That 3:33 was in a race he won by almost 2 seconds. He certainly could have run faster with more pacing help like he got from Jakob at Pre.
You can’t just look at times. You have to look at contexts.
That’s negated by the fact that running close to 3:26 gets exponentially difficult. You do know, a barrier that used to mean something right?
And he was able to achieve that with another year of maturation at an age when significant improvement can be expected, in his first full year of training as a pro, and with the perfect pacer in Jakob for the full duration of the race.
It's hilarious watching Gault and Weldon trying to justify these 1500m results. Habz is the 6th FASTEST ever at this distance 3:26 Hicham El Guerrouj - Olympic Champion 3:26.34 Bernard Lagat - World Champion and challenged Hicham 3:26.69 Asbel Kiprop - Olympic Champion, busted for doping 3:26.73 Jakob Ingebrigtsen - Olympic Champion 3:27.34 Nourredine Morceli - Olympic Champion 3:27.49 Azeddine Habz - .........Are you kidding me Plus that other young kenyan who ran 3:27.72 No way this is legit.
Not saying those guys above him aren't doping but come on lol.
That’s negated by the fact that running close to 3:26 gets exponentially difficult. You do know, a barrier that used to mean something right?
And he was able to achieve that with another year of maturation at an age when significant improvement can be expected, in his first full year of training as a pro, and with the perfect pacer in Jakob for the full duration of the race.
No, that isn’t expected at all. It’s not just a written rule that you can graduate college and then in one year run close to a WR. You are also overrating the effects of drafting. They don’t give 6 seconds.
This is going nowhere. You can enjoy this circus, goodbye.
Habz’s run today isn’t anything like Nuguse’s 3:43 when you look at the contexts.
Habz: big 3:27 PB at age 31 while leading the last 500m, as someone who’s never finished in the top 8 at a global championships
Nuguse: big PB at age 24 in his first full year as a pro, running behind Jakob the whole way, at the conclusion of a season in which he established himself as a top runner by winning DL races in London and Zurich and (in a bit of a disappointment at the time) finishing 5th at the world championships
They are not alike at all.
Thank you for proving my point. Nuguse won 3:30-3:31 races as that is what he was good for. All of a sudden now he is running 0.8 seconds off the mile WR? Ok. We saw what he was capable of that same year while being drafted and that was 3:29. 3:43.97 makes no sense no matter what way you put it.
He ran 3:29.02 in mid-June, 10 weeks before the world championship final for which he was aiming to be at his peak. In that 3:29.02 race in Oslo, he had to navigate around traffic on the penultimate lap. Without opposing runners in his way, he would have run 3:28 that day.
After the world championship final in Budapest, he held his peak for a few more weeks. That post-Budapest time period included defeating the new world champion in Zurich and then the Bowerman Mile at Pre. In the mile, he was able quickly settle in along the rail and then just run without anyone getting in his way. It was an ideal setup with the perfect pacer in Jakob right in front of him, leading to a special outcome.
Again, don't just look at times. Consider the contexts and watch the races.
One big asterisk here, but this Paris DL track was insanely fast each of the last two years as well. It's the newer, better Monaco. It's either short or so fricking bouncy that none of the times are real. That said, Habz shouldn't be winning Diamond League races. Dude isn't that good. Something is off.
Yes, not discounting doping, but the track has to be crazy springy/fast. Some of these tracks have gotten absolutely ridiculous, both indoor and outdoor. So much talk about supershoes (and that talk is definitely relevant), but these track surfaces at some venues are a joke and its highly suspect when everyone is blasting PBs.
Yeah ive read that tracks are a lot faster now,plus add the shoes to it and wave lights. I wonder how fast hicham el garrouj,kenenisa bekele ,steve ovett, sebastian coe, steve cram and joaqim cruz would have run with that combo?
Habz’s run today isn’t anything like Nuguse’s 3:43 when you look at the contexts.
Habz: big 3:27 PB at age 31 while leading the last 500m, as someone who’s never finished in the top 8 at a global championships
Nuguse: big PB at age 24 in his first full year as a pro, running behind Jakob the whole way, at the conclusion of a season in which he established himself as a top runner by winning DL races in London and Zurich and (in a bit of a disappointment at the time) finishing 5th at the world championships
They are not alike at all.
Thank you for proving my point. Nuguse won 3:30-3:31 races as that is what he was good for. All of a sudden now he is running 0.8 seconds off the mile WR? Ok. We saw what he was capable of that same year while being drafted and that was 3:29. 3:43.97 makes no sense no matter what way you put it.
