So it is because he's honest about taking a peptide to avoid surgery instead lying to people and saying he did the usual nonsense you'll hear from athletes talking about how they got over their injury? Mind you this peptide he took has a very short half life so even if he was a Olympic athlete in the wada testing pool chances are he would've never tested positive for it. It seems a lot of people are more mad about him being honest than anything else.
Oh no, do you think the only cheating he's admitted to is the peptide?
"It seems a lot of people are more mad about him being honest than anything else."
Yeah that's what we are mad about, we're mad that he was honest. Because as long as your honest then the rules don't apply to you right? A hyperbolic example would be someone admitting to murder, would you say we are just mad they are honest then? Maybe we are upset that what they did is wrong?
Don't do mental gymnastics too hard for this Cam Hanes guy, you might have to go source some peptides.
Not only did Cam admit to taking BPC-157, but he also admitted to using TRT and in that same original comment thread one point stated "many age groupers like myself are on hormone therapy", clearly admitting to continuing to take hormones (presumably HGH since he denies taking TRT currently). I don't trust that he stopped taking TRT either- as I understand it, once you start taking synthetic testosterone, your body stops being able to produce it naturally, so presumably you're basically hooked to the TRT pharma industry.
BPC-157 is not solely responsible for this 58 year old who'd run 2:50-2:58 for his whole life suddenly running a 2:39... If whatever cocktail he's on can take that much time off a mediocre marathoner, just imagine what kinds of times former 2:20-2:30 marathoners could be running at 58- 2:10-2:20s?? I think we've gotten used to elites microdosing these powerful drugs so that they don't get caught by running obviously doped up times, but this guy isn't even hiding it and now he's running the age graded equivalent of a 2:10.
He has all the telltale signs of TRT/HGH use- waxy red skin (increased RBC production- TRT is basically EPO), distended belly (insulin disregulation, "bubble gut"), visible vascularization, and even just eyeballing his jawline, this does not look like the guy in his old photos from his blog (jaw bone continues to grow with HGH use, see Sylvester Stallone). It's like when the doctor asks you how much alcohol you drink and you tell him half the honest amount- no way this guy is only on peptides
Oh no, do you think the only cheating he's admitted to is the peptide?
"It seems a lot of people are more mad about him being honest than anything else."
Yeah that's what we are mad about, we're mad that he was honest. Because as long as your honest then the rules don't apply to you right? A hyperbolic example would be someone admitting to murder, would you say we are just mad they are honest then? Maybe we are upset that what they did is wrong?
Don't do mental gymnastics too hard for this Cam Hanes guy, you might have to go source some peptides.
even less hyperbolic examples are obvious for these toddlers - when you find out I cheated during our monopoly game are you mad that I cheated you or are you mad that I was honest about my cheating?
Finn considers himself philosophically inclined yet can’t make a firm stand on this issue about an unintelligent roid user. That’s pathetic. I guess if you want to be an influencer and race director you can’t say anything bad about them? Though I’m not surprised about Finn. He interviewed nick bare at wser now that’s pathetic as well.
He ran 2:58 at Eugene in 2023 and 2024. You do not go from 2:58 to 2:39 at age 58. It just doesn't happen. Never. If you are running 2:58 in your mid 50s, you are going to be struggling to break 3 at 58, even with the best training of your entire life.
You don’t know. we all age different. Some better than others. Cam takes good care of himself.
Absolutely no one goes from 2:58 to 2:39 between age 55 and 58 by taking care of themselves. It's barely conceivable that TRT, EPO, HGH and a peptide stack will get you there. Precious Roy's point is the same question that I can't get past. If you're not an experienced runner in your mid-50s, you may not grasp how impossible that performance jump is.
If I was unethical and was making a lot of money from my social media, I would take everything under the sun, but only reveal that I was taking the most monetizable substance after a highly improbable performance
Can someone tell me what is ethically wrong about a hobby jogger trying some peptides to avoid surgery. Oh because Olympic athletes can't take it? Last i checked he's a hobby jogger and not someone competing at the Olympics. People had their minds made up on cam before this certain runner made it a big deal. That's why we're not seeing a honest discussion here about the ethics of/or enforcement of wada rules(most ultras of which are not subject under) for recreational runners. I think so far Zach bitter has had the best nuance take of this subject. And we can be naive here because he's open about it, but I wouldn't be shocked if 25 to 50 percent of hobby joggers over the age of 40 have taken or are on something banned by wada. Especially when we're talking about certain injuries that could put a runner off to the sideline for a year and in America the average person doesn't have the best health insurance to take care of certain injuries on top of working full time. I'm sure one major result in this debacle is you're going see even more hobby joggers take peptides now. Because until this happened I had no idea there's stuff like BPC that can heal injuries that used to take surgery to do.
