Our Lord God in heaven will stop this cheat in his tracks and take away his sunrise. Not only is he a cheat but an egregious one for boasting he will beat Nuguse for all space and time despite knowing he has an evil advantage.
This statement is actually very wrong analysis but the rest of your comments were fine.
Cole Hocker ran 1:55.73 for the first 800m & 1:34.86 for the last 700m. First 800m of the race at 3:36.99 pace. Last 700m at 3:23.27 pace.
At world’s last year, Jakob ran 1:54.19 for the first 800m & 1:35.46 for the last 700m. First 800m of the race at 3:34.10 pace. Last 700m at 3:24.55 pace.
So it was Kerr / Jakob that had more optimal pacing. Cole had a more dramatic negative split.
A lot slower start makes for a slightly faster finish, what else is new? Thats my problem with Hocker. Cool, he is really good to run down B-tier americans and slightly edge off Nuguse in a 3:30 race. What have he done that is either a great time, or a great result against international competition at a high level? Anything close to a podium? No? Nuguse have that. Hocker does not have either.
Correct way of saying things, You must also add that Hocker is a cheat to boot. Not only has he earned no medal nor world/olympic title despite cheating, he is also cheating!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That's like a double whammy, don't you think sir??????
This statement is actually very wrong analysis but the rest of your comments were fine.
Cole Hocker ran 1:55.73 for the first 800m & 1:34.86 for the last 700m. First 800m of the race at 3:36.99 pace. Last 700m at 3:23.27 pace.
At world’s last year, Jakob ran 1:54.19 for the first 800m & 1:35.46 for the last 700m. First 800m of the race at 3:34.10 pace. Last 700m at 3:24.55 pace.
So it was Kerr / Jakob that had more optimal pacing. Cole had a more dramatic negative split.
A lot slower start makes for a slightly faster finish, what else is new? Thats my problem with Hocker. Cool, he is really good to run down B-tier americans and slightly edge off Nuguse in a 3:30 race. What have he done that is either a great time, or a great result against international competition at a high level? Anything close to a podium? No? Nuguse have that. Hocker does not have either.
???
The start was a second and a half slower, the finish was a second faster. That’s not a lot slower, in fact that’s pretty much the same thing.
Yeah Jakob is arrogant as hell but he has partially earned it. Hocker hasn’t earned it. He comes across as a punk and many racists here are supporting him. He will never medal in a global championship. It is astounding to me how many idiots think he has a chance. He is not as good as Steve Holman, for example.
What is so arrogant about thinking he's the best in the USA. He has won the last 2 Olympic Trials when he was healthy. The Holman comment is definite trolling though.
If he were the best in America he'd be the American record holder. Winning the trials doesn't automatically make him the best. Times don't lie. Without any global medals he's nothing more than time trialer. If he makes the finals he'll get no higher than 5th. I'm not a fan of Jakob at all but at least he's won multiple medals and has earned his right to be arrogant.
Yeah Jakob is arrogant as hell but he has partially earned it. Hocker hasn’t earned it. He comes across as a punk and many racists here are supporting him. He will never medal in a global championship. It is astounding to me how many idiots think he has a chance. He is not as good as Steve Holman, for example.
Think about what you just wrote. You just referred to people you do t know as racists. This is unreal.
If Hocker can stay within half a second of Ingebrigtsen and Kerr, and doesn't get boxed in, I think he unleashes an insane last-lap kick and blows past both of them to win at the tape.
A lot slower start makes for a slightly faster finish, what else is new? Thats my problem with Hocker. Cool, he is really good to run down B-tier americans and slightly edge off Nuguse in a 3:30 race. What have he done that is either a great time, or a great result against international competition at a high level? Anything close to a podium? No? Nuguse have that. Hocker does not have either.
???
The start was a second and a half slower, the finish was a second faster. That’s not a lot slower, in fact that’s pretty much the same thing.
Don’t understand how Hocker is this underrated.
Its not "pretty much the same thing" to trade off a second slower finish with 1.5 seconds slower start.
Why I think he is overrated:
PB: 30:30.59
World ranking 2024: 8
World ranking 2023: 16
Races this year:
Team trials (1500) 3:30.59 1st
Prefontaine classic (mile) 3:48.95 7th
Notable races last year:
Diamond league, London 3:32.14 13th
Worlds (finals) 3:30.70 7th
Zurich diamond league 3:32.00 9th
Prefontaine classic (mile): 3:48.08 6th
Summary:
Two races at 3:30.x in his life.
Not above 6th in any international meet in his life.
Comparison with Nuguse:
8 vs 3 in event wins against Hocker
3:29.02 PB (over a second faster)
5th at worlds vs 7th
Two diamond league wins vs zero
Two second places in DL vs zero
Two third places in DL vs zero
One fourth place in DL vs zero.