Nuguse ran a 3:47 closing in 25 the last 200 for his first race indoors and you thought 3:30 was going to be his limit outdoors?
Not even gonna mention the fact that he also beat Katir [who had gone under Komen's old WR], handily in a 3k
This post was edited 4 minutes after it was posted.
And he was able to achieve that with another year of maturation at an age when significant improvement can be expected, in his first full year of training as a pro, and with the perfect pacer in Jakob for the full duration of the race.
No, that isn’t expected at all. It’s not just a written rule that you can graduate college and then in one year run close to a WR. You are also overrating the effects of drafting. They don’t give 6 seconds.
This is going nowhere. You can enjoy this circus, goodbye.
People conveniently forget Yared had some whereabouts funny business going on. But certain people seem to get breaks, and some don’t. Heh
And he was able to achieve that with another year of maturation at an age when significant improvement can be expected, in his first full year of training as a pro, and with the perfect pacer in Jakob for the full duration of the race.
No, that isn’t expected at all. It’s not just a written rule that you can graduate college and then in one year run close to a WR. You are also overrating the effects of drafting. They don’t give 6 seconds.
This is going nowhere. You can enjoy this circus, goodbye.
LOL. It's not something that everyone can expect, but Nuguse is a special talent who has consistently been one of the best 1500m and mile runners in the world the past couple of years. He has a very different track record than Habz.
Thank you for proving my point. Nuguse won 3:30-3:31 races as that is what he was good for. All of a sudden now he is running 0.8 seconds off the mile WR? Ok. We saw what he was capable of that same year while being drafted and that was 3:29. 3:43.97 makes no sense no matter what way you put it.
Nuguse ran a 3:47 closing in 25 the last 200 for his first race indoors and you thought 3:30 was his limit outdoors?
Not even gonna mention the fact that he also beat Katir [who had gone under Komen's old WR], handily in a 3k
Thank you for reminding me about that race. Turns out I was wrong. Nuguse started being suspicious and highly likely doping since early 2023, not in the diamond league final. What a shame.
Thank you for proving my point. Nuguse won 3:30-3:31 races as that is what he was good for. All of a sudden now he is running 0.8 seconds off the mile WR? Ok. We saw what he was capable of that same year while being drafted and that was 3:29. 3:43.97 makes no sense no matter what way you put it.
He ran 3:29.02 in mid-June, 10 weeks before the world championship final for which he was aiming to be at his peak. In that 3:29.02 race in Oslo, he had to navigate around traffic on the penultimate lap. Without opposing runners in his way, he would have run 3:28 that day.
After the world championship final in Budapest, he held his peak for a few more weeks. That post-Budapest time period included defeating the new world champion in Zurich and then the Bowerman Mile at Pre. In the mile, he was able quickly settle in along the rail and then just run without anyone getting in his way. It was an ideal setup with the perfect pacer in Jakob right in front of him, leading to a special outcome.
Again, don't just look at times. Consider the contexts and watch the races.
There is no guarantee that Nuguse peaked in Budapest. If anything, it was a bad peak given that he finished in 3:30.
Nuguse ran a grand total of 0.4 extra meters. That is almost nothing. There is also no guarantee he would have run faster anyways. Cheruiyot ran 1510 meters that day, I guess he was in 3:27 shape then? Of course not. Extra distance doesn't mean much unless you ran almost 50 meters extra, like Katir who likewise was probably doping.
I watched the Zurich race. It was relatively unimpressive compared to where he was in Eugene. 3:30.49 to beat a tired Josh Kerr at the line.
The video of the Oslo race is linked below. Fast fwd to around 3:25, and you'll see Nuguse went wide rounding the turn to pass Cheruiyot. That move cost him at least three-hundredths of a second, which would put him into 3:28 territory.
As for Budapest, maybe Ritz mistimed his peak, maybe Nuguse ate some Hungarian food that didn't agree with him, or maybe just the pressure of being in his first global championship final got to him. Who knows.
Here's what we do know: Nuguse has consistently been one of best 1500m/mile runners in the world the past couple of years, and therefore it's understandable for one of the best runners in the world today to be running historically great times with the aid of today's tech advantages. In contrast, Habz has not consistently been one of the best runners in the world in his career. For him to run the way he did today at age 31 is a big surprise.
The video of the Oslo race is linked below. Fast fwd to around 3:25, and you'll see Nuguse went wide rounding the turn to pass Cheruiyot. That move cost him at least three-hundredths of a second, which would put him into 3:28 territory.
