If he runs 2:12 Im sure he will be disappointed as that workout indicates at LEAST sub 2:11 form.
If he runs 2:12 Im sure he will be disappointed as that workout indicates at LEAST sub 2:11 form.
He will crash and burn. You don' want your best workouts before the race.
you want strong workouts with potential for improvement in the final month or so. This is coaching 101
He doesn't look very efficient in this workout. Good luck if he keeps this pace for the end of the marathon.
Hardloper wrote:
Pete and repeat wrote:
Parker did a similar workout last December in Sacramento, except it was during CIM.
ouch!
Yes, well CIM is deceiving. With the downhills and some who get lucky and run some fast times it seems like it’s an easy course to most people but it’s not (in my opinion). With those rollers, it beats up your legs pretty bad by mile 15-16.
Same ol' Brad.
running commenter wrote:
Pete and repeat wrote:
Parker did a similar workout last December in Sacramento, except it was during CIM.
HAHAHA exactly. Look to see the same mistake happen again. At least this time it's because he'll know he blew his wad during a 35k workout. Remember that Dathan always had great workouts with Hudson, but never typically "raced up" to the hype.
+1
FelonDJT wrote:
Parker Stinson Monster Workout wrote:
Did Parker Stinson just throw down 35k on dirt roads at altitude @ 5:12 pace (source: instagram post by Brad Hudson) That’s only 7k short of of a 2:16 marathon.. Chicago Predictions? He’s clearly fit to run something stupid and maybe tango with the big boys.
How about being consistent w either metric or imperial? Kms or miles. "35km at 5:12/mile pace" is meaningless.
35km @ 3:15/km
21.7 miles at 5:12/mile
Judas F-ing Johnson....
Because while American's (runners at least) are now used to thinking in kilometers (while still internally converted it back to miles in many cases), they still think in terms of mile pace rather than kilometer pace. Saying 3:15 is not as well understood as 5:12.
Yea, we know that 3:00 is fast, because that's 15::00 per 5k (which is under 5:00 pace), but it requires more math convert 3:15...that's 16:15 per 5k. Our pace metric is just not as fine tuned for Kilometer pace as it is for mile pace.
Until we fully switch over to metric that always going to be the case.
800 dude wrote:
No single workout is going to blow your load unless it takes so much out of you that you can hardly run the next week. Short of that, the risks are either (1) having such a workout too close to the peak race so that you're not fully recovered or (2) sustained and chronic overtraining that ultimately suppresses the adaptive response to training. In the latter circumstance, the monster workout can contribute, but it's not the sole cause.
(2a) or (3) A workout this strong at this point indicates he peaks 1-4 weeks prior to the actual race. He can still have a fine race, but being stale will affect the final 10K if no concession is made in early pacing.
I'm not the only one who has seen the body of work from Hudson-coached athletes in the marathon, though most responding to this thread either haven't or have forgotten.
According to this Kipsang does something like this every other Saturday.
anon_hobby_jogger wrote:
He doesn't look very efficient in this workout. Good luck if he keeps this pace for the end of the marathon.
Yeah, Stinson has one of the worst running forms I've ever seen
Lotta haters on here but I want to see Parker do well. It's cool to see one of the few marathoners the US has that can even do this workout doing this workout. No, you cannot compare Parker to Kipchoge but how do you run a fast marathon? By training for a fast marathon. This is so far in advance of Chicago. Kipchoge did a 40km tempo at higher altitude the 10 days before Berlin last year. Many would say that is too much even for the GOAT before a marathon but the guy dropped a 2:03:30. You don't run sub-2:10 without doing hard, long runs, like the one Parker did.
ThatAverageRunner wrote:
running commenter wrote:
Whatever you say, Parker.
0/10
0/10
Parker: 2:08
Farah: 2:09
runnerguy315 wrote:
I am a fan of stinson , and that is a killer workout, but he's not ready to "tango with the big boys" I hope and think he can he run amazing for an American though. (2:10-11)
agree-rooting for him too-not sub 2:10 but he could run close to that, in a big improvement from his last one...he's done quality 10000m times in the past-just a matter of putting it together on the day...
NewtotheSouthSide wrote:
Lotta haters on here but I want to see Parker do well. It's cool to see one of the few marathoners the US has that can even do this workout doing this workout. No, you cannot compare Parker to Kipchoge but how do you run a fast marathon? By training for a fast marathon. This is so far in advance of Chicago. Kipchoge did a 40km tempo at higher altitude the 10 days before Berlin last year. Many would say that is too much even for the GOAT before a marathon but the guy dropped a 2:03:30. You don't run sub-2:10 without doing hard, long runs, like the one Parker did.
Delusional. Too many people give full credibility to how Africans train without due skepticism. And "doing hard, long runs", he may be chasing an illusion (see first point).
I don't hate anyone, except maybe VIPAM but that resembles nausea more than anything like hate. I love to see runners like Stinson push their limits and take chances, get past their comfort zone. Reminds me of guys like Bill Rodgers or Benji Durden. But guys like that didn't care if they ran that for a workout, except to adjust the following workout or two, let alone go around sharing it with anyone and everyone. They simply put it in the log and kept moving. Familiarity breeds contempt, and it's unfortunately a part of human nature to criticize what gets put out in the public sphere. Maybe Stinson will put it together and pace smart this time, if he's a good enough student with a good enough mentor. I know this, he has yet to run faster than a whole lot of guys who don't spend their time trying to impress people via social media networks like Strava and Instagram. That's apparently a thing now, eking out a living seeking attention from people with wood-inducing workouts and how fit and fabulous you look in your workout snaps and vids rather than by accomplishing via impressive performance on the day when it counts the most.