Conclusion:
Given never placing better than 6th against international competition, being ranked at 8 this year and 16 last year any placement over 6th place would be overperforming. He could end up as best American, as anything could happen. Not a favorite. As Cole Hocker never have been a contender for the podium at any DL or worlds, he is not underrated when he isn't considered among the top.
What is so arrogant about thinking he's the best in the USA. He has won the last 2 Olympic Trials when he was healthy. The Holman comment is definite trolling though.
Yeah the Holman comment was trolling BUT look at it like this, and you are a very good poster, so you know this. Hocker has an advantage in the US champs, maybe due to his kick, relative to Goose. But in a global championship, where superior runners from other countries can serve as de facto rabbits for Goose, then Hocker loses this advantage relative to Goose. So Hocker can win in the small pond but in the big pond Goose prevails. This is not guaranteed but Hocker should slow his roll because maybe he can win at home but we ain’t in Kansas anymore.
....
I want the 1500m final to be a barn burner 3:28.5 or faster for the winning time. If Hocker beats Yared when Yared doesn't have to lead the whole race than Hocker earns my respect as America's best 1500m/miler. If Yared beats Hocker in the Olympic Final than Hocker's brash talking will serve him a nice large slice humble pie 🥧
Yeah Jakob is arrogant as hell but he has partially earned it. Hocker hasn’t earned it. He comes across as a punk and many racists here are supporting him. He will never medal in a global championship. It is astounding to me how many idiots think he has a chance. He is not as good as Steve Holman, for example.
I don't think so, the testing might be stricter at the Olympics than at US trials. USADA probably gave Hocker a pass you know that??? Otherwise, how the heck does he close a 52 for a 3:30 race that beats even Jakob and Kerr and overhauls Nuguse by 2-3 seconds from the Prefontaine mile????
Please think sir, Hocker's 5k strength is really his PED advantage!!!!!!!!!! Very disingenuous of him to put the blame on the 5k strength, unbelievable!!!!!
The start was a second and a half slower, the finish was a second faster. That’s not a lot slower, in fact that’s pretty much the same thing.
Don’t understand how Hocker is this underrated.
Its not "pretty much the same thing" to trade off a second slower finish with 1.5 seconds slower start.
Why I think he is overrated:
PB: 30:30.59
World ranking 2024: 8
World ranking 2023: 16
Races this year:
Team trials (1500) 3:30.59 1st
Prefontaine classic (mile) 3:48.95 7th
Notable races last year:
Diamond league, London 3:32.14 13th
Worlds (finals) 3:30.70 7th
Zurich diamond league 3:32.00 9th
Prefontaine classic (mile): 3:48.08 6th
Summary:
Two races at 3:30.x in his life.
Not above 6th in any international meet in his life.
Comparison with Nuguse:
8 vs 3 in event wins against Hocker
3:29.02 PB (over a second faster)
5th at worlds vs 7th
Two diamond league wins vs zero
Two second places in DL vs zero
Two third places in DL vs zero
One fourth place in DL vs zero.
Conclusion:
Given never placing better than 6th against international competition, being ranked at 8 this year and 16 last year any placement over 6th place would be overperforming. He could end up as best American, as anything could happen. Not a favorite. As Cole Hocker never have been a contender for the podium at any DL or worlds, he is not underrated when he isn't considered among the top.
Hocker's 3:30.59 is misleading. It was run in a championship, not a time-trialled, paced DL race. Nuguse has more wins, but his 1500m PB isn't from a major championship (US Trials for Americans are major championships). Hocker, time and again, consistently places in the top 10 globally (2024 indoors as well), which is a sign of consistent performance. The thing with rankings is that they fluctuate and aren't definitive of potential.
A few minutes ago, I started a thread with a bold quote from Sedjati aout how he's thinking of the WR in Paris. Well here is one from American Cole Hocker for the 1500.
“If I stay healthy, I don’t think anyone can beat me. Definitely not in America,” said Hocker in a David Woods feature for Dyestat.
Here is another quote that I"m making QOD.
“In 2021, I could not have run a sub-13-minute 5K. So I got my drawers blown off in the Olympic final,” he said. “I was holding on for dear life. And now I’m accelerating off of 3:32 pace. “And I think that comes from the 5K and not the 800.”
Hocker thinking he’s the best in the world in the 1500 because he ran a 12:58 is laughable. The guy who is the best 1500m runner in the world is also the two-time defending 5000m world champ. Hocker got dropped in the US 5000 champs. He is an aware that Jakob had to run 5 races too before winning his world titles, yes? And Josh Kerr, Jakob’s only legit rival, absolutely destroyed Hocker on his way to a 2 mile world indoor record this winter. Hocker wasn’t even in the shot when that raced finished. Hocker could plausibly get a bronze, but I’d put potato Tim, Nuguse, and Komen ahead of him personally. Hocker is a great runner and deserves credit for his back-to-back trials wins, but best in the world? He hasn’t shown anything to merit that kind of chatter.
