- a 2:17 male has no shot of making the team and it's a vacation for him. His opinion shouldn't matter.
Mark Conover (RIP) had no shot in 1988 with his meager 2:18 PB in his only attempt at the distance at the trials. But he won, so maybe he did have a shot.
Trent Briney (2:21) was 4th, Jenny Spangler (2:39) won a trials, Tera Moody, a relative nobody, was 5th, Christine Clark won the trials too.
2) Weak athletes who don't want to race if the sun so much as peeks out of the clouds.
Well done all!
Weak athletes? When you run a race do you look at the weather forecast and hope for good conditions? Why would you ever choose to run a race during the worst possible time of the day? That's the problem here. When races are in hot places, you run them in the best possible time. The Doha world championship marathon was run at night when it was the coolest possible temperatures. In Tokyo they moved it to northern Japan since Tokyo was too hot. Why are we making the US athletes run in not only a hot area, but also in the middle of the day? It makes no sense.
You choose to run this race if you want to be in the Olympics. Be a professional and stop crying about it. Pretty simple.
Doesn't this only have to do with central and west coast viewership? West coasters aren't going to get up at 5:00 AM and central people aren't going to get up at 6:00 to watch the race on NBC with all of its ads.
Weak athletes? When you run a race do you look at the weather forecast and hope for good conditions? Why would you ever choose to run a race during the worst possible time of the day? That's the problem here. When races are in hot places, you run them in the best possible time. The Doha world championship marathon was run at night when it was the coolest possible temperatures. In Tokyo they moved it to northern Japan since Tokyo was too hot. Why are we making the US athletes run in not only a hot area, but also in the middle of the day? It makes no sense.
You choose to run this race if you want to be in the Olympics. Be a professional and stop crying about it. Pretty simple.
Although I would be really bummed to have to race a bad weather marathon, especially one this important, I agree.
Sure, the selection of Orlando was a pure money grab and the noon start time as well, but these are the parameters set for all athletes competing.
People keep bringing up athlete safety. This is a false premise. There will be zero difference in athlete safety at 8:00am or 12:00pm. Yes athletes' comfort will be affected and so will overall times, but there won't be anyone going to the hospital because of a noon start. This drama was created by people looking for an easier experience and that's it.
Either you want to compete or you don't. Don't let weather be the reason you give up before the race even started.
1. To those who direct their ire at Max Siegel, all I can say is that he deserves it. I was involved in the national USATF organization for several years (I eventually left in disgust), and my take is that the current incarnation of the organization is a corrupt and dysfunctional as that of Ollan Cassell. After his legendary time of corruption ended, Craig Masback was a good CEO who worked to make USATF an honest organization, but it is now governed by the sport's version of Viktor Orban. A lot of the blame for the Trials Marathon trouble, along with most of the sport's organizational woes, can be laid directly at his feet and at the feet of his equally corrupt cronies.
2. As another poster noted, USATF is not a "regular" corporation. It's a non-profit corporation with authority derived from Congressional action, and is charged to act in the interest not of its shareholders (it doesn't have any) or of profit, but in the interest of the sport. Its actions should be judged by that standard.
3. To those who complain about 2:15-2:17 hobby joggers, weak athletes, or the inconvenience of watching the Trials live in the morning, get real. A 2:15 marathoner is a dedicated athlete, as much as a backup quarterback in the NFL. Athletes who prefer to put themselves on the line in weather conditions that are not likely to endanger their health are not weak. And the race is not designed for your convenience, but to select the best athletes for the Olympics.
4. An 8:00 start is better than a 12:00 start, due to the likely weather and in order to select a team in conditions most likely to mirror those of the Olympic Marathon. The move to 12:00 may have had a number of bases (kickbacks being one possibility), but TV viewership isn't a valid one. Just look at how much more coverage the Los Angeles Trials got because it was a "center of television" (i.e. none), which was a major excuse offered for ignoring the superiority and popularity of Houston's bid. Those who want to watch it will watch it at 8:00 as much as they will at noon.
5. As for costs, I can easily imagine various costs that would increase due to a change (I also worked with a major marathon for a number of years), but not $700,000 of them. The Trials won't be for months yet, so police schedules can be changed (they generally prefer an early start anyway, when there's less traffic to disrupt), equipment rentals can be revised (it would probably be delivered the day before anyway), etc. So absent details, I wouldn't give much credence to that figure.
6. In the end, I think an 8:00 start is the better option, and was from the beginning. Most of the athletes support it, they have valid reasons for doing so, I haven't heard any good reasons for a 12:00 start, and the athletes who end up on the podium would probably be the same as those with a later start. If there are added costs, take them from Max Siegel's salary.
This post was edited 12 minutes after it was posted.
Can this be correct that the local organizing committee pays the prize money?
Yes it is. Has been that way for awhile. I am curious if there is any data showing if any of the Organizing Committees turned a profit on hosting the Marathon Trials over the last several iterations. If so, which ones? I heard Atlanta TC lost a ton of money on the last trials.
Max Seigel - the corrupt, dictator that runs our sport - by fiat said the Trial will be Orlando for some reason, probably because they were willing to pay a $ fee to host it. They said, "Great, the race will be at 8 am." He said, "No it's non-negotiable, it' will be at 12 noon or you won't host it."
Robert needs to use better language.
I was about to say I wouldn't argue Max is corrupt or a dictator. But now I see Robert is I think pointing out Max put the Trials in a different location than was recommended by the Board in this case and I think the LRC in 2016. So if you want to call that being a dictator fine.
As for being corrupt I guess it depends on how you define it. I would like to hear more from the person who worked at USATF. But from what I Know, Max came from the Board of Directors into his CEO role. They are very compliant with whatever he wants to do and it looks like gave him a sweetheart contract where he seems to keep getting bonuses because of the Nike deal.
I wouldn't call that corrupt. I'm not sure of the right word. Shrewd? If you want to say it's not in the spirit of a non-profit and his pay is totally out of line with someone in a similar position fine. But is the Board giving him a ridiculous contract corruption? I would say only if he is giving them something in return.
If you want to argue there was corruption with the alleged self dealing with Max Siegel companies the fine.
It blows my mind that a man who makes $3 million + a year wouldn't realize that weather was going to be a very important factor for the Olympic marathon Trials. I mean within minutes of it coming out that Orlando was the host we were deep into a 10-year weather history research for Orlando.
if the free market determines that $3 million a year is a fair salary, then such condescending remarks about how much he earns is entirely inappropriate
Now i would argue USATF has horrific non-profit governance. Max's salary and bonus are way out of line for similar sized organization. The non-profit world has standards and norms that aren't being followed. There isn't a profit motive with USATF. It is given a monopoly essentially by the USOPC and Congress and it is using that to enrich the CEO that is wrong.
Yes. And these runners should get over it. What ever happened to the days of Meb and Deena training for the heat & humidity and then being rewarded with medals in Athens? Today’s runners are so soft.
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