Ranking WI collegiate distance programs

So many DIII guys run the same pace for XC as their 5k track times. DIII should make the XC courses 8k instead of 7.8k.

I feel poorly for the person who put this list together, but you really should have gone all in on the mistake and listed all the other teams times. It wouldn’t change our opinion that it’s stupid to make an XC performance list, but at least we couldn’t fault you for being lazy too...

Both of these posts about Rombough are false. According to Mankato's website, Rombough's experience as a coach does meet the minimum requirements. He has 8 years of coaching (3 at Minnesota, 1 in HS, 2 at UW-RF, 2 at Mankato).

But, what has he accomplished in those 8 years as a coach? 3 years as a volunteer are kind of subjective, how much work did he really do there? 1 year in HS is also not helpful. Kind of hard to spin finishing dead last both years for men and women while being a co-head xc coach. He has done slightly better at Mankato as an associate head xc coach, qualifying one man for the NCAA XC meet.

Aside from his lackluster resume, I have heard from several people that he is rather creepy with women runners, even dated an athlete on the Minnesota team while volunteering. So although he is technically "qualified", not all great runners are great coaches, and Chris Rombough is a perfect example of this.

The above posted list has sparked my interest in taking a look at some historical figures. As mentioned by several other trackies, xc times are subjective. Every course is different, they are not all measured correctly, sometimes the weather is favorable or nasty, etc, etc. The point is, xc is about place, not time. But track racing is very measurable.

Now, not every school has a top 10 list, so the list I am posting is not an all-time performance list, but it is a list of the top 10 runners from each school over the past 10 years.

Explaining the list:

-List is comprised of athletes whose careers ended in 2009-Present, including current runners

-With that, accolades for '09 graduates extend to their entire collegiate career (Pre 2009)

-All-American Status was changed in 2013, to include second team (Placing 9-16), and honorable mention (Placing 17+ at nationals), XC All-American I believe is top 40 (correct me if Im wrong). It is entirely possibly that there are some errors in here -- DONT BE A JERK-- feel free to add or clean it up for me.

-List only includes track times from primary disciplines, no xc times

-It is possible that I missed an athlete who should be a top 10 athlete, again, --DONT BE A JERK-- make an addition or subtraction

-WIAC Schools- Only included accolades related to nationals, so AA and Nat'l Champs as those are harder to attain than Conference titles

-DI/DII Schools- Put an emphasis on Regional appearances and Conference titles

-Athletes are subjectively placed in order of accolades while considering PR's

-List is in Alphabetical order, going DIII/DII/DI

-Badgers have like 20-30 guys worth listing, not really interested in putting a list together for them, maybe you can if you would like

Eau Claire

1. Josh Thorson: 8:11/14:07, 4xDIII Nat’l Champ, 9xAA

2. Darin Lau: 8:19/14:13/29:15, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ, 15xAA

3. Aaron Easker: 3:50/14:18/29:33, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ (Relay), 6xAA

4. Chris Wirtz: 8:56SC, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ, 2xAA

5. Thomas Breitbach: 14:09/29:49, 4xAA

6. Nick Petersson: 8:17/14:24/30:10, 7xAA

7. Ryan Mugan: 30:30, 4xAA

8. Matt Scott: 1:51/3:47/8:20/14:18, 3xAA

9. Jeremy Kieser: 8:32/14:34/9:02SC, 3xAA

10. Matt Cooper: 1:52/3:49, 3xAA

Other Notables:

Jake Zander: 3:50, 2xAA, Wes Fischer: 1:50, 2xAA, Christian Leitner: 30:34, 2xAA, Kyler Lueck: 1:51/3:50, 2xAA, Patrick Treacy: 3:56/8:30, 2xAA

