The only reason Rupp ran Prague that year was because he dropped out of Boston after 18 miles a few weeks before because of the horrible weather. That was the year Yuki Kawauchi won in 2:15:58 in 39 degree rain.
I have more respect for Mantz after watching him race yesterday. He was in another class above the rest of the Americans. I think the US marathon record will last a while longer because the top Americans are stuck in the cycle of running Boston/New York, occasionally Chicago but they don't run fast there. They don't seem interested in running London, Berlin or Valencia. At least Ryan Hall ran London a couple of times.
How can the most slow ass untalented athlete out of high school and out of the junior ranks not too long ago be running 59:17 even on super shoes when prior to that probably 10 other more talented and super fast Americans between 2007 and 2024, Chris Derrick included, my favourite, all couldn’t so much as break 60 or even 61 supershoes or not!!
Connor as a 19-20 year old was struggling to complete a 10000m track race at I think USATF Juniors or equivalent in only 30:30 or 30:40 and you are telling me with that talent foundation he manages to run 59:17 many years later as an adult professional when Chris Derrick, Shadrack Kipchirchir, Wesley Kiptoo, Leonard Korir and many more American mercenaries from Kenya far stronger and more talented than Connor all couldn’t break 60 or even 61?
Really guys? I’ll hang myself right now if I got it wrong but I know I haven’t!
Connor’s absolute and relative space-time has been found wanting baby!! 😓😓
I love to see it. He's got a great attitude and is a gamer. But I don't think this is intrinsically equal to Ryan Hall's 59:43. Even with the wind against him, he broke the record by 26 seconds, almost 2 seconds a mile despite never showing much better at 5k or 10k, on the lower side, and being slower at the marathon as well, even with the super shoes. This was more super shoes than talent and hard work. A guy of Klecker or Fisher's profile would figure to drop this record a lot. Clearly, it wasn't Klecker in his debut. I would guess that Klecker will do better next time but Fisher will run 58 low.
Estimates for super shoe advantage on the roads are from 1.5% to 4.5%. 1% alone would be 36 seconds, making this worth about 59:53. 2% would be worth about 72 seconds, making this worth about 60:17. That sounds about right to me for a runner like Conner Mantz, strong, one of the best American performances ever, but not two seconds a mile better than Hall at his best.
Mantz has the guts to go out at the pace needed to achieve the desired time, which today was the AR record. He's also mentally tough. I see too many people who report that they're going for the record and then they don't even go 20% of the race at the pace needed for the record. Mantz goes after it without hesitation. His approach could end in a disaster but at least it has a chance to succeed. He's going to win a major Marathon within the next 2 years.
You are a physicist too? Show yourself more prominently ok? Post more and comment more often. Showcase your talents and skills in providing the world untouchable insights based in the laws of physics! Be courageous dude!
I love to see it. He's got a great attitude and is a gamer. But I don't think this is intrinsically equal to Ryan Hall's 59:43. Even with the wind against him, he broke the record by 26 seconds, almost 2 seconds a mile despite never showing much better at 5k or 10k, on the lower side, and being slower at the marathon as well, even with the super shoes. This was more super shoes than talent and hard work. A guy of Klecker or Fisher's profile would figure to drop this record a lot. Clearly, it wasn't Klecker in his debut. I would guess that Klecker will do better next time but Fisher will run 58 low.
Estimates for super shoe advantage on the roads are from 1.5% to 4.5%. 1% alone would be 36 seconds, making this worth about 59:53. 2% would be worth about 72 seconds, making this worth about 60:17. That sounds about right to me for a runner like Conner Mantz, strong, one of the best American performances ever, but not two seconds a mile better than Hall at his best.
Bad take. Then why the other Americans who are just as fast or faster than Connor at lower and higher distances ran so far behind 59:17?
Well I want national records to reflect the best runners in those nations. I can’t speak to other countries, but it’s not easy to become a US citizen. If someone is willing to go through that lengthy process just for love of my country, I am just as happy to see them set an AR as I am for someone who just happened to be born here.
