That's an incredibly fair amount for a part time gig, especially given the fact that he spend tops a few hours a week on his coaching for them.
It's also way more than he was making before; when he was an unknown high school coach. TME made him. Stop playing the victim.
from the team...... You also got way more from Drew individually.
OMI wrote:
That's an incredibly fair amount for a part time gig, especially given the fact that he spend tops a few hours a week on his coaching for them.
It's also way more than he was making before; when he was an unknown high school coach. TME made him. Stop playing the victim.
LOL
good point!
OMI wrote:
good point!
You gonna respond to any of my other comments, or just the low hanging fruit? C'mon give us the "whole story"!
Unknown high school coach?? Are you kidding me? Tinman has been well known way before Drew was even born you halfwit
ScumbagElite wrote:
Unknown high school coach?? Are you kidding me? Tinman has been well known way before Drew was even born you halfwit
as the vitriol roils and bubbles and the two camps take their sides...why don't you chill some. If you can't the problem is on you, get help.
I've been running and following the sport for a long time. 25 years coaching experience at all levels. Never heard of Tinman until here, on letsrun.com in the mid-2000s. Drew would have been 6 or 8 by then. But TS was not a big name coach at that time, he was educated and knowledgeable and liked to talk about his theories. He was a sidekick author on some of Pete Magill's books but he got his name by coaching the likes teenage phenoms like Hunter and Grace Ping.
Killeriott wrote:
Why anyone outside of the involved parties cares about any of this is beyond me. This is not an interesting story. So these runners no longer want this guy to coach them. Why would this be a surprise? Once you have sucked the orange dry, maybe you discard it. The coach was sucked dry I guess, at least in the eyes of the athletes.
I agree. None of this should matter to anyone else. The way it is being handled doesn't speak well of those who are involved, but at the end of the day it is their business.
The group were paying Tinman 2,000 a month? Given the amount of blokes on that team (I say blokes because Parsons never allowed women on the team), Tinman could have made more money buy coaching them on his regular plan.
Tinman got taken advantage of big time, but should have done more to let the situation get to this point.
Well, Tom is no longer listed as the head coach on their site.
OMI wrote:
That's an incredibly fair amount for a part time gig, especially given the fact that he spend tops a few hours a week on his coaching for them.
It's also way more than he was making before; when he was an unknown high school coach. TME made him. Stop playing the victim.
2k a month is a fair amount? I highly doubt that when writing the coaching for their whole team he only spent "a couple hours a week". Does that include the workouts he went to, discussions/meetings with the team, races, moving his family??? His name essentially became the name of the group and his training philosophy became their mantras. I don't think Tinman was an unknown high school coach before TME. He coached Drew in high school and also currently coaches a cast of studs that I believe he coached before TME took off. I may be wrong but I thought Project Gold was a camp the Ping's hosted which mostly had the high schoolers Tom Schwartz was working with each summer.
Look I've been a fan of Tinman Elite for the past few years, purchased loads of gear/accessories from their drops, and have followed their progress as a group. I even personally followed Drew, Reed, and Joey outside of the team because I liked their personalities the most. Even so, reading this thread I feel as if the group handled this poorly. If they want to separate from Tom Schwartz then the brand as a whole would have to change. Schwartz wasn't simply the coach, his name and training was the backbone of TME.
Anto1Q95 wrote:
Well, Tom is no longer listed as the head coach on their site.
What's weird is that they haven't removed the references to Schwartz within Cory Leslie's bio. Leslie is still listed as the "assistant" coach. This whole situation is incredibly strange.
References Tom as head coach, too.
How you do anything is how you do everything.
Killeriott wrote:
Why anyone outside of the involved parties cares about any of this is beyond me. This is not an interesting story. So these runners no longer want this guy to coach them. Why would this be a surprise? Once you have sucked the orange dry, maybe you discard it. The coach was sucked dry I guess, at least in the eyes of the athletes.