La Crosse

1. David Stilin: 1:50/3:48/14:20, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ (Relay), 6xAA

2. Cyrus Mason: 48/1:49, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ (Relay), 9xAA

3. Jacob Peterson: 3:49/14:32, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ (Relay), 6xAA

4. Ian Ewers: 8:34/9:05SC, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ, 3xAA

5. Sean Royer: 1:50, 6xAA

6. Andrew Rohlman: 8:33/9:04SC, 5xAA

7. Sam Hinz: 1:51/3:50, 5xAA

8. Tom Linner: 1:52/3:49, 5xAA

9. Paul Zdroik: 3:53/8:57SC, 4xAA

10. Thomas Schultz: 14:34/30:12, 4xAA

Other Notables:

Josh Dedering: 8:32/14:28/30:12, 3xAA, Joe Hinz: 1:51, 3xAA, Jerry Kerska: 1:53/3:49, 3xAA, Garrett Kerska: 1:53/3:50, 3xAA, Dallas Vincent 3:49/14:26 AA, Paul Moran: 30:16, AA, Alex Ciesielski: 14:30/30:17, 2xAA, Nate Routhier 8:22/14:31, 2xAA

Oshkosh

1. Willy Kaul: 8:16/14:07/29:38, 5xDIII Nat’l Champ, 13xAA

2. McKena Ramos: 1:50/3:45, 2xDIII Nat’l Champ, 5xAA

3. Nate Stymiest: 3:51/14:23, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ (Relay), 5xAA

4. Roberto Lara: 3:47/4:08, 6xAA

5. Joe Zack: 1:51/3:50/4:09, 5xAA

6. Jordan Carpenter: 8:31/14:33/8:56SC, 3xAA

7. Andrew McGuire: 3:51/8:35/9:09SC, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ (Relay), 3xAA

8. Sean Kutz: 14:21/29:58, 3xAA

9. John DeWitt: 8:35/14:43/30:05, 3xAA

10. Justin Skinkis: 1:52/4:17, 2xAA

Platteville

1. Ian Le Mere: 8:12/13:54/28:38, 6xDIII Nat’l Champ, 16xAA

2. Patrick Klein: 1:52/4:06/8:26, 4xAA

3. Jason Garvens: 14:37/30:12, 3xAA

4. Zach Lee: 1:52/3:50, 2xAA

5. Joel Walden: 4:12/8:27, 2xAA

6. Walker Rynes: 14:21/30:20, 2xAA

7. Jason Henkins: 1:52

8. Nate Petesch: 1:53/14:22/30:41

9. Jason Winchel: 14:40/30:36

10. Matt Smaga: 14:46

Stevens Point

1. Dan Sullivan: 1:50/3:46/4:07, 3xDIII Nat’l Champ, 9xAA

2. David Litsheim: 1:50/4:10, 6xAA

3. Adam Lang: 1:51, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ (Relay), 3xAA

4. Phil Richert: 14:35/30:47, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ (Relay), 2xAA

5. Michael Evans: 1:50/4:14, 2xAA

6. Dom Meyer: 30:33, 2xAA in XC

7. Neil Pedersen: 4:08/8:29, 1xAA

8. Joel Heroux: 8:35/15:03, 1xAA in XC

9. Terry Witkowski: 30:43, 1xAA in XC

10. Sean Hasenstein: 30:19

Stout

1. Tim Nelson: 8:15/13:57/29:35, 4xDIII Nat’l Champ, 7xAA

2. Patrick Jenkins: 8:17/14:21/29:51, 12xAA

3. Paul Van Grinsven: 8:29/14:30/8:57SC, 4xAA

4. Tony Cass: 8:23/14:30, 2xAA

5. Peter Johnston: 8:44/15:13, 1xAA in XC

6. Mitch Easker: 14:51/30:33

