We merged two Mary Cain threads into 1. The 2nd one was entitled, "Update: Mary Cain makes another sexual allegation - Alberto Salazar looked at her exposed breasts while she was sleeping"
Do I need to prove that it is correct to sympathize with a victim of abuse, rather than join a long line of abusers and continue to bully her? I'm just trying to understand the lack of sympathy.
In a country that values freedom of speech, she is free to write a book about her experience, just as we are free to read it, and or discuss it, or not.
Hey, I know it's been a long time since I rapped at ya (this morning), but I'm further in the book since then.
The general impression I get is that Cain simply wants to be liked, and does not deal with criticism well. If that sounds harsh, then temper it with the fact that you, me, and everybody else in this thread is most likely a nobody who won't come close to having the experience she had and is currently dealing with.
Some Cliff Notes after about two hours of the 9 hour+ audiobook:
* She is extremely harsh toward her high school coach, who she simply calls "Mitchell" (I'm not sure if that's the correct spelling, but apparently it's his last name). She claims that he talked openly about other teammates' sex lives and use of alcohol. She is maddeningly unspecific in this claim. (Simply saying at one point, "He asked for it." Without clarifying what question or questions provoked such discussion.)
* She does not get along with her female teammates. Many of them have parents who say mean things to her. At one point, Mitchell allegedly tells her she will never be team captain, as her teammates do not respect her. She also faults Mitchell for not intervening when parents hurl abuse at her. But, before you check "personality disorder" on your bingo card, you should watch (or rewatch) "Mean Girls" first. She is intensely competitive, and it causes problems in her personal relationships.
* She also talks openly of supporting her teammates, despite having a target on her back due to her massive talent. The most enlightening chapter (so far) is chapter 27, in which she approaches a (n unnamed) competitor and suggests they warm up together. She loses the competition to this fellow athlete, but is proud of her performance and shows a great deal of humility (she "gave it her best shot" and doesn't feel robbed when she loses).
* Message boards, and specifically Letsrun, are mentioned. She finds the comments on them so distasteful that she claims not to read them. But, she knows, for example that some people claim she is biologically male (in the book, it's a tad more brutal: she has a penis; she briefly discusses her delayed onset of menses for no other apparent reason than to disprove this ludicrous claim). Mitchell, on the other hand, reads them. It's another one of his character flaws, we should suppose.
* She narrates the book herself, and, while it takes something other than running talent to give a good audiobook performance, she does an admirable job. There are parts where she becomes choked with emotion and even begins crying. The effect is pretty stark and should help anyone who hates her see her as human.
* Her introduction to Salazar is cordial and she clearly had a lot of respect for him as a coach at one point in time. If you read between the lines, you get the sense that she has a crush on Galen Rupp, which is pretty normal and kind of sweet. Like, there's a real in person in there dealing with real person issues, just under a glaring spotlight.
More later...it's a worthy read, no matter what you think of it's author.
no snark for real, but I didn't think there would be any variations between audiobook and regular book?! I thought the audiobook was the same thing, just read aloud.
There aren't any variations, to my knowledge, except that you get to hear Cain speak her words in the audiobook version.
And "no snark, for real?" Look at you bringing a touch of civility to a thread that sorely needs it. That made my day. Thank you.
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I started the thread yesterday about how I read in the WSJ review of Cain's memoir that Cain claims her HS coach took a perverse interest in her sex life. Today I've read another review in RW and find out she's accused Salazar of looking at her exposed breasts?
I started the thread yesterday about how I read in the WSJ review of Cain's memoir that Cain claims her HS coach took a perverse interest in her sex life. Today I've read another review in RW and find out she's accused Salazar of looking at her exposed breasts?
She has accused every coach, peer, stranger, etc., of wronging her. She has not examined any life decisions and concluded that she has made any bad decisions or treated anyone poorly.
Have you never listened to her or read anything that she has written? Just read this thread. How many people have mentioned praise that Mary has made of coaches or teachers? Now go listen to successful athletes.
Have you never listened to her or read anything that she has written? Just read this thread. How many people have mentioned praise that Mary has made of coaches or teachers? Now go listen to successful athletes.
I have listened to her and read a lot of what she has written, and what was written about her, and the lawsuit, and I have read this thread.
I expect her story to be different than those of successful athletes under different circumstances with different histories. I find it comparable to Kara Goucher, for example, who arguably underperformed under Salazar, and also wrote a book about 2 years after taking Salazar in front of SafeSport, and winning, and 4 years after Salazar was banned by USADA, and some 8 years after the initial ProPublica/BBC investigation and reporting where she came forward against Salazar.
I just don't understand why your reflex is to continue to bully someone who was clearly a victim of psychological abuse under Salazar and Treasure at the NOP. Does it seem appropriate to you to join the mob and pile-on?
Are you giving this any genuine thought, or just reacting emotionally? For all this talk of Mary lacking a self-evaluation, are you self-evaluating your own behavior?
