Walmsley Can't Compete Against Kilian Because of HOKA Shoes

Running analyst wrote:

proof?????????? wrote:

Proof?

Karl Melzer disqualified him at Speed Goat 50 years back.

Google it.

What about the whole Everest double summit lie? Why anyone have respect for Kilian Jornet at this point doesn't make any sense to me.

At least Jim has been honest his past and what led him to the sport. Kilian always seems shady when he talks about what he's doing. He's a magician letting you see only what he wants you to see..

Jim isn't a great mountain runner. There are others better. But Jim would crush Kilian and Xavier on a flat course. Thats' what the race results indicate.

a

Running analyst wrote:

proof?????????? wrote:

Proof?

Karl Melzer disqualified him at Speed Goat 50 years back. Google it.

I don't know why people insist on trolling and others respond in kind posting incomplete information.

A few years age he cut switchbacks at the Speedgoat 50K. In a long career, he's never been accused in the time before or since of cheating, and it seems he was under the impression rules were different for the race. The race was (still is somewhat) in its infancy, without established rules covering things like switchbacks, so Kilian took the traditional route he thought he should take. The result was not that he was disqualified, but that even though he was first across the finish line, he wasn't entitled to the prize money. This was a sort of 11th hour compromise.

To be fully clear, there was one other instance that Kilian was accused of cheating. In his first UTMB he was detained at an aid station as race officials didn't believe he could cover the course that quickly. He has done nothing in his career but prove he's very much the athlete who can, and does, produce such credible performances.

The one other ultrarunner whose being subject to accusations of cheating became a badge of honer? The great Yiannis Kouros. His first ultra was Sparatathlon in 1983. He crossed the finish line before anyone anticipated the possibility of a winner. He proceeded to exceed the imagination of everyone that year in one of the most scrutinized body of races in history, and repeated his win in 1984, improving his time by 90 minutes (still standing course record) with a motor escort to ensure he didn't cut the course.

If any accusation of cheating is to be leveled at the race, throw it at the dopers and the organizers. But to baselessly besmirch the fellow who's been as good an ambassador for the sport as one could wish, and routinely puts up world class performances is disgraceful. That's not to suggest he's above critique. I've heard some I consider valid, but nothing that's been remotely discussed here.

mooonshot wrote:

Those shoes are a disadvantage in the mountains and most technical terrain.

It's not Walmsley's fault (although he's not recovered from Western States), but too much foam between the foot and the terrain. No HOKA athlete has ever won a major mountain race like UTMB - it's always Salomon or Asics guys.

Not a great trail shoe. Great for flat dirt running, but get into scree and the skags like Norway and Scotland, you have no chance with that footwear choice.

This is a silly argument. UTMB is usually won by Europeans - home field advantage etc - and European trail runners tend to be sponsored by different brands than Americans.

Also, Hayden Hawks has won the CCC (100km version) on the same trails with HOKA.

SteelTownRunner wrote:

the dopers

Killian?

What about the whole Everest double summit lie? Why anyone have respect for Kilian Jornet at this point doesn't make any sense to me.

What lie? One has to admire how a runner actually can climb the biggest mountains in the world. Jim wouldn't even get up to the base camp with his lack of technical abilities. Kilian is not only a runner, but a professional mountaineer and ski mountaineer and even has done some spectacular, nearly vertical ski lines in the winter.

There are a few important points missing.

Maude tested positive competing at the world champs in ski mountaineering. She came back from her mat leave and doping ban and has been really dominant in mountain running since. It's kinda fishy.

Also, since this was a WMRA world cup race, they are under the IAAF. Not sure about Kilian's shoes, but there would be at least some drug testing a la WADA on top of the Itra Quartz system (which Camille rightly criticizes, it's not going to catch anyone).

This is correct.

But Kilians name is now forever tainted with his weird Mt. Everest summit claims.

KillerKilian wrote:

What lie? One has to admire how a runner actually can climb the biggest mountains in the world. Jim wouldn't even get up to the base camp with his lack of technical abilities. Kilian is not only a runner, but a professional mountaineer and ski mountaineer and even has done some spectacular, nearly vertical ski lines in the winter.

Oh please. Of course Jim would get to Everest base camp. This is just a couple of days hike with altitude acclimation.

And I think I might even have seen some instagram photos of Walmsley climbing somewhere.

Everest is not a difficult mountain to climb other runners and triathletes have done it. Marshall Ulrich comes to mind.

There a video on YouTube right now showing Kilian cutting switchbacks in SZ.

The only problem is that it's LEGAL in Europe and Kilian knows every course cutting trick on that course, much like how Matt Carpenter knew every rock at Pikes Peak.

mooonshot wrote:

There a video on YouTube right now showing Kilian cutting switchbacks in SZ.

The only problem is that it's LEGAL in Europe and Kilian knows every course cutting trick on that course, much like how Matt Carpenter knew every rock at Pikes Peak.

Exactly... many of the mountain races have a check point at the top and one at the end. If you have the muscle strength to go direct then it is fair game. It is up to the runner how they get to the check point.

I do agree with the fact that Hoka’s don’t have the right shoes for extreme trail. Depends on weather but can make a huge difference on descents where you want to be low to the ground. Inov8 mud claw are the go to standard on extreme soft descents and it is easy to take several minutes out of people with hoka’s.

The bigger question is whether rumours around Killian’s former EPO use are true. Spanish distance runners don’t have the best reputation and wouldn’t be surprised if his name is on the operation Puerto list!

mooonshot wrote:

There a video on YouTube right now showing Kilian cutting switchbacks in SZ.

Link?

Either of these two getting invited to pace the GOAT for his sub 2 attempt?

No switchbacks at Sierre-Zinal...

Jobby Jenkins wrote:

The bigger question is whether rumours around Killian’s former EPO use are true. Italian and Spanish distance runners and Tour de France winners don’t have the best reputation and wouldn’t be surprised if his name is on the operation Puerto list!

FIFY.

HolyPrick wrote:

No switchbacks at Sierre-Zinal...

Kinda what I thought.

kilian wrote:

why is wejo and letsrun not putting this story on the front page?

useless website... or interests are not aligned?

just a month ago letsrun was all over walmsley on the 50m record and the WS100. nothing now. on one of the most amazing records and performances by jornet

Because this is LetsRUN, not Letsjog.

Jogging Rules! wrote:

kilian wrote:

why is wejo and letsrun not putting this story on the front page?

useless website... or interests are not aligned?

just a month ago letsrun was all over walmsley on the 50m record and the WS100. nothing now. on one of the most amazing records and performances by jornet

Because this is LetsRUN, not Letsjog.

Adjusting for the grade he's running, it's equivalent of a sub 5:30 mile. And that's not even adjusting for terrain. So yeah, he's not jogging.

Give Kilian Jornet some credit! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRzeLDkWT1c