Is Jake Whightman going to be "the next guy" again?

I believe the fastest Jakob has closed over the last 200m is ~26 seconds. Whightman's 1:44.1 is around this pace for a whole 800m, which is relevant.

That said, Whitman ran a 1:43.65 the year he beat Jakob, so while on track, I'd like to see him dip below 1:44 before I start to think him beating Jakob is reasonably plausible.

We also need to see Jakob race at all. 1:44.1 in May is plenty. It signals he will be 1:43 mid shape in August.

Correct.

1:44 is barely elite: over THREE SECONDS off the WR in the 800.

Meanwhile, Jakob is within TWO seconds of the WR in the 1500.

Wightman is not on the same level as Jakob.

He doesn't have to be though. He just needs to tuck in behind Jakob and let him do all the work and in the last lap sneak in for the win.

And I'm saying all this as a Jakob's fan, but he's just more vulnerable in the 1500 v.s 5k.

Not many remembers who win WC either. It's the Olympic Champions who is remembered.

I will tell you what is in your blind angle: The few runners who have beat Jakob the last 2 season´s won because they had Jakob as the pacemaker?

See how it went for Wightman in the Common Wealth 1500m final in 2022 and for Kerr in the DL Zürich 2023 1500m WHEN THEY HAVE NO PACERS.

He ran 1:43.65 in September, 2 months after he beat Jakob. The same year in May he ran 1:46 twice.

So either Jake peaked way too early this year, or he is in a truly beastly shape.

1:44 is elite speed for a 1500m runner. If Jake trained only for 800m this season, I'm sure he would medal with 1:43 mid in Paris.

Also, I suspect that Kerr and Jake (and maybe Nuguse) could dip under 3:29 in Paris and Jakob would have to run 3:27-3:28 in order to win. A tough task for someone who delt with an achilles injury this year.

You don't have any arguments, only vague pseudo psychological projections. Him wanting to win in a dominant fashion is not even close to him considering fcking OLYMPICS a clown race. Watch the last episode of Team Ingebrigtsen again and tell me with a straight face that Olympics is a clown race to him. Give me one quote where he says that his Silesia run was more important to him that his Olympics gold. You can't. All you do is project your infantile view of the sport on a person who happens to be good at time trialing.

“Very happy with winning the 5k, but for me its…I find it more important to do my best and I was not able to that in this championship because of obviously with the virus and everything. For me thats more important than winning medals.”

🥱

This is the last time I respond to you sub 90 iq brainlets so listen carefully: HIM WANTING TO REACH HIS FULL POTENTIAL AND RUN AS FAST AS HE CAN IS NOT THE SAME THING AS HIM THINKING THAT WORLDS AND OLYMPICS ARE CLOWN RACES. That is your own addition that has nothing to do with Jakob. The claim was that Jakob agrees with you and that other autist that olympics is a clown race. Your quote only shows that "doing his best" is more important to him that the medals. That is not the same thing as saying "medal races are clown races".

Well, “Snowflakes” answered very good here (by linking the Jakob interview). But of course it’s not black and white -you are obviously right when you claim that Jakob not only views the Olympics as a clown race. And yes, that win meant something to him. But you have to consider the context: Once it was really important to Jakob to beat Cheruiyot (Because he had never beaten him before). And once it was a dream come true to win the Olympics (because he never had won a global champs). And Jakob still admits it’s really important to win the WC 1500m (because he never has -so contrary to almost everyone WC is more important to him than the Olympics; he’s just honest).

But all that doesn’t mean he has changed his perspective (he repeats it in interviews): He needs to win championships because that’s a necessary thing to be considered the best. So in that perspective they are not clown races. But his main agenda is to be the best version of himself -meaning running so fast that he doesn’t need to care about who he beats, or about tactics or other people’s views. In that way his wins (also the champ ones) will merely be a byproduct of his shape -therefore this lack of interest in his competitors. -They’re just the next guys (he isn’t negative to others per ce; they just not concern him -he’s a (fast) runner, not a racer). And since it’s harder to run fast in the champs (especially a hot weather 5000m) these are clown races. But as I said still important and necessary…

Whitman and Whightman - could they be related to Wightman?

Except when they run the 800, when he's at least 2 seconds faster. Which means he can outsprint Jakob at the finish - as he has proved in a WC 1500 final. So he was on a higher level there over the 1500. As was Kerr a year later.

Quite a few of us remember Jakob losing WC finals. As I'm sure he also does.

I think you are intentionally missing the point. Jakob becomes the default pacer because he does not have enough to compete if the race is slow. So far, it's his fatal flaw.

What we are talking about is gimmicky are pace lights and ENTRANTS who have ZERO

I think you are intentionally missing the point. Jakob becomes the default pacer because he does not have enough to compete if the race is slow. So far, it's his fatal flaw.
What we are talking about is gimmicky are pace lights and ENTRANTS who have ZERO INTENTIONS of finishing the race.

How is having enter and drop out not gimmicky?

I saw on IG that Wightman is possibly entered into 800m in Stockholm on June 2nd. 1:43 incoming?

I think you take this way too literally -not good for your blood pressure. So listen: I think neither “snowflakes” nor I or Jakob regard the champs as only clown races. And I would be surprised if Jakob chooses to call them that…

Rudisha’s champs win in 2012 was obviously not a clown race. Nor Cheruiyot’s in 2019. And even Centro’s impressive performance in 2016 qualifies to the label “tactical masterpiece” instead of clownly..! And if a healthy Jakob had soloed a 3.27 in the last WC that also would required a respectful label…

My main point is this: Compared to a whole season of consistency and fast races, the champs get way too much prestige. Especially if there are factors of coincidence (very often) that determines the outcome. F.ex Jakob is in my view an all time great not because of his Olympic gold (that was coincidental because of the delay / covid) but very much because of his other races throughout the years. And Wightman is great, not because of his WC win, but because he PR’ed in that race, and pretty much matched Jakob’s season best. -Jake is great because he was not a one time hitter (that got tactically lucky). Jake won because he managed to build himself up to a excellent runner (contrary to the excellent racer he was when he won Oslo Diamond League in 2017.) Because Jake managed this masterpiece: A pb both in the 3000m and 800m in the same season! So Wightman is, just like Jakob, great because he is good, not because of a win (that he would have missed if f.ex Cheruiyot had been in his 2020 shape). The same with Kerr: Josh is not good because of his Oly bronze or WC gold (both mediocre runs), but because he in the indoor season showed that he had achieved a stamina that overshadows a random lucky win, and shows that he can really be something better than a lousy champ…

Oly and WC races are clown races and not at the same time -they are because of all the coincidentally non running things that surround them (f.ex tactics, not being boxed in, and so on -have nothing to do with running, or the best runner -more related to dart and video games). They are not (clown races) because they are important and not to come around. When it comes to Jakob he clearly (in wording) feels this dualism. But he hasn’t explicitly called them clown races. So maybe it’s 1-1 in this discussion if we have to limit it to what Jakob means. Not bad for an infantile poster like me..!