Hocker is definitely in my second tier of guys who have a shot and have to be considered medal contenders. He's in there with Nuguse and Cheruiyot, just below Kerr and Ingebrigtsen.
My reservations with Hocker are, first, that he still hasn't broken 3:30. He had perfect pacing for 1300m at USAs and still only ran 3:30. If Nuguse led out Kerr and Ingebrigtsen for 1100-1300m at that pace, they'd both at least run 3:28. Second, Hocker still has no really good results against a top international field. He was never a factor in the finals at Tokyo or Budapest and his DL performances have been mediocre and he's been beaten comfortably by Kerr and Ingebrigtsen whenever they've raced over the last two years. Nuguse disappointed in Budapest but has some DL wins to his name and some fast top-3 finishes in DLs. Hocker's résumé is a lot thinner by comparison.
But both Nuguse and Hocker need to get out of the "top American" mindset. They're among the best of the best globally in the 1500, their rivals aren't domestic also-rans anymore.
Perfect pacing? 41.92/59.23/56.82/52.63 is not that. The slow second lap and overly fast last lap. There is zero chance Kerr and Jakob would put 1.6s or more on Hocker in the last 200 and run a 51.0 last lap with a sub-25 last 200. Yes Nuguse has the better resume but Hocker showed in this race he has a great kick now in a quicker race. We will see in a really quick race if it comes to that.
Hold my hands up to being wrong about the pacing, though he still had Nuguse doing the work for pretty much the whole race. In similar circumstances, I still give it to Kerr and Jakob, probably with Jakob taking it on lap 3 and running the finish out of Hocker. What should give everyone pause is that USAs didn't happen in a vacuum, we have seen him race numerous times this year and that kick hasn't been enough to either place well at Pre, take the win in a weak field at World Indoors, or even finish as top American in the 2 Mile at Millrose. As I said, he's in the mix, and I think he'll place better than he has at any previous champs, but not gold or silver. I actually think he needs to be more concerned about what's going on behind him rather than in front. Some of the other guys are running into form at the right time and on good day people like Hoare, Laros, and Nordas are in the mix as well
A few minutes ago, I started a thread with a bold quote from Sedjati aout how he's thinking of the WR in Paris. Well here is one from American Cole Hocker for the 1500.
“If I stay healthy, I don’t think anyone can beat me. Definitely not in America,” said Hocker in a David Woods feature for Dyestat.
Here is another quote that I"m making QOD.
“In 2021, I could not have run a sub-13-minute 5K. So I got my drawers blown off in the Olympic final,” he said. “I was holding on for dear life. And now I’m accelerating off of 3:32 pace. “And I think that comes from the 5K and not the 800.”
Hocker thinking he’s the best in the world in the 1500 because he ran a 12:58 is laughable. The guy who is the best 1500m runner in the world is also the two-time defending 5000m world champ. Hocker got dropped in the US 5000 champs. He is an aware that Jakob had to run 5 races too before winning his world titles, yes? And Josh Kerr, Jakob’s only legit rival, absolutely destroyed Hocker on his way to a 2 mile world indoor record this winter. Hocker wasn’t even in the shot when that raced finished. Hocker could plausibly get a bronze, but I’d put potato Tim, Nuguse, and Komen ahead of him personally. Hocker is a great runner and deserves credit for his back-to-back trials wins, but best in the world? He hasn’t shown anything to merit that kind of chatter.
Unfortunately you have reading comprehension problems. Nowhere does this say Hocker thinks he's the best in the world.
What he's quoted as saying is: " "I don’t think anyone can beat me. Definitely not in America” "
On a day where he's "on" he doesn't think he can be defeated. That doesn't make him the best in the world. There are days like Eugene, if he can string together 13x100m segments at a fast pace, he can absolutely throttle the last 200m. Someone might beat him. Maybe not. Isn't the point that at least he believes he can run a great race, even if no else does?
If he runs to the degree of his self-belief, rather than to your doubt, he's going to find confirmation that he is, indeed, rather unbearable. Otherwise there's absolutely no reason to train. No reason to race.
I mean you hit the nail on the head. I mean he has been a force since his time in high school and his resume speaks for itself, he should be respected.
I think he is finally coming into form with his age and training. Unfortunately, I believe he is peaking and in the next couple of years will start declining. So this is his year. He is confident, but I don’t think arrogant. I think any professional athlete needs to carry a degree of confidence, borderline arrogance. That’s how you stay mentally sharp. If you don’t think you’re the best, you have already lost the race.
Also, let’s stop with the racist stuff. The let’s run forum has nothing to do with race. Goose is amazing and has a strong shot, but I think if Hocker can stay close, Goose can’t stay with those wheels.
Help us build the best running shoe review site for a chance to win a LetsRun t-shirt.Help us build the best running shoe review site for a chance to win one of 10 LetsRun t-shirts.