A random side question about bosse, what type of 800 runner is he? 4/8 or 8/15?
A random side question about bosse, what type of 800 runner is he? 4/8 or 8/15?
Ghost, I am French and do not agree with you about Baala and Tahri.
French people/track fan do not really want to know anything about Baala and Tahri and doping, in the same way many british people do not want to know about Radcliffe, Farah, or Froome.
Tahri was expected to join the Lagardere athlete team (private company team) in 2007, but in the end Lagardere retracted the contract because his blood passport was highly suspicious. 2 or 3 years ago his brother, who is close to, was suspended because he escaped from a doping control.
Tahri also spent a lot of time in Kenya. You can believe that it is because of altitude, finding good training partners and so on. I won’t stop thinking that it is also because there are no controls and the drugs are cheap. Same reasons as many Kenyans and athletes from western countries going there.
Baala spent a lot of time training with El Guerrouj and we all know that many athletes training with him were heavily doped. There was/is (?) almost some kind of Moroccan state doping program. I am not saying that Baala is guilty by association, but he is maybe not as white as snow as you say.
So, everybody likes these 2 because they talk nicely, they shake hands of officials, politicians, Baala is at the French Federation, Tahri is on French TV (with Tamgho, a guy who had 3 no-shows for doping control, and was sentenced for beating a woman!) but being nice does not prevent from being hypocrite and cheater.
I guess you (Ghost) speak French, a lot of what I have written above is very easy to find on google.
Francuski atletičar Ambroise Bosse optužio je Amela Tuku za doping.
"Čuo sam tu informaciju i nasmijao se. Mi imamo redovne doping kontrole. U 10 dana u Pekingu, četiri puta sam imao kontrolu. To je sve crno na bijelo. On je razočaran, Francuska ulaže mnogo novca u njega, obećao im je medalju, pa ga nekako razumijem. Ja ću njega opet pozdraviti", izjavio je Amel Tuka.
"I heard this information and laughed. We have regular doping controls. In 10 days in Beijing, four times I was in control. It's all black and white. He is disappointed that France invests a lot of money into it, he promised them a medal, and it somehow understand. I will greet him again, " said Amel Here.
http://ba.n1info.com/a57878/Sport-Klub/Ostali-sportovi/Amel-Tuka-u-Novom-danu-na-N1.html
TrackCoach wrote:
I am not getting into the doping debate on any particular athlete, but the French, Portuguese, Spanish and Turkish nationals from North Africa are all suspicious to me for very obvious reasons.
Name one Portuguese athlete originally from North Africa.
TrackCoach wrote:
North African born European athletes like Reyes Estevez, Sergio Sanchez and Marta Dominguez.
Reyes Estévez was born in Cornellá de Llobregat, Barcelona, Spain.
Sergio Sánchez was born in Ciñera de Gordón, León, Spain.
Marta Domínguez was born in Palencia, Spain.
Are you always such an idiot?
Ghost wrote:
Well, I had doubts about Benoit Zwiechlerski
Well, you assert definitively that Benoit Z. never doped on this thread:
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?board=1&thread=3293098&id=3297635#3297635Pop.e11 wrote:
A random side question about bosse, what type of 800 runner is he? 4/8 or 8/15?
For world class athletes I use three types based on 400 speed:
4/8, sub 46, 1500 over 3:40
8 specialist, 46-47, 1500 usually sub 3:40
8/15, roughly over 47, 1500 sub 3:35
Bosse is what I call a slow 800 specialist, which is essentially 8/15 without the 15. Bosse's official 400 pb is 48.54 (2011, with 1:46.18), but I'd speculate he can get well under 48 now. So he has just enough speed to be competitive at 800, but not enough endurance to be a miler. Either that or he has no interest in training for the 1500. IMO he maxed his potential when running 1:42.5 in Monaco last year. Tuka has better speed than Bosse, with 47.19 a couple of years back (with 1:46.29) and clearly sub 47 ability this year, perhaps 46 low. In addition I believe he would beat Bosse over 1500.
Tuka's progression IS suspect, and it's on the very outer edge of credibility. My point is that what he's done is possible, but not probable. First we would have to assume he is one of the most talented athletes ever for the distance, more talented than Wilfred Bungei for example. Secondly we have to assume his training was, to put it nicely, sub-optimal in previous years. And third I would speculate he could have run under 1:45 in previous years, but wasn't able to get into top class races to aid him. Consider that Tuka was third in the U23 Euro champs in 2013, the year Bosse ran under 1:44, while Tuka's best for the year was in that U23 final, 1:46.29 with 1:45.79 for Bosse in 1st place. So it's not too far fetched to think he could have run faster that year. Consider next for comparison the case of Paul Ereng (Kenya) who came from practically nowhere with under a year of specific training to beat everyone for olympic gold in 1988. If we assume Ereng was clean, extreme talent can sometimes get you far and quick.
But, I confess Tuka's answers are a bit ... not entirely convincing. Still, I don't believe Bosse knows in advance who will get caught or who is doping, so why bother, other than jealousy or making his result look better than it really was?
C'est bien beau ce que vous ecrivez - mais aucune preuve valable. Votre Anglais est impressionant pour un Francais.
Despite what you say no concrete proof against either Baala or Tahri.
Can you provide links to the non contract of Tahri with Lagardere?
Ghost in Khon Khaen, Thailand
Is there a new crop of French talent coming up in mid and long distance to replace Baala and Benabad? Just saw a French girl impress in the 800m semis.
The situation in France is delicate. There are always talented middle and distance runners, but in the last few years less depth. This is a situation common in most of the Euro countries.
Athletics is no longer an attractive option and this is reflected in the falling number of runners in the youth age groups - ages 14 - 18.
On the other hand - the number of veteran runners has increased and some of those guys are very competitive in their age groups.
The French National 10,000 is often won in around 28:45 - 29:00 minutes. The depth is not there, aside from a few, rare individuals. The National title for the marathon is usually won in the 2:20 range.
In Dominique Chauvelier's day there were many runners in the 2:12 - 2:15 range.
Bernard Faure - the superb French commentator in Beijing on TF1 and TF2 is a former 2:14 marathoner, despite having a 10,000 track best of around 29:40.
Ghost in Khon Khaen, Thailand
Salut Ghost,
Here is one link about the story of the suspicious blood results of Tahri.
I post this link rather than any other (but you can easily do your own internet search) because Tahri filed a complaint against the journalist of L’Equipe who revealed the abnormal blood profile, and the journalist was acquitted. You will see that in the trial they did not question whether Tahri was doping or not, but only whether the journalist violated medical confidentiality.
The journalist name is Damien Ressiot. I guess he was doing a pretty good job as a journalist investigating doping, because he is now employed by the police (ou pour être précis, la Gendarmerie), at the OCLAESP department, where they are specifically working on illegal drugs and doping in sports.
http://spe15.fr/damien-ressiot-journaliste-a-lequipe-devient-gendarme-anti-dopage/
And yes, I agree with you there is no definitive proof that the two guys doped. But to me, there are enough points to make them very suspicious, and having good positions at the French TV or T&F Federation does not change anything to that.