Breaking: Marathon world record Ruth Chepngetich has tested positive - Will Kenya's Parliament apologize to yours truly?

rojo wrote:

The King of Physics wrote:

If I go up to a girl in a bar and ask her what would you say to men who come up to your beautiful self and request to bed you do you really think she doesn’t believe I myself wanna get inside her pants?

Common sense psychology Rojo, check with a trained psychiatrist on non verbal cues.

Kenyan parliament doesn’t need to admit apology but maybe you need to admit you were a tad shy to phrase the question in the first person.

And btw the idea about financial punishment by Thoughtsleader is just so perfunctory and ill considered.

Of course I used the third person as an excuse to ask the question.

I plead guilty.

I did the same thing with Regina Jacobs 23 years ago.

Link:www.letsrun.com/2002/rojospeaks013002....

For some reason, it's rude to directly ask someone a question about drugs but if you say it nice, it's allowed.

Salvitore Stitchmo wrote:

Wise Old Man wrote:

The rules should be modified so that Chepngetich is offered a deal. 2 year ban if she cooperates fully and exposes any and all elements of a cheating conspiracy. So, provision of bank records, emails, texts, prescriptions, etc etc. The investigators will determine if her cooperation has been fulsome and transparent. Otherwise, lifetime ban. Any others implicated by her, get a 4 year ban or lifetime ban based on their degree of culpability. If they come forward before the investigation identifies them, same deal 2 yr ban if they cooperate.

Well then I hope WA/AIU has some money to relocate her somewhere a-la witness protection because if they didn't, she might end up in a ditch somewhere in Kenya. Or "in a car accident" or "jumping out of a window fleeing the scene of an affair".

Like I agree with you but 1) I would question how deep her knowledge is anyway as I suspect these athletes are just basically trafficked for their running ability and 2) I would seriously fear for her safety is she ever had enough intel to really open the can of worms.

I do believe it is that bad there.

THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:

You haven’t thought this one through. You are talking about potentially cutting off the livelihood of hundreds of potentially innocent Kenyan runners/staff etc. indefinitely because you’re worried about a wealthy agent throwing up his hands like in Casablanca

The complaints/appeals from them are a million times more compelling than Federico playing dumb. We’re not even talking about banning him, we are proposing sanctioning him if athletes under his management defraud the sport. An athlete like Chepn’getich probably made him hundreds of thousands let’s say between appearance fee, bonuses, contract and prize money. It would not kill his livelihood to get fined.

He’d possibly go away from athletes operating in their own bubbles like Chepn’getich probably. He might put in some effort to education/surveillance of his camps, or he’d keep the SOP and accept the cost of doing business

You are certainly overthinking this, when we talk of the fairness to a tiny entity vs frankly an entire country. Someone beyond the individual athlete needs to step up, and agents are an easy place to start as they are in the business of investing in the athletes.

And the country does pay $5M/year and has rigid testing requirements, so there is cooperation and contribution there. But as you know the incentives need to change for both agents and athletes.

Salvitore Stitchmo wrote:

Wise Old Man wrote:

The rules should be modified so that Chepngetich is offered a deal. 2 year ban if she cooperates fully and exposes any and all elements of a cheating conspiracy. So, provision of bank records, emails, texts, prescriptions, etc etc. The investigators will determine if her cooperation has been fulsome and transparent. Otherwise, lifetime ban. Any others implicated by her, get a 4 year ban or lifetime ban based on their degree of culpability. If they come forward before the investigation identifies them, same deal 2 yr ban if they cooperate.

Well then I hope WA/AIU has some money to relocate her somewhere a-la witness protection because if they didn't, she might end up in a ditch somewhere in Kenya. Or "in a car accident" or "jumping out of a window fleeing the scene of an affair".

Like I agree with you but 1) I would question how deep her knowledge is anyway as I suspect these athletes are just basically trafficked for their running ability and 2) I would seriously fear for her safety is she ever had enough intel to really open the can of worms.

I do believe it is that bad there.

Ghost1 wrote:

Salvitore Stitchmo wrote:

Well then I hope WA/AIU has some money to relocate her somewhere a-la witness protection because if they didn't, she might end up in a ditch somewhere in Kenya. Or "in a car accident" or "jumping out of a window fleeing the scene of an affair".

Like I agree with you but 1) I would question how deep her knowledge is anyway as I suspect these athletes are just basically trafficked for their running ability and 2) I would seriously fear for her safety is she ever had enough intel to really open the can of worms.

I do believe it is that bad there.

You're absolutely correct. In many ways, Ruth C. is a victim in sense that she was just following protocol that her coaches and agents dished out to her.

A Kenyan friend, 2:13:00 guy (journeyman in Kenya), based in Kericho , told me that not so long ago Ruth C. was really poor, and begged food from him at a race.