I basically agree with you. In most cases, it is not really an attempt to "game the system" and I am fine with it.
It is a little different if the person doesn't tick any of the boxes though: childhood, coaching, high school, college, training partners, diet, lifestyle, training group, environment, social norms, expectations from parents, etc.
If none of those are American, how "American" are you?
If Kipchoge became an American, would it be useful to say, "the best marathoner of all time is an American." That would be factually correct, but you can agree that it doesn't hold any actual value for a person trying to learn about the sport generally and American running specifically.
Congratulations, you've made it to "automatic ignore and downvote" status in record time.
Why is this idiot not deleted who responded provocatively to my deleted comments? Clearly an unhinged and abandoned mod who whimsically presses the delete button!! I need Rojo to reinstall my good comments immediately thank you 🙏
I have more respect for Mantz after watching him race yesterday. He was in another class above the rest of the Americans. I think the US marathon record will last a while longer because the top Americans are stuck in the cycle of running Boston/New York, occasionally Chicago but they don't run fast there. They don't seem interested in running London, Berlin or Valencia. At least Ryan Hall ran London a couple of times.
I’ve said this a number of times since the Olympics. I understand the economics of it, but I really, really wish we could see, in the next 18 months, Mantz or Young in Valencia or Berlin. Not New York and Boston. And definitely not Chicago. And it’s aggravating that it won’t happen.
seriously, the sponsors would really benefit with a bonus structure here that would overcome the appearance fee issue that is stopping this from happening. Did any of us have Rupp winning Prague back in the day? i didnt. It was completely random. There were so many other places he could have gone to go after KK’s record… but didnt, for a variety of reasons, partly timing, partly economic.
Let’s face it, if Nike wanted to see an AR, they could make it happen with their very deep pockets. At least be willing to match the appearance fees from US major marathons minimally for an AR attempt at a fast European course, and then offer a substantial bonus for an AR. Maybe not the $1 million New Balance was willing to pony up almost 30 years ago but like $500,000 or something.
I get that they may chase the 2:06:30 next year, and I hope it happens. But pro marathoners have only so many fast marathons in the legs. You have to strike while hot. Perhaps Mantz will prove the outlier, but he’s ready to run 2:05 right now. This spring.
Mr Americano John, why did you fearfully and timidly delete my legitimate comments about Connor’s abnormal 59:17 performances beating even the likes of Jemal Yimar and other clean East African athletes from Ethiopia? Not to mention being much faster than Ndikumawemyo my clean Spanish compatriot from ciudad Valencia media maraton in Diciembre last year?
Im seething in fury at the unfair protectionist practices of Americano atletas on LRC!!😡
Actually, I didn’t delete either of your deleted posts from this thread. They were reported as spam and another moderator deleted them (which I think is fine).
Try to limit the thread-derailing troll efforts please, or make them funnier.
John don’t delete this particularly prudent post of mine right now I’m pleading with you.
Edward Cheserek 59:32 Copenhagen 2023 PB. Connor Mantz 59:17?? How in the world 😫😫😫
Again one more! Edward Cheserek 2:05:24 Chicago PB. Connor Mantz 2:07:47 Chicago PB. Thus Cheserek outlasts Connor at both endurance and speed (13:04/3:49/3:36)!!
How in this world does Connor beat Edward KING CHES the most decorated multi NCAA championships winner on the track and in XC with the faster leg speed of 3:49 indoor mile and 3:36 outdoor 1500m? Connor can’t even break 4 for the mile though he has by comparison a somewhat suspicious 3:37 for the 1500m.
Only a 13:30 and 27:25 5k/10k ceiling level and yet running faster than my Spanish compatriot Ndikumawemyo with a ceiling of 12:49 and 26:48 and still getting faster and training for it?!
How does Connor destroy the credentials of both Cheserek and Ndikumawemyo at once? It’s clearly enhanced damn!