As for Budapest, maybe Ritz mistimed his peak, maybe Nuguse ate some Hungarian food that didn't agree with him, or maybe just the pressure of being in his first global championship final got to him. Who knows.
Here's what we do know: Nuguse has consistently been one of best 1500m/mile runners in the world the past couple of years, and therefore it's understandable for one of the best runners in the world today to be running historically great times with the aid of today's tech advantages. In contrast, Habz has not consistently been one of the best runners in the world in his career. For him to run the way he did today at age 31 is a big surprise.
On the post race interview for Eugene Ritz said that Nuguse was feeling a bit under the weather during the Budapest final, but they didn't want to blame that as the reason for his performance. It was an off day combined with some questionable positioning and tactics for sure.
The video of the Oslo race is linked below. Fast fwd to around 3:25, and you'll see Nuguse went wide rounding the turn to pass Cheruiyot. That move cost him at least three-hundredths of a second, which would put him into 3:28 territory.
As for Budapest, maybe Ritz mistimed his peak, maybe Nuguse ate some Hungarian food that didn't agree with him, or maybe just the pressure of being in his first global championship final got to him. Who knows.
Here's what we do know: Nuguse has consistently been one of best 1500m/mile runners in the world the past couple of years, and therefore it's understandable for one of the best runners in the world today to be running historically great times with the aid of today's tech advantages. In contrast, Habz has not consistently been one of the best runners in the world in his career. For him to run the way he did today at age 31 is a big surprise.
Yet the official race analysis said that it amounted to 0.4 meters extra in distance, which is less than one hundreth of a second. Once again, it doesn't matter if he ran 2, 3, or 10 meters extra, there is no guarantee he would have run faster anyways.
You can keep making up excuses. Habz is more suspicious than Nuguse but I put them in the same group due to their otherwordly performances. I find the difference small.
The video of the Oslo race is linked below. Fast fwd to around 3:25, and you'll see Nuguse went wide rounding the turn to pass Cheruiyot. That move cost him at least three-hundredths of a second, which would put him into 3:28 territory.
As for Budapest, maybe Ritz mistimed his peak, maybe Nuguse ate some Hungarian food that didn't agree with him, or maybe just the pressure of being in his first global championship final got to him. Who knows.
Here's what we do know: Nuguse has consistently been one of best 1500m/mile runners in the world the past couple of years, and therefore it's understandable for one of the best runners in the world today to be running historically great times with the aid of today's tech advantages. In contrast, Habz has not consistently been one of the best runners in the world in his career. For him to run the way he did today at age 31 is a big surprise.
Yet the official race analysis said that it amounted to 0.4 meters extra in distance, which is less than one hundreth of a second. Once again, it doesn't matter if he ran 2, 3, or 10 meters extra, there is no guarantee he would have run faster anyways.
You can keep making up excuses. Habz is more suspicious than Nuguse but I put them in the same group due to their otherwordly performances. I find the difference small.
Also, I don't speak for everyone, but I find double upvoting my own posts pretty embarrassing, but that is just me.
Yet the official race analysis said that it amounted to 0.4 meters extra in distance, which is less than one hundreth of a second. Once again, it doesn't matter if he ran 2, 3, or 10 meters extra, there is no guarantee he would have run faster anyways.
You can keep making up excuses. Habz is more suspicious than Nuguse but I put them in the same group due to their otherwordly performances. I find the difference small.
It’s not about making excuses, just understanding context. Have you ever raced? Did you always run to the best of your abilities, or did you feel and run better in some races than others?
If you find the difference in contexts between Nuguse at age 24 and Habz at age 31 to be small, then you’re being unreasonable.
These runners need to start suing for defamation of character smh. Unless he or anyone else test positive for drugs, let's appreciate the runners k? 31 although is older for a distance runner it's not impossible.
Yet the official race analysis said that it amounted to 0.4 meters extra in distance, which is less than one hundreth of a second. Once again, it doesn't matter if he ran 2, 3, or 10 meters extra, there is no guarantee he would have run faster anyways.
You can keep making up excuses. Habz is more suspicious than Nuguse but I put them in the same group due to their otherwordly performances. I find the difference small.
It’s not about making excuses, just understanding context. Have you ever raced? Did you always run to the best of your abilities, or did you feel and run better in some races than others?
If you find the difference in contexts between Nuguse at age 24 and Habz at age 31 to be small, then you’re being unreasonable.
They aren't that much different. Nuguse and Habz were pretty similar in 2023. Habz likely had an injury or setback in 2024 and went on whatever stuff Nuguse went on in the 2023 diamond league final.