Wouldn't upzoning increase the value of an individual piece of land (even though it would decrease the price of housing per sq ft)? I think people vote against this stuff because they're afraid of any change to their neighborhood. People almost always vote the status quo on local ballot measures if they don't think about the issue.
Absolutely it will. Which is why many people want to upzone: it makes economic sense. Too bad they’re blocked by their neighbors.
Yes, most people are afraid of change in their neighborhood. Nevermind that they were undoubtedly agents of change when they moved in decades ago. Many seem to think that a deed comes with a clause that freezes time when you move in.
The reason cities are so valued is because they are dynamic. Stifling change is harmful in the long run but absolutely enriches landowners in the medium term.
Many arguments against zoning reform are couched in economic arguments — you get a good mix of “neighborhood character” and “property values.” See: hypocrite Marc Andreesen’s recent protests about upzoning. “It’s time to build” yeah right.
Name 1 neighborhood in the history the USA that was made better by bringing in public housing.
The "diversity" is our strength people just had an absolute melt down because 50 dirty brown people showed up on Martha's Vineyard.
Destroy your own neighborhoods with your idiotic ideas.
Absolutely it will. Which is why many people want to upzone: it makes economic sense. Too bad they’re blocked by their neighbors.
Yes, most people are afraid of change in their neighborhood. Nevermind that they were undoubtedly agents of change when they moved in decades ago. Many seem to think that a deed comes with a clause that freezes time when you move in.
The reason cities are so valued is because they are dynamic. Stifling change is harmful in the long run but absolutely enriches landowners in the medium term.
Many arguments against zoning reform are couched in economic arguments — you get a good mix of “neighborhood character” and “property values.” See: hypocrite Marc Andreesen’s recent protests about upzoning. “It’s time to build” yeah right.
Name 1 neighborhood in the history the USA that was made better by bringing in public housing.
The "diversity" is our strength people just had an absolute melt down because 50 dirty brown people showed up on Martha's Vineyard.
Destroy your own neighborhoods with your idiotic ideas.
WTF 'public housing' are you talking about?
No, we need more market rate housing in desirable areas. This is basic libertarian property rights stuff. If I own land I should be able to develop it as I see fit, with exclusions for obviously harmful activities (industrial pollution, extreme noise, etc).
Grumpy homeowners who think their neighborhood should shop changing the instant they moved in don't get to tell everyone else what to do with their property.
Thankfully states are wisely stripping communities of the ability to over-regulate. Love to see government stepping in to defend individual rights!
Name 1 neighborhood in the history the USA that was made better by bringing in public housing.
The "diversity" is our strength people just had an absolute melt down because 50 dirty brown people showed up on Martha's Vineyard.
Destroy your own neighborhoods with your idiotic ideas.
WTF 'public housing' are you talking about?
No, we need more market rate housing in desirable areas. This is basic libertarian property rights stuff. If I own land I should be able to develop it as I see fit, with exclusions for obviously harmful activities (industrial pollution, extreme noise, etc).
Grumpy homeowners who think their neighborhood should shop changing the instant they moved in don't get to tell everyone else what to do with their property.
Thankfully states are wisely stripping communities of the ability to over-regulate. Love to see government stepping in to defend individual rights!
The problem is not just exclusionary zoning and nimbies. It's environmental regulations like CEQA and resistance to any development by environmental groups that challenge all projects in court. In states like CA the approval process is so lengthy and expensive it discourages a lot of market rate development, which just doesn't pencil in when all the costs are taken into account.
30-year fixed rate mortgages are at 6.25%. You will see a decrease in home prices very soon. December is the best month for buyers. Homebuying activity slows to a trickle and many sellers want the sale to be recorded in the current calendar year.
No, we need more market rate housing in desirable areas. This is basic libertarian property rights stuff. If I own land I should be able to develop it as I see fit, with exclusions for obviously harmful activities (industrial pollution, extreme noise, etc).
Grumpy homeowners who think their neighborhood should shop changing the instant they moved in don't get to tell everyone else what to do with their property.