Quote from said Kenyan: "I'm sure they're going to nullify it. I remember that girl was very poor. There was a time I had to share some food with her. Regrettably, she didn't bother to remember such. I didn't do so to get anything in return. People should understand that everything in this cruel word is vanity. This world and everything that is in it belongs to God. People should learn to be humble, nobody knows what tomorrow holds. I sympathize with her. Good evening from Kenya."

Ghost 1 word: While I don't condone what she did, I feel for Ruth C. Going the legal route, without Peds, I think 2:16:00-2:18:00 was possible. These Kenyan girls train with men (Faith K.), do intervals with them, and end up matching their pace. She didn't need to do this.

Ghost1 wrote:

Salvitore Stitchmo wrote:

Well then I hope WA/AIU has some money to relocate her somewhere a-la witness protection because if they didn't, she might end up in a ditch somewhere in Kenya. Or "in a car accident" or "jumping out of a window fleeing the scene of an affair".

Like I agree with you but 1) I would question how deep her knowledge is anyway as I suspect these athletes are just basically trafficked for their running ability and 2) I would seriously fear for her safety is she ever had enough intel to really open the can of worms.

I do believe it is that bad there.

You're absolutely correct. In many ways, Ruth C. is a victim in sense that she was just following protocol that her coaches and agents dished out to her.

A Kenyan friend, 2:13:00 guy (journeyman in Kenya), based in Kericho , told me that not so long ago Ruth C. was really poor, and begged food from him at a race.

Quote from said Kenyan: "I'm sure they're going to nullify it. I remember that girl was very poor. There was a time I had to share some food with her. Regrettably, she didn't bother to remember such. I didn't do so to get anything in return. People should understand that everything in this cruel word is vanity. This world and everything that is in it belongs to God. People should learn to be humble, nobody knows what tomorrow holds. I sympathize with her. Good evening from Kenya."

Ghost 1 word: While I don't condone what she did, I feel for Ruth C. Going the legal route, without Peds, I think 2:16:00-2:18:00 was possible. These Kenyan girls train with men (Faith K.), do intervals with them, and end up matching their pace. She didn't need to do this.

Salvitore Stitchmo wrote:

No you're not thinking about this enough.

We are all sitting here connecting dots saying (in this case) "how can it be possible that Rosa doesn't know?" - but the reality is there is a chance he might not.

It might just be "bad luck" that he has so many athletes that have been busted for doping and unfortunately you have to treat each mutually exclusively. Until an athlete attests "Frederico Rosa was complicit in helping me dope" - in which he is getting his WA license revoked and he's done anyway, from a legal POV holding someone accountable for something there is no firm evidence they are part of just won't fly. That would be the biggest waste of money WA had if they tried to do that.

I know you have an affliction for defending East Africans - that's fine. But here is a question for you - do you believe EVERY athlete in Russia was doping? Because if even one clean athlete from Russia was caught up in the misgivings of the vast majority then it doesn't differ from this situation and I can guarantee you there was at least one clean Russian athlete that had their "livelihood cut off" thanks to doping of others.

So what you do is you the same thing you did with Russia. You ban the nation and you make selected athletes INA's (individual neutral athletes) under the same conditions as the Russian and Belorussian athletes allowed to compete. I think you'd be surprised how Kenya's doping epidemic turned around if this happened.

You talk about the increased testing and "5 million bucks a year" - what good has it done! Seriously? Nothing has changed! They still have more positives than anyone and this incident here might be a Mt Rushmore bust because of what her performance meant for females in the context of physiology and general athletics.

Would I feel bad for clean Kenyan athletes caught up in a drastic step such as a nation ban? - sure. But right now I don't know how I or anyone could possibly take anyone from that country seriously and yeah that now includes the likes of Kipyegon, Wanyonyi, Koech, Chepkoech, Chebet etc.

Clean Fungus wrote:

rojo wrote:

I like your concept of a sliding scale.

But can yo uplease tell me why you have groupped Sang and Schumacher with Aden, Kersee and Salazar? Seems like a crazy association.

How the two Ss belong in that group?

In my mind, Schumacher was uncomfotrtable with Salazar and Dr. Brown from the getgo and quickly broke up with Salazar and formed his own group. What has Sang done?

They all coached 1 - 3 doped athletes.

Schumacher, lol, I know you are a fan, but:

- he learned under doper Salazar

- he used the corrupt Dr. Brown for years

- Jager was the most suspicious "Likely Doper" on the infamous IAAF list (and was never the same after the target testing started...)

- he defended doper Houlihan (who kept going strong while being targeted until POOF!) with lies

- he continued coaching Houlihan during her ban (at least initially).