HS Girl track recruiting getting more serious - any insider insights this year Ivies / NESCAC

In some cases, yes. Particularly for a certain school in west-central Massachusetts. Process moves earlier every year. Especially with that SAT score support will be necessary at top tier NESCACs/may not be viable depending on her specific marks. 5:01 is very different than 5:09 for those schools. But you definitely need to be on coaches' radars before the summer and be ready to commit somewhere ED. The specifics of that timeline obviously varies by school and coach, but you lose a lot of your ability to control the process if you wait until RD and if you don't have a clear sense of your priorities when offers start coming in July/August, cuz doors could start closing soon after that. It rarely actually happens in XC/TF but in sports like Soccer and Lacrosse top NESCAC schools are done with their recruiting for rising seniors on July 10th. some track coaches are trying to get closer and closer to that kind of timeline each year.

Good put; in ‘our’ circumstance the use of unofficial visits really helped my daughter (now 2x D1 AA COVID soph) cull the herd and come to a better understanding of what she liked and didn’t like about various places. Interested parties ranged geographically from Palo Alto to New Haven w a bunch in-between, so there were some limitations on how much time and effort we could expend in that regard. However, it don’t take long for her to understand and prioritize her likes and dislikes before the recruiting ‘rodeo’ got busier. My other observation is that some parents like the buzz that comes with the process a little too much, and that can be distracting for some kids; I was very careful about what I ‘endorsed’ tacitly or otherwise.

Don't get discouraged by what a coach says about times, what they want and what they get in the final analysis is different.

Please link to those great liberal arts educations for 35k?

“Don't get discouraged by what a coach says about times, what they want and what they get in the final analysis is different.“

Ok, but be realistic about what certain times mean given other indicators of your child’s potential/upside. Our daughter (barely) broke 5:00 x1 in HS. But she also ran 2:10 and ~17:45xc as a soph in a low mileage program. There are a range of considerations that will determine a coach’s interest, including (as alluded to above) timing of the interest/offer. Other important question is ‘what conversation(s) have you had w your child’ and how set is she or he in what they want?

College rankings are overrated. My life is no better or worse having gone to a top NESCAC school than if I'd gone to a school like Saint Lawrence or Colgate.

The recruiting process is not that complicated. My SATs weren't awesome and I didn't show a history of community engagement or any of that stuff. I was just fast and hit the minimum academic requirements so I was in. If your daughter is 5:05 for the mile I think every NESCAC school would take her as long as she has the basic academics to satisfy admissions.

The Ivies will be interested, but she'll probably be a 2nd choice for them at this point. The Dartmouth coach recruited me and straight up told me "We're going after this 4:02 guy, if we don't get him we want you." NESCAC school came in and guaranteed me a spot straight up, so I took it.

Too much talk about education being comparatively "great" and not enough discussion of actual career outcomes or having enough time to pursue those career outcomes. Good luck making it to banking, consulting, tech, or most high prestige industries by choosing merit money over the prestige of the school.

I went to Lehigh and honestly was on the cusp of walk-on standards so I didn't bother. Lehigh was rigorous but the administration is a complete mess and I wouldn't recommend going there. Regardless, a huge portion of my frat star friend group, which includes me, was pulling $250k 5 years out of school.

Meanwhile the guys who made it to HYP-type career paths or my newer friends who actually attended HYP are comping $500k+ in jobs that sounds similar but ultimately are reserved for the kids who went to the actual top schools.

One example: I was once offered the same job as a buddy who went to MIT just to find his guaranteed comp was almost $100k higher than what was on the table for me. Glad I didn't take it but please believe me when I say this elitism will always exist in industries where you can make real money. There are dozens of small shops who "only hire women from the Harvard rowing team" and weird niches like that. If your daughter is given the opportunity to go to an Ivy and study something rigorous please don't squander lifetime earnings because you're scared of debt.

Academics or athletics, there’s no substitute for training w champions every day.

Ivy League is the top earning League with Patriot League a close 2nd. NESCAC is not close.

Your experience will be better at a Patriot League school because Ivy League is elitist and smug. If you aren't a celebrity, your child will be excluded from most social groups on campus. The teams are cut-throat and teammates aren't friends with each other, especially on the women's team.

If your son or daughter isn't in the top 7, they will be ignored at Ivy League school. I had a head coach tell my son that all 4 years of his coaching would be with a volunteer assistant, he wasn't fast enough for the head coach to write workouts for him.

It's even worse for the women, where the turnover rate is insanely high. If you get injured, you are basically off the team. Instead of trying to rehab a 4:50 miler, they can just recruit one and then you're off the team.

