Serena Williams - best woman ever in an individual sport?

Serena isn’t even the best female tennis player of all time.

Steffi Graf?

When You Factor wrote:

When you factor in longevity at or near the top of her sport, #1 is Serena by a huge margin.

When you factor in longevity, Serena still has a long way to go to catch Jeannie Longo.

sparky polastry wrote:

Women's tennis has had many dominant players. Serena is certainly the most powerful athlete of that elite group, and overall may deserve to be considered the best, but I don't think her career accomplishments or overall "dominance" stand much if at all above the other all time greats. Consider:

Graf - Won 22/54 slams, SF or better 37/54

Evert - Won 18/56 slams, SF or better 52/56

Navratilova - Won 18/67 slams, SF or better 44/67

Seles (pre-stabbing) - Won 8/14 slams, SF or better 10/14

Serena - Won 23/73 slams, SF or better 38/73

I also think the field has been weak the last 10+ years.

+1, Well done.

Just doesn't fit the media narrative that Serena is a victim and hero all at the same time. She had a baby! OMG! In Trump's America! OMG!

Dane-0-rama wrote:

sparky polastry wrote:

Women's tennis has had many dominant players. Serena is certainly the most powerful athlete of that elite group, and overall may deserve to be considered the best, but I don't think her career accomplishments or overall "dominance" stand much if at all above the other all time greats. Consider:

Graf - Won 22/54 slams, SF or better 37/54

Evert - Won 18/56 slams, SF or better 52/56

Navratilova - Won 18/67 slams, SF or better 44/67

Seles (pre-stabbing) - Won 8/14 slams, SF or better 10/14

Serena - Won 23/73 slams, SF or better 38/73

I also think the field has been weak the last 10+ years.

+1, Well done.

Just doesn't fit the media narrative that Serena is a victim and hero all at the same time. She had a baby! OMG! In Trump's America! OMG!

Everyone at their peak, who wins?

Djjddvnjddyuhdc wrote:

Dane-0-rama wrote:

+1, Well done.

Just doesn't fit the media narrative that Serena is a victim and hero all at the same time. She had a baby! OMG! In Trump's America! OMG!

Everyone at their peak, who wins?

Serena.

The dirty secret is Serena has so many drugs running through her system, as all of us who played pro tennis know. She’s out of shape and slow but her drug influenced power means she hits like a man.

And yes I played against her, clean. I was faster and more accurate and in supreme conditioning....but she beat me handily.

Djjddvnjddyuhdc wrote:

Dane-0-rama wrote:

Justine Henin.

+1, Well done.

Just doesn't fit the media narrative that Serena is a victim and hero all at the same time. She had a baby! OMG! In Trump's America! OMG!

Everyone at their peak, who wins?

Djjddvnjddyuhdc wrote:

Dane-0-rama wrote:

+1, Well done.

Just doesn't fit the media narrative that Serena is a victim and hero all at the same time. She had a baby! OMG! In Trump's America! OMG!

Everyone at their peak, who wins?

Justine Henin

Just don't mention this

https://www.theguardian.com/observer/osm/story/0,,543962,00.html

Djjddvnjddyuhdc wrote:

Everyone at their peak, who wins?

On what surface, with what equipment, and access to performance training methods from which era?

The challenges of the game and most important skills have changed a lot with the equipment. It's obvious Serena is the most powerful and most impressive athletic specimen of the group, and her game leverages that. She overpowers most opponents, but when she can also be erratic and spray it everywhere when things go bad. Give prime Serena 70s era training and nutrition a 70 sq in wooden racket and match her up against 1975 Chris Evert at Roland Garros or 1980 Navratilova at Wimbledon and I wouldn't favor her. In the reverse situation where either of those women were born 30-40 years later, I'd definitely favor Serena by a lot.

Prime Graf vs Prime Serena would have been very competitive and entertaining, just as the post-prime Graf vs pre-prime Serena matches were.

Well If You wrote:

Well if you want to go back to a time when the pool of top competitors was admittedly smaller, Fanny Blankers Koen, who was the top female track athlete for several years leading to 1948 and could have won six golds in '48 if the schedule and rules permitted, might have been the best.

+1. You have to be a pretty hard-core T&F fan to know about her,. but, yeah. she was the real deal.

AnnaYis wrote:

The dirty secret is Serena has so many drugs running through her system, as all of us who played pro tennis know. She’s out of shape and slow but her drug influenced power means she hits like a man.

And yes I played against her, clean. I was faster and more accurate and in supreme conditioning....but she beat me handily.

Why didn't you hit it where she wasn't? Wouldn't she be too slow to get there?

I was never a Martina fan, but she could match Serena for athleticism

Jackie Joyner-Kersee is the answer to your question.

Steffie Graff and Martina Navratilova were far better athletes than Serena as far as women athletes in the sport of tennis- Justine Henin was as well.

Serena is simply more powerful and a better ball striker (mainly can pick the ball up earlier and not give up the baseline) than everyone around at present. That allows her to dictate play and not dependent on raw athleticism to maneuver around the court. The Women's game over the last decade has been rather erratic and enigmatic. The Men's game is about to enter that phase as Fed, Djoker, Nadal, Murray, DelPo and Wawrinka fade away.

sinkingship wrote:

Armstronglivs wrote:

It's always dismaying when dimness postures as cleverness. The comment in bold says nothing of the kind of what you think it says. It says the opposite of what you have chosen to infer, that doping is largely the explanation for a dominance like hers, as it is in most sports. You may not agree with that point of view but it would help if you understood what you think you are taking issue with.

If all dominance is due to doping then quibbling about doping is of little relevance when comparing dominant athletes. It's not that hard to understand.

It is hard for you.

attack attack wrote:

Armstronglivs wrote:

In order for the answer to be "no" all that is required is for the answer to be "no". It doesn't require either elaboration or alternatives.

Spoken like a child.

in your case, what other level is there?

Obvi wrote:

elviejo wrote:

Drunk posting?

Nope. Truth posting.

Or are you going to claim that Serena was at some point one of the top 100 tennis players in the world?

///

As to you - Stupid posting?

She's a top 10 athlete of all time, this is a ridiculous post. Get off the sauce.

AnnaYis wrote:

The dirty secret is Serena has so many drugs running through her system, as all of us who played pro tennis know. She’s out of shape and slow but her drug influenced power means she hits like a man.

And yes I played against her, clean. I was faster and more accurate and in supreme conditioning....but she beat me handily.

lol "everyone better than me is cheating"

WinnytheBish wrote:

AnnaYis wrote:

The dirty secret is Serena has so many drugs running through her system, as all of us who played pro tennis know. She’s out of shape and slow but her drug influenced power means she hits like a man.

And yes I played against her, clean. I was faster and more accurate and in supreme conditioning....but she beat me handily.

lol "everyone better than me is cheating"

I thought she only mentioned Williams. But maybe you are extrapolating the point that everyone is smarter than you.