7. Tyler Ellefson: 3:57/14:59

8. Matt Message: 1:53

9. Andrew Gilles: 1:54

10. Mike Friedman: 4:24/8:40

Whitewater

1. Dawson Miller: 3:51/8:18/14:27/8:46SC, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ, 8xAA

2. Aron Kehoe: 1:52/3:55, 1xDIII Nat’l Champ, 2xAA

3. Brian Butzler: 3:47/4:08/8:23/14:21, 5xAA

4. Brett Harms: 8:32/9:06SC, 2xAA

5. Anthony Urbanski: 1:51, 1xAA (Relay)

6. Brakken Kraker: 1:53, 1xAA (Relay)

7. Jeremie Bogard: 1:50

8. Brian Kuehl: 1:52

9. Jonah Nelson 3:52

10. Alec Meixelsperger: 1:53/3:55

Parkside

1. Armando Torres: 8:31/14:24/29:55, 4xAA

2. Evan Lewandowski: 8:29/14:24, 3xAA

3. Ben Orvold: 14:20/29:47, 2xNat’l Qualifer

4. Jake Dubnicka: 8:36/14:44, 1xAA in XC

5. Patrick Niyork: 8:34/14:36, 1xGLVC Champ

6. Brock Eves: 3:54/14:30

7. Jesus Escareno: 8:36/9:08SC

8. Trevor Legg: 3:54/14:47

9. Sean Wagner: 1:54

10. Ron Hedman: 1:55/4:22

Marquette

1. Kyle Winter: 48/1:49, Big East Champion, Regional Qualifier

2. Spencer Agnew: 3:46/4:05, Regional Qualifier

3. Nick Szczech: 14:13/29:29, Regional Qualifier

4. Peter Bolgert: 3:49/8:54, Regional Qualifier

5. Jack Hackett: 4:06/8:09/14:05/29:50, Regional Qualifier

6. Alec Miller: 1:50/3:48

7. Brad Eagan: 1:52/3:48

8. Aric Miller: 1:52/4:09

9. Blake Johnson: 14:26/29:50/9:05SC

10. Patrick Maag: 8:22/14:35/30:13

Milwaukee

1. Marcus Paulson: 3:49/8:18/14:31, 4xHorizon League Champion

2. Caleb Abfall: 4:08/8:29/8:59SC, Regional Qualifier

3. Tony Sustachek: 1:53/3:54, 2xHorizon League Champion

4. Drew Dueck: 1:53, Horizon League Champion

5. John Simons: 3:53/8:31/14:32

6. Noah Tagliapietra: 8:32/14:32

7. Jake Reilly: 3:50/8:29/14:36

8. Ryan Weir: 1:51, Horizon League Champion (Relay)

9. Terry McMillan: 4:10/8:29/9:08SC

10. Alex Cotter: 1:53/3:52

10 years is a pretty large chunk of recent history, and gives us some context on the state of these teams. Based on the lists above (and or any extra information), how would you rank these teams, and why? Have fun.

The only thing wrong with it is that All-American (for D3 at least) is scoring at nationals. So a bunch of guys who are listed as like 5xAA should really be 1xAA, 4xNatties Qualifier. Solid post though, thanks for putting the time in to come up with that. Women’s list next?

Thank you for the 10 year lists, I'm sure that took a while to do. I agree that the last 10 years is a beautiful litmus test to evaluate the strengths of each program. I am going to list 3 sets of rankings, take it for what its worth.