The core of endurance competition is not about erasing reality, but about operating honestly within the constraints of one's biology, such as age, injury, and physical limitation. Hanes age and injuries is a constraint but so are everyone else's. While athletes may seek medical optimization to recover or feel 'normal,' competition requires a shared set of rules to maintain fairness. Let’s be real he was taking a lot more to get that kind of performance.
A lot of these influencers talk about having grit as just doing hard work (a lot easier when working around the constraints of one's biology). True grit is found in adapting to these real-world constraints, rather than using prohibited enhancements to circumvent them. When an athlete relies on banned substances while racing, they shift the competition from a test of human effort to a display of medical intervention, which undermines the integrity of the sporting result. It is unfair to everyone who is.
I don’t care if someone wants to race using PEDs to test their own performance, but they are operating outside their own constraints (recovery time, age, muscle mass, blood volume, red blood cell count, etc.) pretending it is hard work and grit and not 1000’s of dollars of pharmaceuticals. The sport will become a circus.
Can someone tell me what is ethically wrong about a hobby jogger trying some peptides to avoid surgery. Oh because Olympic athletes can't take it? Last i checked he's a hobby jogger and not someone competing at the Olympics. People had their minds made up on cam before this certain runner made it a big deal. That's why we're not seeing a honest discussion here about the ethics of/or enforcement of wada rules(most ultras of which are not subject under) for recreational runners. I think so far Zach bitter has had the best nuance take of this subject. And we can be naive here because he's open about it, but I wouldn't be shocked if 25 to 50 percent of hobby joggers over the age of 40 have taken or are on something banned by wada. Especially when we're talking about certain injuries that could put a runner off to the sideline for a year and in America the average person doesn't have the best health insurance to take care of certain injuries on top of working full time. I'm sure one major result in this debacle is you're going see even more hobby joggers take peptides now. Because until this happened I had no idea there's stuff like BPC that can heal injuries that used to take surgery to do.
To follow on to your point, lots of runners have disposable income, so it is possible this trend could accelerate the purchases of peptides, etc.
I get what you are saying, but I had said something earlier about Cam and other ultrarunners that I regret, and my post was reported and deleted (369 or 370). So I'm trying to be more mature and respectful, taking the high road here.
That's funny, cause there's people commenting on Sage's Instagram literally saying they hope he dies
They're not sending their best. Or maybe they are
Jesus, that's bad. Death threats? This could spiral out of control....
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Sage stop being a tramp. You're butthurt that a near 60 year old "influencer" took peptides to avoid surgery and is on TRT. I think your motives for going after him isn't about clean sport because you have made it clear with how you attack his son. This is personal, my guess is because he does represent a fraction of the sport of ultra you and other runners hate.
This is very disappointing to hear. Finn himself was 5th in Cocodona 2025....the same year Cam Hanes finished 18th.
Another lie Cam made up in his latest podcast: He suggested I was going after him for a "life-time ban". That is not true also. Probably the biggest ban USADA can give him is maybe up to 4 years...but at this point probably less and very likely nothing will come out of all this (if i had to guess?). Could be 4 months for all I know?
Finally his biggest point is now that he "only started BPC-157 in November of 2024." However we don't know when (if he did?) end that? In his initial Instagram comment from last month it was: "I've taken supplements for years...mainly just to put on muscle...and now, just for health, like stem cell, BPC-157 etc....I don't now if they're legal..."
Kinda paints a different picture with the timing and when he was still using BPC-157 or for how long he took it (or not)?
In any case if he was racing Cocodona 250 in early May of 2025 after starting BPC-157 in November of 2024 (and Aravaipa's "anti-doping policy" was the same as it is written now)...that's a 5-6 month window of starting BPC-157 to racing this event that follows USADA rules? He was the top 50+ year old in the field at Cocodona that year. Sure, it probably wasn't nearly as good of a performance as his 2:39 in Eugene though.
It would help maybe if Aravaipa Running and the Eugene Marathons actually enforced their policies "following USADA rules"?
Yeah, it was disappointing to hear Finn and Alyssa Clark (I believe it was) being super wishy-washy on Cam. Des and Kara did the same, though to Kara's credit she was a little stronger in saying she's a "rules follower". It was especially absurd to hear Des being "I can see both sides of it" when she was the one who publicly called out Ritz and Brooks Hansons over Ritz being duped by Salazar on some of the IV transfusion stuff (that was his story anyway, and I am inclined to believe him). Beyond that, Des doesn't want anti-drug resources dedicated to anything but the pros, which was irritating for those of us who compete in USATF masters events and some of our registration fees are meant to pay for testing and enforcement (it's a little different for something like the Eugene Marathon).