Thankfully states are wisely stripping communities of the ability to over-regulate. Love to see government stepping in to defend individual rights!
The problem is not just exclusionary zoning and nimbies. It's environmental regulations like CEQA and resistance to any development by environmental groups that challenge all projects in court. In states like CA the approval process is so lengthy and expensive it discourages a lot of market rate development, which just doesn't pencil in when all the costs are taken into account.
For sure. CEQA is weaponized by NIMBYs such that a handful of homeowners can grind giant projects to a halt. Terrible law that thankfully is gaining support to be amended so it can't be used this way.
This is true. Many people in this segment got caught in the disappearance of jobs where you worked for the same employer for thirty years and retired with a nice pension. Their house became their retirement plan, e.g., sell it, move somewhere cheaper, and live off what's leftover after buying the cheaper place. Why wouldn't someone in such a situation think it's great that housing prices go up?
But there's also a segment of that population that doesn't want to move or who are already living in a place where houses don't cost as much as in other places. For them high house prices are a problem. They can't afford the higher property taxes that come with higher valuations. They can't afford to sell and move somewhere cheaper because they're already in a place considered cheap even if it's not cheap for them.
If you're going to allow things that serve basic human needs, housing and health care are prime examples, be run for profit, you're always going to have people struggling to have those things. I'm appalled at what rents and house prices have become in so many places. The best answer I can think of for someone struggling to buy or rent is to find a job you can do remotely and move somewhere that's fairly depressed, Rust Belt, rural Midwest, etc., and work from there.
Unfortunately, 75+% of jobs cannot be done remotely. You need to live relatively close to where you work. Teachers, construction workers, truck drivers, doctors and nurses, electricians, retail store employees, other service providers all must go to their place of employment. These jobs are available in expensive COL cities as well as cheaper small to medium size cities. Choices must be made, do you want to live in NYC or Dallas or Topeka Kansas? Guess which city is cheapest to live in. I have one son renting in Seattle and one son with nice house in KC. They both made choices.
Agree. And most people whose jobs don't pay enough to afford a house have jobs that can't be done remotely. And really, jobs in Topeka, Ks or my old hometown in western Pa. often don't pay enough to afford a house there even if the houses cost so much less.
Ironically, a primary residence is only an investment (in the strict financial sense) if you plan to downsize out of it. For example, someone buys a house in San Francisco and later sells it and buys another in Boise.
House owners mistakenly think that "My house went up in value." What really happened is every house in your area became more expensive. In theory, this is because your area became somehow more desirable. Given that you got a residence in a desirable area at a discounted price, there is no logical reason why you would sell it.
It's very silly to think of a house like some financial vehicle. As others have alluded to, Zillow/Redfin have stimulated this mentality that a house is like a bank account on public display, which has in turn stimulated demand for home ownership and driven up prices.
30-year fixed rate mortgages are at 6.25%. You will see a decrease in home prices very soon. December is the best month for buyers. Homebuying activity slows to a trickle and many sellers want the sale to be recorded in the current calendar year.
If that happens then the boomers will demand the central banks intervene to rescue their home values.
30-year fixed rate mortgages are at 6.25%. You will see a decrease in home prices very soon. December is the best month for buyers. Homebuying activity slows to a trickle and many sellers want the sale to be recorded in the current calendar year.
If that happens then the boomers will demand the central banks intervene to rescue their home values.
Life is a game and boomers won it
No, higher interest rates will "correct" the market, then people such as the OP will be able to find homes in their price range, then be priced out thanks to interest.
The home they are then able to buy will be less desirable than the one they wanted, which is what they could have done in the first place and been ahead financially. That's how this works, thank to human emotion.
If that happens then the boomers will demand the central banks intervene to rescue their home values.
Life is a game and boomers won it
No, higher interest rates will "correct" the market, then people such as the OP will be able to find homes in their price range, then be priced out thanks to interest.
The home they are then able to buy will be less desirable than the one they wanted, which is what they could have done in the first place and been ahead financially. That's how this works, thank to human emotion.