Ranking I: 10 year program record performance list

1. Marquette: 1:49/3:46/8:09/8:54SC/14:05/29:29

2. Eau Claire: 1:50/3:47/8:11/8:56SC/14:07/29:15

3. Platteville: 1:52/4:06mi/8:12/9:32SC/13:54/28:38

4. Oshkosh: 1:50/3:45/8:16/8:56SC/14:07/29:38

5. Stout: 1:53/4:12mi/8:15/8:57SC/13:57/29:35

6. Whitewater: 1:50/3:47/8:18/8:46SC/14:21/30:11

7. La Crosse: 1:49/3:48/8:22/8:57SC/14:20/30:12

8. Milwaukee: 1:50/3:49/8:18/8:59SC/14:31/31:18

9. Stevens Point: 1:50/3:46/8:29/9:12SC/14:35/30:19

10. Parkside: 1:54/3:54/8:29/9:08SC/14:20/29:47

Ranking II: Total Program Accolades

1. Eau Claire: 6 National Champions, ~65+ All-Americans

2. La Crosse: 2 National Champions, ~70+ All-Americans

3. Marquette: 1 Big East Champion, 5 NCAA DI West Regional Qualifiers

4. Oshkosh: 7 National Champions, ~45+ All-Americans

5. Platteville: 6 National Champions, ~29 All-Americans

6. Stevens Point: 4 National Champions, ~27 All-Americans

7. Stout: 4 National Champions, ~26 All-Americans

8. Whitewater: 2 National Champions, ~19 All-Americans

9. Parkside: ~8 All-Americans

10. Milwaukee: 7 Horizon League Champions, 1 NCAA DI West Regional Qualifier

Ranking III: Efficiency and athlete development (what you produce with what you get)

1. Platteville

2. Stout

3. Eau Claire

4. Oshkosh

5. La Crosse

6. Stevens Point

7. Parkside

8. Whitewater

9. Marquette

10. Milwaukee

Ranking II is probably the best measure of these schools. Combining lists II+III is a good educational piece for HS looking to run in college. Surprising that these aren't all the same, but you can see a noticeable trend. Best times, doesn't mean best program.

visit the cities listed. most of those places are terribly boring. i'd say lacrosse or milwaukee for living-running combo

whitewater is depressing. so is eau claire

Winning baby nationals is okay, but being a d3 all american is not an accolade. You guys glorify a lot of these d3 heroes. The reality is, only a handful of wiac guys could even qualify for the ncaa d1 regional meet. By my count, Eau Claire could have qualified 4 guys to the west region over the past 10 years, thats solid. But places like LaCrap would only get 2.

Marquette has qualified 6 athletes. Go ahead and scoff, ha ha ha, Marquette blows, nelson sucks, blah blah blah. You say we're fake d1, but if we got moved down to d3, you guys would get murdered, it wouldn't be 10xaa, it would be 10xnational title from my boys. We would rack up so many points each year that all of your fluff 6th and 8th place aa's you guys glorify would evaporate.

Yes Marquette is better than the Wisconsin schools. Marquette is D1. That’s like arguing that a guy is fast because he can beat a fast girl.

One thing you guys got right about these lists is where Milwaukee and Parkside sit.

It is totally unacceptable for Parkside to have a crappy team. They have Footlocker regionals every year on their course. You find a couple guys a year?

This also applies to Milwaukee. Your season is over by that time, and you are what like 40 miles away? This is pathetic, you guys should be better than the div. 3 state schools without spending a dime. You guys have scholarships and are located in a city and still can't get anything together.

Not fit to lead wrote:

Rombough had 1 year at U of M, 2 years at UW-River Falls, and 2 years at Mankato. I doubt he'd leave his current position, though. Seems to be building it up nicely.

Both of these posts about Rombough are false. According to Mankato's website, Rombough's experience as a coach does meet the minimum requirements. He has 8 years of coaching (3 at Minnesota, 1 in HS, 2 at UW-RF, 2 at Mankato).

But, what has he accomplished in those 8 years as a coach? 3 years as a volunteer are kind of subjective, how much work did he really do there? 1 year in HS is also not helpful. Kind of hard to spin finishing dead last both years for men and women while being a co-head xc coach. He has done slightly better at Mankato as an associate head xc coach, qualifying one man for the NCAA XC meet.

[/quote]

150% false. Ive actually been on his teams before and this is absolutely positively false. Aside from NOTHING you've said being based in fact or personal experiences, its just a $hitty, dangerous thing to spread rumors like that and you are a $hit person for it. Also, he's qualified individuals for nationals at every school he's been at and produced multiple school record holders.

Also, f*cking race me ya slow piece of $hit

^quotes didn't work. My passage starts at "150%"

[3.1]Miles Davis wrote:

Not fit to lead wrote:

Rombough had 1 year at U of M, 2 years at UW-River Falls, and 2 years at Mankato. I doubt he'd leave his current position, though. Seems to be building it up nicely.