These podcasters bent over backwards to "see both sides of the issue" when it's not exactly a hard call to think that running in a USATF event is not a god-given right and the rules of the event apply to everyone (even leaving aside the absurdity of just shrugging off the obvious cheating).
I'd swear that Finn and Alyssa were afraid of blow-back from Cam's followers. I don't think that's true about Des, just think she was being an idiot about it plus thinking there was some kind of merit in bending over backwards to be "even-handed." (I like Des so I'm not saying this as a "hater" but as a fan of hers and the podcast).
I think Des’s question was how far does this go?
She was worried it would stop her dad who used a med for health from running a 5k with his daughter — as others have said, Cam’s race was a USATF champs and he won and used it for clout, no one is stopping someone from enjoying a local race with their fam.
She also worried about testing resources being diverted from pros — perhaps valid but lack of testing doesn’t mean it’s okay to do it!
I like the pod but I don’t think Des has ever once prepared for it. It seemed more that she hadn’t thought it through rather than defending Cam.
Yeah, it was disappointing to hear Finn and Alyssa Clark (I believe it was) being super wishy-washy on Cam. Des and Kara did the same, though to Kara's credit she was a little stronger in saying she's a "rules follower". It was especially absurd to hear Des being "I can see both sides of it" when she was the one who publicly called out Ritz and Brooks Hansons over Ritz being duped by Salazar on some of the IV transfusion stuff (that was his story anyway, and I am inclined to believe him). Beyond that, Des doesn't want anti-drug resources dedicated to anything but the pros, which was irritating for those of us who compete in USATF masters events and some of our registration fees are meant to pay for testing and enforcement (it's a little different for something like the Eugene Marathon).
These podcasters bent over backwards to "see both sides of the issue" when it's not exactly a hard call to think that running in a USATF event is not a god-given right and the rules of the event apply to everyone (even leaving aside the absurdity of just shrugging off the obvious cheating).
I'd swear that Finn and Alyssa were afraid of blow-back from Cam's followers. I don't think that's true about Des, just think she was being an idiot about it plus thinking there was some kind of merit in bending over backwards to be "even-handed." (I like Des so I'm not saying this as a "hater" but as a fan of hers and the podcast).
I think Des’s question was how far does this go?
She was worried it would stop her dad who used a med for health from running a 5k with his daughter — as others have said, Cam’s race was a USATF champs and he won and used it for clout, no one is stopping someone from enjoying a local race with their fam.
She also worried about testing resources being diverted from pros — perhaps valid but lack of testing doesn’t mean it’s okay to do it!
I like the pod but I don’t think Des has ever once prepared for it. It seemed more that she hadn’t thought it through rather than defending Cam.
yeah, her argument was silly. As I and others have said, no one is expecting the entire field to be tested. Her example of her dad was a hypothetical and a so-what. If her dad is competing for a podium at a USATF champ event, then it's a problem. But the whole "my poor dad can't be the 793rd finisher at a local 5k" is not a problem that needs to be addressed nor does it make the issue "complicated".
She was worried it would stop her dad who used a med for health from running a 5k with his daughter — as others have said, Cam’s race was a USATF champs and he won and used it for clout, no one is stopping someone from enjoying a local race with their fam.
She also worried about testing resources being diverted from pros — perhaps valid but lack of testing doesn’t mean it’s okay to do it!
I like the pod but I don’t think Des has ever once prepared for it. It seemed more that she hadn’t thought it through rather than defending Cam.
yeah, her argument was silly. As I and others have said, no one is expecting the entire field to be tested. Her example of her dad was a hypothetical and a so-what. If her dad is competing for a podium at a USATF champ event, then it's a problem. But the whole "my poor dad can't be the 793rd finisher at a local 5k" is not a problem that needs to be addressed nor does it make the issue "complicated".
Can’t wait to see Des’s dad at The Enhanced Games!
Not only did Cam admit to taking BPC-157, but he also admitted to using TRT and in that same original comment thread one point stated "many age groupers like myself are on hormone therapy", clearly admitting to continuing to take hormones (presumably HGH since he denies taking TRT currently). I don't trust that he stopped taking TRT either- as I understand it, once you start taking synthetic testosterone, your body stops being able to produce it naturally, so presumably you're basically hooked to the TRT pharma industry.
