming everything on the fans. It makes me wonder if your not making all this up to get a rise out of Cleveland fans. The economy of Cleveland was much better back then than it is now. Add that to the fact that the Browns weren't in town and the Cavs weren't making deep runs into the playoffs, and Cleveland's fans had a lot more money to spend to go to the ballpark. And the Tribe was good! Find me one team that doesn't get better attendance when the team is good. Not the Heat! The couldn't even sellout playoff games last year. If you think Cleveland frontrunners are bad (it's almost a joke to even write that), have fun with your new Heat friends.

Fast-forward to 2010: People are moving out of Cleveland at an alarming rate. The economy is shit. The Browns are back in town, and Cleveland is a football town, no matter what anyone says. The Cavs having been making the playoffs the last couple years. People have less money to go to the ballpark. Also, the team has traded Cy Young pitchers in back-to-back seasons along with a fan favorite catcher. They have little hope at contending. You honestly expect the Tribe to sellout every game? In not as clear cut as the Tribe WINNING = SELLOUT and LOSING = EMPTY SEATS, so you can stop with all that drivle.

Hasn't stopped me from spending over $100 on tickets and traveling a couple hours to watch Tribe games this year, and I've had fun watching them, even though they traded Victor, my favorite player. And it won't stop me from supporting the Cavs and Browns either. TBH, Cleveland shouldn't have 3 professional teams anymore. It's impossible for a city of that size and economic standing to support all three like they deserve. And sadly for any Cavs fans, this last "Decision" by LeBron probably killed any chance the Cavs had to stay in Cleveland.

And there is no difference between you and the frontrunners you call pathetic. If LeBron absolutely sucked, would you still be his fan? Would you still pay hundreds of dollars to go watch him play every night? No, you would probably move on to whoever was the next best player. If that's not a frontrunner, I don't know what is. So get out of here with your holier-than-thou attitiude.

And for your leech statement, LeBron hasn't made me one cent. I'm just a poor college student. The only leech I see is the college education system, but that's another argument all together.

just an outsiders view wrote:

that mysterious "one" somewhere in my last post should be a "won"

Thanks so much for clearing that up. Never would have got that one. Now go carry Lebrons jock.

Oh, since we're on the topic of salary cap, I will LMAO if this goes down:

http://nba.fanhouse.com/2010/07/11/could-miamis-super-team-be-broken-up-after-one-year/

I'm sure that stooge Stern will make sure it doesn't though...

NObama Owns You wrote:

I wouldn't stay at a job for more than 7 years if my boss couldn't hire some comptent coworkers. Stop crying like little bitches and Dan Gilbert, you exhibited the lack of class that you claimed James didn't have. I applaud James for taking less money for a chance to win.

Less money? He'll obviously get more after state and local income taxes are figured in.

Please tell me you're kidding when you're saying that Jordan was surrounded by crap. Have you seen Pippen's awards for his career? 8× NBA All-Defensive First Team (including the years Jordan was gone), and 3× All-NBA First Team Selection (including two of the years Jordan was gone). The year after Jordan left, the time when, according to you, Pippen sucked, he was third in the MVP race! He had Steve Kerr, who still holds the league record for lifetime three point percentage, and Dennis Rodman, who, though he was a doofus, absolutely dominated on the boards and on D. Good Lord, to say that Jordan was surrounded by crap makes you look like a fool. He was surrounded by guys who understood the offense, understood their roles on the team, and could play lockdown defense.

In regards to the Lebron debate, I don't really care that he went to Miami; it was the way he handled the whole free agency bit that was classless. I say bravo to Gilbert for busting him out.

just an outsiders view wrote:

Lebron is from Akron. Those are two separate cities 30 miles apart.

This view is rightfully an outsider's. Akron and Cleveland are essentially the same. A majority of the people who work in Cle live in Akron and Cle restaurants, Indians, Browns, Cavs make money off the wealthy individuals who reside in Akron. Also if you live near the highway it takes like 25min to get to Cle and 20 if you speed. Just advancing the fact that they are strongly connected in all but name.