Both of these posts about Rombough are false. According to Mankato's website, Rombough's experience as a coach does meet the minimum requirements. He has 8 years of coaching (3 at Minnesota, 1 in HS, 2 at UW-RF, 2 at Mankato).

But, what has he accomplished in those 8 years as a coach? 3 years as a volunteer are kind of subjective, how much work did he really do there? 1 year in HS is also not helpful. Kind of hard to spin finishing dead last both years for men and women while being a co-head xc coach. He has done slightly better at Mankato as an associate head xc coach, qualifying one man for the NCAA XC meet.

150% false. Ive actually been on his teams before and this is absolutely positively false. Aside from NOTHING you've said being based in fact or personal experiences, its just a $hitty, dangerous thing to spread rumors like that and you are a $hit person for it. Also, he's qualified individuals for nationals at every school he's been at and produced multiple school record holders.

Also, f*cking race me ya slow piece of $hit[/quote]

Welcome to the thread Chris!

Chris Rombough is a great guy and I can't believe anybody on here is posting nonsense about him.

visit the cities listed. most of those places are terribly boring. i'd say lacrosse or milwaukee for living-running combo

whitewater is depressing. so is eau claire

How the hell can you lump Whitewater and Eau Claire together? Whitewater is a suitcase campus. Eau Claire has the most bars per capita in the entire US and is a huge party school. The university is wrapped around the Chippewa River and is consistently named Wisconsin's most beautiful campus.

Marquetter wrote:

Yes Marquette is better than the Wisconsin schools. Marquette is D1. That’s like arguing that a guy is fast because he can beat a fast girl.

Except they're not better than that fast girl. La Crosse was better than they were last year to begin with, and now with Marquette graduating both Millers and losing Eagan for this year (some sort of internship is what I heard) and not replacing them in recruiting, it won't even be that close.

[3.1]Miles Davis wrote:

Not fit to lead wrote:

Rombough had 1 year at U of M, 2 years at UW-River Falls, and 2 years at Mankato. I doubt he'd leave his current position, though. Seems to be building it up nicely.

Both of these posts about Rombough are false. According to Mankato's website, Rombough's experience as a coach does meet the minimum requirements. He has 8 years of coaching (3 at Minnesota, 1 in HS, 2 at UW-RF, 2 at Mankato).

But, what has he accomplished in those 8 years as a coach? 3 years as a volunteer are kind of subjective, how much work did he really do there? 1 year in HS is also not helpful. Kind of hard to spin finishing dead last both years for men and women while being a co-head xc coach. He has done slightly better at Mankato as an associate head xc coach, qualifying one man for the NCAA XC meet.

150% false. Ive actually been on his teams before and this is absolutely positively false. Aside from NOTHING you've said being based in fact or personal experiences, its just a $hitty, dangerous thing to spread rumors like that and you are a $hit person for it. Also, he's qualified individuals for nationals at every school he's been at and produced multiple school record holders.

Also, f*cking race me ya slow piece of $hit[/quote]

Chris,

You're really going to take credit for qualifying ben b and hassan to nationals? Congrats on getting a guy to finish 35th at the division 3 regional meet. They probably felt so bad for you and that guy that they let him into the national meet. Also, its common knowledge that you dated a girl from the team while "coaching" at minneosta. I really hope you have changed your ways the past couple of years, because dating an athlete is now considered sexual abuse.

I really wish there was a all-Wisconsin colleges XC meet. It could be at Parkside or Madison. This would really help settle the score between fan bases of these schools.

I know that it’s unlikley to happen, and even if it did, some schools would not run their “A” squad, but it would be cool to see some statewide participation and the final result.

I don’t understand how it is possible that anyone in their right mind can rank Marquette ahead of Milwaukee. Look at the number of conference titles Milwaukee has won compare to the number Marquette has won.