BPC-157 is not solely responsible for this 58 year old who'd run 2:50-2:58 for his whole life suddenly running a 2:39... If whatever cocktail he's on can take that much time off a mediocre marathoner, just imagine what kinds of times former 2:20-2:30 marathoners could be running at 58- 2:10-2:20s?? I think we've gotten used to elites microdosing these powerful drugs so that they don't get caught by running obviously doped up times, but this guy isn't even hiding it and now he's running the age graded equivalent of a 2:10.
He has all the telltale signs of TRT/HGH use- waxy red skin (increased RBC production- TRT is basically EPO), distended belly (insulin disregulation, "bubble gut"), visible vascularization, and even just eyeballing his jawline, this does not look like the guy in his old photos from his blog (jaw bone continues to grow with HGH use, see Sylvester Stallone). It's like when the doctor asks you how much alcohol you drink and you tell him half the honest amount- no way this guy is only on peptides
Look back in 08' all the blogs CH lists his stack with not one but a couple of pro hormone substances. So that's almost 20years of banned substances...Banned substances that are prohibited in Sport. If you aren't competing, please take the cocktail of exogenous substances.
Now it seems CH stack has got more refined working with multiple endocrinologists- Ways to Well. DHEA, Pregnenolone, HCG, GH, Test Cypionate cycle...
Then has the disdain to laugh this off as an Age Grouper while dismissing the true blue collar age grouper.
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Cam is continuing to crash out, double down, change his story, and attempting to shift the focus off of him on his social media: https://imgur.com/a/T0FQpFT
He's now pointing out how the winner of the Eugene Marathon also wasn't tested, as if that is the reason why he's getting heat. Cam, as far as I know, Jax Siddell hasn't admitted to taking a peptide not approved for human consumption that he somehow claims to have gotten from a doctor, partnered with a TRT company for several years, written a series of blog posts about his PED usage, or gone on the Joe Rogan podcast and admitted to taking a huge stack of supplements that he's unsure of the purpose of. If he has, please let us know, and we'll lead the charge to get both you and him removed from the 2026 results.
He's also sharing the Eugene waiver, as if it not explicitly saying "Hey, don't be a roided out grandpa and enter our race" is some sort of gotcha defense. Cam, that waiver doesn't say anything about wearing your bib in a visible location, how'd you and all the other thousands of competitors know to do that, if it wasn't in the waiver? Looks like the waiver didn't say anything about not cutting the course either, I guess you and everyone else were suckers for running the full 26.2 huh? Oh, yeah, there are rules to road racing that aren't listed in a waiver for legal liability purposes that anyone who's been doing marathons for 20+ years would know. You've proven time and time again that you think you're such a special, unique flower that the rules don't apply to you though.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
Cam is continuing to crash out, double down, change his story, and attempting to shift the focus off of him on his social media: https://imgur.com/a/T0FQpFT
He's now pointing out how the winner of the Eugene Marathon also wasn't tested, as if that is the reason why he's getting heat. Cam, as far as I know, Jax Siddell hasn't admitted to taking a peptide not approved for human consumption that he somehow claims to have gotten from a doctor, partnered with a TRT company for several years, written a series of blog posts about his PED usage, or gone on the Joe Rogan podcast and admitted to taking a huge stack of supplements that he's unsure of the purpose of. If he has, please let us know, and we'll lead the charge to get both you and him removed from the 2026 results.
He's also sharing the Eugene waiver, as if it not explicitly saying "Hey, don't be a roided out grandpa and enter our race" is some sort of gotcha defense. Cam, that waiver doesn't say anything about wearing your bib in a visible location, how'd you and all the other thousands of competitors know to do that, if it wasn't in the waiver? Looks like the waiver didn't say anything about not cutting the course either, I guess you and everyone else were suckers for running the full 26.2 huh? Oh, yeah, there are rules to road racing that aren't listed in a waiver for legal liability purposes that anyone who's been doing marathons for 20+ years would know. You've proven time and time again that you think you're such a special, unique flower that the rules don't apply to you though.
This is all so silly. Sage could have been tested out of competition during his pulmonary issues those 3-5 years and would have failed every single drug tests with all the drugs he had been on to get healthy. I'm quite positive. he never filled out TUEs unless he is transparent and shows us.
I don’t understand how she can make such reductionist statements about sometbkng she is so knowledgeable about. She knows albuterol doesn’t need a tue or that a cancer patient taking prednisone or a dad running a 35 min 5k with a family member isn’t what this argument is about.
It’s about fraud when you get down to it. Fraud that someone has admitted to openly. She’s letting her cool kid persona and her infatuation with social media clout say some stupid stuff to defend doping at fairly high levels.