Ironically, a primary residence is only an investment (in the strict financial sense) if you plan to downsize out of it. For example, someone buys a house in San Francisco and later sells it and buys another in Boise.
House owners mistakenly think that "My house went up in value." What really happened is every house in your area became more expensive. In theory, this is because your area became somehow more desirable. Given that you got a residence in a desirable area at a discounted price, there is no logical reason why you would sell it.
It's very silly to think of a house like some financial vehicle. As others have alluded to, Zillow/Redfin have stimulated this mentality that a house is like a bank account on public display, which has in turn stimulated demand for home ownership and driven up prices.
But the point is that stimulated demand is only effective when there is scarcity. If SF started building 10,000 units of market rate housing every year prices would stop increasing and they would eventually even go down. The reason that doesn't happen is because current homeowners don't want that and they control the apparatus of the local government.
Of course there is also just a scarcity of available land, which is why real estate is expensive in pretty much every global city. But look at a city like Boulder or Aspen. Prices are not high because of lack of available land, but because development is restricted via restrictive zoning and other regulations.
I am the last-born boomer. I think housing prices going up and down is still best as long as when they go down like they always do at least adjusted terms, they go low enough for honest hard-working people to get a reasonable chance to get in when opportunity meets preparation, AKA they get lucky.
I don't mind socialist opinions on housing either, I just don't qualify as always wanting higher house prices.
Of course we don't want a bunch of cheap housing in our area. Cheap housing brings crime, people who have a dozen cars, people who live five to a household, single bros who want to party and make a lot of noise, people who don't take care of their homes, etc, etc, etc.
2. We'd be happier and healthier living in smaller flats and houses like Europe anyway. I used to live in Prague where a middle class family of four happily lives in 800 sqft. They get out and live.
Let me get this straight, you own 3 houses but you think I should just be happy living in an 800 sqft pod "like Europe"? No man. That's exactly the type of kicking-away-the-ladder attitude I'm talking about here
I get your point, but at least you'd be able to afford a place and use it to jump up the ladder. We need starter homes, not giant McMansions. I started with a 1500sqft house "starter" house in 2008 at the worst time possible for 170k, lost money on it a few years later, then bought a falling apart abandoned house that I rebuilt myself and lived in and made 250k on the eventual flip, and it just kind of rolled from there. A lot of hard times to get here and I am not going to apologize for my successes. Sweat equity, buy smart. And hope builders build better things for everyone.
30-year fixed rate mortgages are at 6.25%. You will see a decrease in home prices very soon. December is the best month for buyers. Homebuying activity slows to a trickle and many sellers want the sale to be recorded in the current calendar year.
30-year fixed rate mortgages are at 6.25%. You will see a decrease in home prices very soon. December is the best month for buyers. Homebuying activity slows to a trickle and many sellers want the sale to be recorded in the current calendar year.
Houses are becoming more unaffordable and there's a certain segment of the population, usually home-owners of a certain generation born circa 1946-64, who think it's great. Uhmmmmm no. Houses should be as CHEAP as possible. Stop celebrating others' inability to buy homes.
It wasn't easy when we bought in 1999. Paid $270K for a house that according to Zillow is now worth $655K. We owe $95K. That gives us 85% equity.
We used our heads, negotiated a small price reduction, then purchased the best house we could afford. That house has appreciated in value over the last 23 years.
30-year fixed rate mortgages are at 6.25%. You will see a decrease in home prices very soon. December is the best month for buyers. Homebuying activity slows to a trickle and many sellers want the sale to be recorded in the current calendar year.
Maybe. But at the same time, people may hold onto their houses a little tighter if the offers are lower, plus they may not be quick to move with higher rates.
Demand may go down but so would supply if people aren’t selling. Low inventory keeps prices up.
Prices dropped in 2008 because of foreclosures and a ton of homes becoming available for sale.
People have affordable mortgages with low rates. Rent is high and mortgages are high. Why would they sell now?
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