Certainly a valid and adult perspective. Why you'd try to apply that to this site and its message board is beyond me. You will find plenty of Tinman fans and foes on this board from his years of posting here, both usually choosing their side based on persistently irrational reasoning. So they feel they have an investment in the situation to have a say and react to any and every reaction they see. I have no dog in the fight, I used to like TME but lost interest yet am squarely ambivalent to their fortunes. I have no feelings one way or another regarding Schwartz, though respect him for widely sharing his training knowledge. I'm not a client and never will be, but not because I think his outlook is bunk. This veritable lockerroom full of feisty imps exists solely because the founders gathered and feed them a constant stream of vitriolic fuel (hey, I'm not immune to the stuff) and this is what you predictably get. See also: the sharp misogynistic focus on a certain female US steeplechaser.
Flavian wrote:
2k a month is a fair amount? I highly doubt that when writing the coaching for their whole team he only spent "a couple hours a week". Does that include the workouts he went to, discussions/meetings with the team, races, moving his family??? His name essentially became the name of the group and his training philosophy became their mantras. I don't think Tinman was an unknown high school coach before TME. He coached Drew in high school and also currently coaches a cast of studs that I believe he coached before TME took off. I may be wrong but I thought Project Gold was a camp the Ping's hosted which mostly had the high schoolers Tom Schwartz was working with each summer.
Look I've been a fan of Tinman Elite for the past few years, purchased loads of gear/accessories from their drops, and have followed their progress as a group. I even personally followed Drew, Reed, and Joey outside of the team because I liked their personalities the most. Even so, reading this thread I feel as if the group handled this poorly. If they want to separate from Tom Schwartz then the brand as a whole would have to change. Schwartz wasn't simply the coach, his name and training was the backbone of TME.
Tinman gave them the same exact workouts that he prescribes his hobby jogger clients. He didn't have any administrative responsibilities such as planning travel. Tinman refused to give up his lucrative private coaching of 12 years olds and 50 year olds to focus on pro coaching.
The truth is that Tinman got a lot more out of his connection with Drew Hunter than Drew was getting from Tinman. The brand that DREW HUNTER BUILT has likely grown Tinman's private coaching client base by 100%.
If Tinman felt like he was getting ripped off, he could have left.
Okay Sam Parsons
Tinman Elite has released a statement to us on the coaching change. I'm posting the statement below and also including it in the article published on Friday.
TINMAN ELITE STATEMENT, 4/25/21
First and foremost, we’d like to address our silence about the decision to part ways with Coach Schwartz. Our initial mutual aim with Coach Schwartz was to keep this news confidential until after the Olympic Trials in an effort to provide Coach Schwartz with time and space to determine his future coaching endeavors and to allow our athletes to focus on their Olympic goals.
It became clear to the team that Coach Schwartz's growing commercial coaching business and other pursuits made him unable to provide the individualized attention that the team needed in order to stay healthy and succeed long term. Despite parting ways with Coach Schwartz, the team has continued to uphold the mutually agreed upon compensation we committed to provide in our initial coaching agreement, allowing him time and support as he determines his next steps.
We wish Coach Schwartz well, thank him for his time with the team, and will work with him to address any additional concerns he may have. At this time, our team is focused on the future—the upcoming Olympic Trials and working to uphold our mission of pushing the sport of running forward through positive community outreach and athletic performance.
Thank you for the support.
- Tinman Elite
Original article:
Some cookie cutter PR statement. So they're going to keep his name? Also sounds like they're pushing the blame of health and performance on Tinman.
OMI wrote:
That's an incredibly fair amount for a part time gig, especially given the fact that he spend tops a few hours a week on his coaching for them.
It's also way more than he was making before; when he was an unknown high school coach. TME made him. Stop playing the victim.
How much did they pay Tom for all the merch sales bearing his name? I’ll bet you guys deeply regret building a brand on the backbone of a coach that you’ve now kicked to the curb but time to cut your losses and change the name.
How much did they pay Tom for all the merch sales bearing his name? I’ll bet you guys deeply regret building a brand on the backbone of a coach that you’ve now kicked to the curb but time to cut your losses and change the name.[/quote]
ZERO!