I’ve said this a number of times since the Olympics. I understand the economics of it, but I really, really wish we could see, in the next 18 months, Mantz or Young in Valencia or Berlin. Not New York and Boston. And definitely not Chicago. And it’s aggravating that it won’t happen.
seriously, the sponsors would really benefit with a bonus structure here that would overcome the appearance fee issue that is stopping this from happening. Did any of us have Rupp winning Prague back in the day? i didnt. It was completely random. There were so many other places he could have gone to go after KK’s record… but didnt, for a variety of reasons, partly timing, partly economic.
Let’s face it, if Nike wanted to see an AR, they could make it happen with their very deep pockets. At least be willing to match the appearance fees from US major marathons minimally for an AR attempt at a fast European course, and then offer a substantial bonus for an AR. Maybe not the $1 million New Balance was willing to pony up almost 30 years ago but like $500,000 or something.
I get that they may chase the 2:06:30 next year, and I hope it happens. But pro marathoners have only so many fast marathons in the legs. You have to strike while hot. Perhaps Mantz will prove the outlier, but he’s ready to run 2:05 right now. This spring.
Not happening. Connor is not hot and not striking anything! Clean and superior athlete Edward Cheserek who is 10 times more talented and faster than Connor out of high school and junior ranks is not going to be beaten at the HM and FM distances by Connor!
2012 footlocker XC results:
Edward Cheserek 14:59!! 1st
Connor? 15:34?? 12th😆😆😆
Connor is not worth one dime as a talent. No way he is beating Ches cleanly!
Bah 😤😤
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How does Conor do it? It's obvious, I thought LR already knew the secret sauce. A two year mission where he secretly trained in Africa. Clearly in between riding bicycles with white shirts and ties while getting chased by dogs the Mormons are operating a sophisticated microdosing program. But it's not for what you think. They are all burned out from church meetings, committee meetings, conferences, etc they need the HGH and EPO to strengthen their glutes and hammys while sitting in the pews for so long.
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The important thing is that God willed both of them to AR HMs.
Compared to Connor, Kelati’s space-time particulars were far less suspicious. The thing about her performances is there is no sudden space-time lag or voids hanging so conspicuously like Connor’s. Connor would run a 13:10 5k one moment at Boston indoors many years ago or a 7:41 3k or a 27:25 10k and never ever came within 20 seconds, 10 seconds and 30 seconds respectively of those times ever again! Repeatability is a trademark of scientific experimentation and research reliability, but also for clean human elite high performance sport. There are other space-time factors to satisfy CLEAN performances but repeatability is just one of them. Connor failed the repeatability test at at least 2 coupled distance events like 5/10 or 3/5 or 1.5/3.
This is a significant aggravation factor in space and time for doping! While burning so hot, then mysteriously going cold or changing events and running away from the earlier events, Kieran Tuntivate of BTC is the same pattern of behaviour!!
A PRO ELITE athlete in the modern era does not suddenly mysteriously go cold while burning so hot and bright in one or few events and neither do they also just mysteriously switch events like that so quickly on a whim especially in moving down in distance rather than moving up!
Congrats Americana Weiny Kelati, eres completamente limpio!! ❤️❤️
❤️ Weiny you go girl!!
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How does Conor do it? It's obvious, I thought LR already knew the secret sauce. A two year mission where he secretly trained in Africa. Clearly in between riding bicycles with white shirts and ties while getting chased by dogs the Mormons are operating a sophisticated microdosing program. But it's not for what you think. They are all burned out from church meetings, committee meetings, conferences, etc they need the HGH and EPO to strengthen their glutes and hammys while sitting in the pews for so long.
Ok umm….anyway I made my point very clear for all to see. Once we enter American convert Edward Cheserek in the conversation, clean athlete no less who deteriorated also cleanly at the 5k and 10k after college which is why he is therefore so clean, is when our whole perspective about Connor changed dramatically from North to South!
Edward Ches illuminates every last space-time darkness found in Connor’s!
While I cant believe I’m giving credit to an American of all nationalities in Weiny Kelati for being so clean and true to herself! Diminutive in stature but extremely gifted on the inside for the sport!
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