NewtotheSouthSide wrote:
...Kipchoge did a 40km tempo at higher altitude the 10 days before Berlin last year. Many would say that is too much even for the GOAT before a marathon but the guy dropped a 2:03:30. You don't run sub-2:10 without doing hard, long runs, like the one Parker did.
Something to keep in mind though is that the 40 km run Kipchoge did you're referring to was done in 2h15m, which is 5:25/mile pace (or a 2:22 marathon), whereas his marathon pace in Berlin was 4:42/mile. Substantially slower than his marathon pace, even accounting for the altitude.
Someone like Parker running 35 km at 5:12/mile is running very close to his marathon pace (actually faster pace than his 2:18 from CIM, but he blew up and thus I don't think it's accurate to consider him capable of only 2:18), plus the run was at altitude.
My point is that this is a lot more of a stressful workout than Kipchoge's 40 km run, even if we don't take into account Kipchoge's many years of running that have given him a tremendous base (not to mention he's run almost 2 hours flat).
All of that said, I hope Parker does well in Chicago and races as fast as many of us wish he does.
pnw_runner wrote:
NewtotheSouthSide wrote:
...Kipchoge did a 40km tempo at higher altitude the 10 days before Berlin last year. Many would say that is too much even for the GOAT before a marathon but the guy dropped a 2:03:30. You don't run sub-2:10 without doing hard, long runs, like the one Parker did.
Something to keep in mind though is that the 40 km run Kipchoge did you're referring to was done in 2h15m, which is 5:25/mile pace (or a 2:22 marathon), whereas his marathon pace in Berlin was 4:42/mile. Substantially slower than his marathon pace, even accounting for the altitude.
Someone like Parker running 35 km at 5:12/mile is running very close to his marathon pace (actually faster pace than his 2:18 from CIM, but he blew up and thus I don't think it's accurate to consider him capable of only 2:18), plus the run was at altitude.
My point is that this is a lot more of a stressful workout than Kipchoge's 40 km run, even if we don't take into account Kipchoge's many years of running that have given him a tremendous base (not to mention he's run almost 2 hours flat).
All of that said, I hope Parker does well in Chicago and races as fast as many of us wish he does.
This right here. Parker thinks he's doing a "workout" at a pace slower than marathon pace, but in fact he just did 35k at marathon pace or faster. His best performance of this block of training might have been this workout.
Brad being Brad wrote:
pnw_runner wrote:
Something to keep in mind though is that the 40 km run Kipchoge did you're referring to was done in 2h15m, which is 5:25/mile pace (or a 2:22 marathon), whereas his marathon pace in Berlin was 4:42/mile. Substantially slower than his marathon pace, even accounting for the altitude.
Someone like Parker running 35 km at 5:12/mile is running very close to his marathon pace (actually faster pace than his 2:18 from CIM, but he blew up and thus I don't think it's accurate to consider him capable of only 2:18), plus the run was at altitude.
My point is that this is a lot more of a stressful workout than Kipchoge's 40 km run, even if we don't take into account Kipchoge's many years of running that have given him a tremendous base (not to mention he's run almost 2 hours flat).
All of that said, I hope Parker does well in Chicago and races as fast as many of us wish he does.
This right here. Parker thinks he's doing a "workout" at a pace slower than marathon pace, but in fact he just did 35k at marathon pace or faster. His best performance of this block of training might have been this workout.
Or, it might not be. He may have nailed it. Regardless, the weather is going to play the biggest issue in this marathon. Far more than Parker's killer 35K effort.
I was thinking back to a race I ran in 1986, that went poorly. I looked at my records, and found I'd run 10 miles hard the day before. That may have had something to do with it. Then I noticed another race where I set a PR. The day before, I ran harder than my 10 miles, but only ran 8. Go figure.
hardset nipples wrote:
I don't hate anyone, except maybe VIPAM but that resembles nausea more than anything like hate. I love to see runners like Stinson push their limits and take chances, get past their comfort zone. Reminds me of guys like Bill Rodgers or Benji Durden. But guys like that didn't care if they ran that for a workout, except to adjust the following workout or two, let alone go around sharing it with anyone and everyone. They simply put it in the log and kept moving. Familiarity breeds contempt, and it's unfortunately a part of human nature to criticize what gets put out in the public sphere. Maybe Stinson will put it together and pace smart this time, if he's a good enough student with a good enough mentor. I know this, he has yet to run faster than a whole lot of guys who don't spend their time trying to impress people via social media networks like Strava and Instagram. That's apparently a thing now, eking out a living seeking attention from people with wood-inducing workouts and how fit and fabulous you look in your workout snaps and vids rather than by accomplishing via impressive performance on the day when it counts the most.
So you have to pretend that your workouts aren’t cool or exciting to be a serious runner?
Social media is how the sport attracts more youth, especially today, and how the sport will grow in the future. It also has zero bearing on this conversation.
Furthermore, if you’re going to criticize him for his use of Instagram, legitimately call him out rather than just intimating that he’s who you’re mocking when referencing runners “who don’t spend their time trying to impress people.” No point being passive aggressive on LetsRun.
Fingers crossed for sub 2:10 because American distance runners need to be there and I don’t even care who does it as long as Rupp isn’t the ONLY one.