My daughter went to Princeton - not as an athlete although she was an All State crew performer. She had 1600 on SAT's - 13 5's on AP exams - National Merit Finalist - the whole nine yards. I don't know where this came from as I was merely a decent student, as was my wife. I think her education was excellent but I have little doubt she would have done just as well in life as UVA. I think what matters is just how competent you are, and whether you can get the most out of the place you choose. I don't regret the money spent on Princeton because it made her happy, but I can't say it was a particularly good value. I was admitted to Princeton in the late 70's and dearly wanted to go (I was fast enough to be recruited and won a big national high school race), but my well off father had completely abandoned the family so no financial aid was available. I was caught up in the prestige factor of Princeton for years but on reflection I think there are any number of places you can succeed.

Wouldn't your daughter be happier with $300k in her bank account?

You made 500k 5 years out of college what is your degree? I work in IT and that is insane money.

How much leeway do high academic schools have in getting runners they want through admissions who would have otherwise not gotten in? After watching Operation Varsity Blues, I get the impression a lot. Anyone got a real life example?

She does know she'll have to practice 6AM or earlier most days as a college runner too?

To be absolutely clear I did not make $500k 5 years out of school. I'm self-employed now so my experience from 2021 and beyond isn't relevant. I'd go as far as saying that if you work in "tech" or "finance" in a major city and aren't scratching $250k by years 5-7 you are doing something wrong.

You can trawl WallStreetOasis or r/cscareerquestions to see what people at established companies are really making. It's eye-opening. You'll notice the term "target school" tossed around a lot... that's the crux of my contribution here. If you study something rigorous at a top school and are willing to put the time in, you win. Parents get too miserly about the upfront cost of school and miss this completely.

Sorry, but this is just a raft of over the top BS. (And unlike a lot of people on these boards, it takes a lot for me to begin a post like that.)

Nothing whatsoever against the Patriot League or any of its schools. Great conference with multiple great schools. I've had athletes go to several of them, do very well, and have a great experience. And went on to be extremely gainfully employed.

But enough with the out of control trashing of the Ivy League and it's schools. First of all, the Ivy League is not a school. It's a conference of schools. Many differences and options academically, athletically, and culturally. Stop lumping them all together into one big bucket of horse manure. Because that's what some of your posts are.

I've also had athletes go to several of the Ivies. By no means are they all "elitist and smug." By no means will a kid who's not the child of a celebrity "be excluded from most social groups on campus." Simply horse manure. Especially if you try to brand all Ivies with that.

Are some Ivy League teams extremely competitive and in some cases cutthroat? Sure, of course. But that's no different than a great many of other schools' teams. The recruit needs to do his/her homework on the team culture. If you want a backstabbing cutthroat environment, you can find it. If you want a cohesive and supportive environment you can find that too.

Same applies to being outside of the top seven -- to a degree. If an athlete is repeatedly injured, not making progress, and not showing hopeful signs, then naturally they're not going to get as much attention from the coach. Are there some Ivy coaches who are too quick to cast aside? Sure. But again, that's no different than countless other coaches, in both D1 and D3 schools. But to tar every Ivy League coach with that brush is simply wrong.

This is a good and useful discussion which could actually be very helpful to a lot of high school athletes and their parents. Let's try to keep it that way.

If you just want to rail on about how much you hate the Ivy League, start your own thread on that subject. You'll probably get some takers. But not people who are actually looking for accurate and helpful input.

I had a daughter run at Princeton and her boyfriend ran at another Ivy League school. I don't want to say the boyfriend's school because it would be too easy to look up who they are.

Her boyfriend was one of the slower runners on the team. The only time the head coach talked to him was getting him to pace the faster runners in workouts or races.

My daughter ran in the 10:30s in the 3200 in high school on low mileage. Her freshman year her volume nearly doubled. They raced in practice and she got hurt, along with many of her teammates. Just look at any Ivy League roster and there's tons of women with fast high school times that only ran 4-5 races (or less) their entire 4 years. My daughter was miserable and quit after 3 years because of the coach and the team culture.

Those students wear the most expensive clothes. If you can't afford those clothes, they give you dirty looks and you are chastised. They are absolutely obsessed with status, this is a documented fact - look at organizations like the Skull and Bones society.

Hi your daughter should definitely check out midd. They have a great team and Nicole and Bruce have done a great job of constantly working with the athletes to make sure that each person is being challenged and the training best suits to needs of the athletes. They do a great job there of balancing athletics with academics and having a good time

Buy a copy of the book “The game of life”. It’s written by a former Princeton president and very clearly lays out the SAT point advantage by sport and for different types of schools