This post was edited 10 minutes after it was posted.
I read the book, and I thought it was a tough but necessary read. I hope people who have kids in sports read it and understand some red flags to look for in their children's lives. Largely, to me, it read like someone who was putting their own perspective on events in their life out into a world that often spoke like it knew her (even when it didn't). I hope people can find it in themselves to give her grace as she works through what being a young person finding their way under (what probably felt like) an intense spotlight felt like and speaking her own truth into the world.
I read the book, and I thought it was a tough but necessary read. I hope people who have kids in sports read it and understand some red flags to look for in their children's lives. Largely, to me, it read like someone who was putting their own perspective on events in their life out into a world that often spoke like it knew her (even when it didn't). I hope people can find it in themselves to give her grace as she works through what being a young person finding their way under (what probably felt like) an intense spotlight felt like and speaking her own truth into the world.
* Message boards, and specifically Letsrun, are mentioned. She finds the comments on them so distasteful that she claims not to read them. But, she knows, for example that some people claim she is biologically male (in the book, it's a tad more brutal: she has a penis; she briefly discusses her delayed onset of menses for no other apparent reason than to disprove this ludicrous claim). Mitchell, on the other hand, reads them. It's another one of his character flaws, we should suppose.
Wouldn't be surprised if many of the comments here were from her HS coach.
I mean....she's in medical school pursuing a challenging career. is that not "moving on" ?
Have you read the entire post? She’s not taking step 1 and going on to clinicals with her classmates but instead promoting her slander against the world book. No, she isn’t moving on, med school is full of legacy students like her. Feel for the student who didn’t get a seat bc she did.
* Message boards, and specifically Letsrun, are mentioned. She finds the comments on them so distasteful that she claims not to read them. But, she knows, for example that some people claim she is biologically male (in the book, it's a tad more brutal: she has a penis; she briefly discusses her delayed onset of menses for no other apparent reason than to disprove this ludicrous claim). Mitchell, on the other hand, reads them. It's another one of his character flaws, we should suppose.
Wouldn't be surprised if many of the comments here were from her HS coach.
What makes you say that? If there is an overarching theme to the book it is how let down she feels by those entrusted with her best interests. But, really, one gets the impression that Cain herself feels like a failure. Which is a hard pull to swallow when you look at the magnitude of her accomplishments.
Almost done with the audiobook, so here are more notes:
* Chapter 58 is enlightening. She doesn't see herself as an attractive person and rails against a system that rewards attractiveness as much as talent (she calls it, the "hot girl contract"). That's really sad, because she has a really good point here. A lot of online attacks go after her appearance. Which has nothing to do with her running.
* Salazar comes across as someone who actually cares for her and wants her to succeed. They form an intimate bond that has zero sexual overtones. The incident where he wakes her up while sleeping and sees her topless is mentioned in the book. He claims he is adjusting her tent, she is sleeping topless, and, again, there is absolutely nothing sexual about it, other than his possible glimpse of her breasts. By this point, he has already seen her breasts, as described in a chapter where she passes out in a cryo-sauna. It uses gas to lower the temperature, but has a platform that should raise once activated. The platform fails to raise, and he tells her to hold her breath. She passes out, wearing underpants but no top (a lot of his athletes use the machine completely naked). His reaction is to ask if she is OK. That doesn't mean she isn't extremely private about her body, because she is, nor that both experiences weren't traumatic for her, but it suggests that he isn't preying on her sexually.
* Salazar does monitor her weight in a way that makes her uncomfortable. He apparently does this with all his athletes (well, to be fair, Cain doesn't mention any restrictions or comments directed at male athletes).
* Cain is very much a rule follower and is hurt by anyone who suggests she deviate from the regulations. At one point she suffers an injury and alleges that Salazar offers her pain medication prescribed to him. This bothers her. Early in the book, she talks about being hungry all the time and does sneak Cliff Bars from Dathen Ritzenheim's stash (he's sponsored by Cliff Bar). So, there is a lot of conflict between the guidance she receives and the signals her body is giving her.
* There's a brief section where she talks about getting her period on Prom Night and bleeding through to her dress. It mystified me when I heard it, but upon reflection, it does help set the general tone for the entire work: you have a night that is supposed to be special and memorable, and something unexpected (and incredibly embarrassing) happens casting a pall over everything. She cleans up as best she can and decides that if anyone notices, she will simply tell them that she accidentally sat in some cake. Still, that's the tightrope she has to walk.
* The last third of the book is dedicated to her descent into self-harm, suicidal ideation, and mental health struggles. More than anything, she comes across as someone who wants to be loved for who she is and not her accomplishments. It's pretty heartbreaking when you consider that a lot of women feel that way, but made way worse when you realize that she just doesn't want to let people down.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
Too many people have been defamed in her revenge books. Would love to see some lawsuits coming out for personal injury and defamation. Maybe she can move on after she loses them
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